China appears to criticize U.S.-South Korean military exercise, sides with Best Korea
86 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Orange_Rain;26333439]The drill should be done another time when tensions have settled. Yes, North Korea shouldn't have bombed South Korea but this isn't the United States fight. It is also not their call to drag everyone into this mess.[/QUOTE]
No, if they step back NK will continue shitting in everyones pocket. But if SK show that they are not afraid, I believe, NK will step back their side. No one want's to die.
But maybe Kim is nuts, that stage when you are not afraid to die and just fucking launch...
[QUOTE=GunFox;26325427]Remind me again why we don't embargo them? They are the most worthless half-assed trade partners imaginable. They design weapons specifically to kill equipment only even fielded by the United States.
[editline]27th November 2010[/editline]
In all fairness NK did SHELL A CITY. Conducting drills in response is restraint defined.[/QUOTE]
They shelled a city because of the drill they did, the mortars landed in the North's waters.
[QUOTE=gudman;26333515]No, if they step back NK will continue shitting in everyones pocket. But if SK show that they are not afraid, I believe, NK will step back their side. No one want's to die.
But maybe Kim is nuts, that stage when you are not afraid to die and just fucking launch...[/QUOTE]
Yeah that's true, they have the tendency to just make a show but the fear in this entire situation is Kim, who with no doubt, is crazy.
[QUOTE=Orange_Rain;26333608]Yeah that's true, they have the tendency to just make a show but the fear in this entire situation is Kim, who with no doubt, is crazy.[/QUOTE]
Yep, and that's why I feel so sorry for the SK gouvernment. Each way you choose, either way you loose.
[QUOTE=IStanI;26333599]They shelled a city because of the drill they did, the mortars landed in the North's waters.[/QUOTE]
Hell yeah, let us support the North Korean propaganda!
Not.
There will be no WW3,just another stupid war,just like the yugoslav wars.With other words,in the end both Koreas will be fucked up or they will become united and communism will fall.
[QUOTE=GunFox;26325376]Hi China, this is the west. We buy most of your stupid shit. Probably best to side with us.[/QUOTE]
Oh boy here we go again with the "CHINA GOTS NO SHIT ON US"
[QUOTE=TheDestroyerOfall;26330539]After some review, Russia and china would be the only two countries that would actually put up a real fight conventionally. to the USA anyways.
If korean war were to start and russia and china joined in, Then we would probably have the EU attack russia's west front while we invaded the east. Then we would move south into china.[/QUOTE]
Question, why the fuck should Europe throw itself into the meat grinder for the US?
[editline]3rd January 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Raiskauskone V2;27177561]Oh boy here we go again with the "CHINA GOTS NO SHIT ON US"[/QUOTE]
China is the industrial might of the world, chances are about 70% or more of your shit has "Made in China" stamped on it somewhere.
[QUOTE=bravehat;27177679]
China is the industrial might of the world, chances are about 70% or more of your shit has "Made in China" stamped on it somewhere.[/QUOTE]
It's more like "Usa got's no shit on China"
[editline]3rd January 2011[/editline]
inb4 boxes
Vietnam 2: This Time It's Personal.
Both of them have their advantages and disadvantages, asian cultures have historically been willing to fight to the very death, taking out as many enemies as they can as they go down as a matter of pride, china has a massive army, with some modern equipment, but the troops to my knowledge have little experience.
Russia would stand a fantastic chance of going toe to toe with America, they have an air force and industry that stands a really good chance at combating western tech, the only thing about Russia is as always their infantry and the like is falling behind in their gear updating.
America, doesn't have much going for it apart from the fact they've been in a lot of wars in the past few decades and frankly should have learned a lot of lessons from them, on the downside the american public is massively casualty averse and seem to think their infantry are invulnerable gods incapable of making butter melt in their mouths.
That turned into a bit of a rant, honestly couldn't care, most thought I've achieved all day so it's staying god damnit! :argh:
Also, invading Russia? Whatever [URL="http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?p=26330539#post26330539"]TheDestroyerOfall[/URL] is smoking, I want some too.
[QUOTE=Raiskauskone V2;27178100]Also, invading Russia? Whatever [URL="http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?p=26330539#post26330539"]TheDestroyerOfall[/URL] is smoking, I want some too.[/QUOTE]
Invading Russia would be like invading a Polar bears ass with a cattle prod.
While the bear is high on PCP.
I'm sure some lucky savvy bastard could pull it off but not without losing a few pints of blood and maybe their pancreas in the process.
woah necrobump
[QUOTE=bravehat;27178030]Both of them have their advantages and disadvantages, asian cultures have historically been willing to fight to the very death, taking out as many enemies as they can as they go down as a matter of pride, china has a massive army, with some modern equipment, but the troops to my knowledge have little experience.
Russia would stand a fantastic chance of going toe to toe with America, they have an air force and industry that stands a really good chance at combating western tech, the only thing about Russia is as always their infantry and the like is falling behind in their gear updating.
America, doesn't have much going for it apart from the fact they've been in a lot of wars in the past few decades and frankly should have learned a lot of lessons from them, on the downside the american public is massively casualty averse and seem to think their infantry are invulnerable gods incapable of making butter melt in their mouths.
That turned into a bit of a rant, honestly couldn't care, most thought I've achieved all day so it's staying god damnit! :argh:[/QUOTE]Russia's got a serious problem with corruption in the military, plus economic problems. They've absolutely got the technological experience to match the US i.e. the industry is there, just needs to be put in full gear like Soviet times, but they need to get their shit in order first. They've also got half the population of the US, though; so that is quite a disadvantage.
There always seems to be issues throughout the world. Not to sound like a hippie from the 70's but, WHY THE FUCK CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG! [b]FUCK[/b]
Dont think too much about the military exercise, the nixon admin. did the same thing back in the 70's when there was a conflict between the north and the south, we're just flexing our muscles to tell north korea to back the fuck off
Drown the OP in boxes for overreacting and making a shitty title.
[QUOTE=Encryption;27178396]There always seems to be issues throughout the world. Not to sound like a hippie from the 70's but, WHY THE FUCK CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG! [b]FUCK[/b][/QUOTE]
first off, because NK, China, and America are so insanely different, none of us could change to get along anyway
[QUOTE=TheDestroyerOfall;26330539]After some review, Russia and china would be the only two countries that would actually put up a real fight conventionally. to the USA anyways.
If korean war were to start and russia and china joined in, Then we would probably have the EU attack russia's west front while we invaded the east. Then we would move south into china.[/QUOTE]
Russia would no way in hell even think about defending north korea and China doesnt care enough about their little tumor to want to help
[editline]3rd January 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Osiris24;27177437]There will be no WW3,just another stupid war,just like the yugoslav wars.With other words,in the end both Koreas will be fucked up or they will become united and communism will fall.[/QUOTE]
1. Communism can't fall when it never rose
2. South korean and chinese corporations have too many investments in North korea for North korea to want to sacrifice that, these military skirmishes are mostly caused by
a. Retarded bigoted north korean zombie soldier who react poorly
b. Kim jong il/kim jong un flexing nuts and trying to remind their own military and their people that nobody wants to fuck with them.
3. China owns north korea. Kim Jong-Il really only has control over the domestic matters and the propaganda. Sure he CAN order the military, but china would really fuck him over.
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;27178369]Russia's got a serious problem with corruption in the military, plus economic problems. They've absolutely got the technological experience to match the US i.e. the industry is there, just needs to be put in full gear like Soviet times, but they need to get their shit in order first. They've also got half the population of the US, though; so that is quite a disadvantage.[/QUOTE]
There's folk storming out of the US army in a big hissy fit over the DADT repeal, its not like they're in a much better situation than Russias army dude, and besides isn't something like 75% of the american population is overweight I think? Can't remember properly but that'll have a pretty nasty effect if there's a war with Russia cause there will end up being a draft probably.
But yeah Russias army ain't great shape but it'll do the job if it has to.
[QUOTE=bravehat;27178539]There's folk storming out of the US army in a big hissy fit over the DADT repeal, its not like they're in a much better situation than Russias army dude, and besides isn't something like 75% of the american population is overweight I think? Can't remember properly but that'll have a pretty nasty effect if there's a war with Russia cause there will end up being a draft probably.
But yeah Russias army ain't great shape but it'll do the job if it has to.[/QUOTE]
russia has 20 mil in the army, the largest army in the world, and the russian leadership has a dont ask dont tell policy when it comes to ethics, so yeah we'd be pretty much fucked
[QUOTE=bravehat;27178539]There's folk storming out of the US army in a big hissy fit over the DADT repeal, its not like they're in a much better situation than Russias army dude, and besides isn't something like 75% of the american population is overweight I think? Can't remember properly but that'll have a pretty nasty effect if there's a war with Russia cause there will end up being a draft probably.
But yeah Russias army ain't great shape but it'll do the job if it has to.[/QUOTE]Obesity is a growing problem in the entire developed world, not just the US; it's currently at around 45% in the US. It's less in Russia, granted, but remember they do have half the population, and a significantly smaller GDP.
Also, there has not yet been an exodus of military personnel, nor do I have any reason to believe there will be. There will always be a couple handfuls of right-wing pricks that'll leave, but there will not be any noticeable reduction in US combat effectiveness. After all, the US government wouldn't have given the go-ahead if there was the chance it would.
[editline]edit[/editline]
GDP figures can be found here from the International Monetary Fund:
[url=http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2010/01/weodata/weorept.aspx?sy=2007&ey=2010&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&c=111&s=NGDPD,NGDPDPC,PPPGDP,PPPPC,LP&grp=0&a=&pr.x=40&pr.y=10]USA[/url]
[url=http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2010/01/weodata/weorept.aspx?sy=2008&ey=2015&scsm=1&ssd=1&sort=country&ds=.&br=1&pr1.x=81&pr1.y=10&c=922&s=NGDPD,NGDPDPC,PPPGDP,PPPPC,LP&grp=0&a=]Russia[/url]
[QUOTE=bravehat;27178030]Both of them have their advantages and disadvantages, asian cultures have historically been willing to fight to the very death, taking out as many enemies as they can as they go down as a matter of pride, china has a massive army, with some modern equipment, but the troops to my knowledge have little experience.[/quote]
I won't say one word about the PLA, but remember how the Reichswehr was basically a puny force designed that it wouldn't conduct any form of aggression? Forward to the Wehrmacht in 1939 and how effective its armored warfare doctrine was against its neighbors; and all done with numerous field exercises and mock battles rather than "hard experience".
[quote]Russia would stand a fantastic chance of going toe to toe with America, they have an air force and industry that stands a really good chance at combating western tech, the only thing about Russia is as always their infantry and the like is falling behind in their gear updating.[/quote]
Really? As of 2011 the Russian Air Force is still a shadow of its Soviet predecessor and still plagued in sorts by Pavel Grachev's post-Cold War decisions. Most of their modern aircraft production has been done for export since the 1990s as they need hard cash more than they need to modernize and replace older aircraft.
Then again air superiority is not an absolute prequesite for victory in a conventional conflict - that stuff only works when the United States is fighting someone completely feckless like Iraq. A Russian victory will depend on the success of its doctrine in strategy and operational-to-tactical level planning, not on a technical measure of how well Russian equipment can stand up with Western equipment in unrealistic qualitative analyses.
As for the infantry, it's not like Russia's going to have to pull out Category C motor rifle units out of its ass to meet a strategic or operational level requirement for correlation of forces. Expect to see Russia deploy its VDV forces and brigade-level tank or motor rifle units as its main ground force in any future conventional conflict.
[quote]America, doesn't have much going for it apart from the fact they've been in a lot of wars in the past few decades and frankly should have learned a lot of lessons from them, on the downside the american public is massively casualty averse and seem to think their infantry are invulnerable gods incapable of making butter melt in their mouths.[/quote]
American public opinion is an extension of how culture plays in the military mindset which shapes how doctrine of an American warfighting character is created, which you can read more about here:
[url]http://www.knox.army.mil/center/ocoa/armormag/backissues/1990s/1998/jf98/1culture.pdf[/url]
[editline]3rd January 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Sgt Doom;27178369]They've also got half the population of the US, though; so that is quite a disadvantage.[/QUOTE]
What kind of scenario are we talking about here that would make the quantity levels of civilians a factor? American intervention via the 82nd Airborne Division/any RDF into a region bordering Russia? Long war of attrition a la WWII?
[QUOTE=Tac Error;27179020]What kind of scenario are we talking about here that would make the quantity levels of civilians a factor? American intervention via the 82nd Airborne Division/any RDF into a region bordering Russia? Long war of attrition a la WWII?[/QUOTE]Nothing like that, I was talking about it as an economic hindrance; though it would pose a military problem in a total war scenario in terms of how many people they could conscript I suppose.
[editline]3rd January 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Jiyoon;27178574]russia has 20 mil in the army, the largest army in the world, and the russian leadership has a dont ask dont tell policy when it comes to ethics, so yeah we'd be pretty much fucked[/QUOTE]Where on earth did you get those figures from? They've got 1 million active personnel, plus a similar number of reserves. 20 million is the number of men who fit the basic requirements for conscription, but that hardly translates directly into troop numbers, nor would they be the largest army even with those.
The PRC has the largest military in terms of personnel numbers, they also would be able to bring in a great deal more conscripts than anyone else in the world. Equipping them and transporting them, however, is a different matter entirely.
Well, i'm signing up at vault-tec... :v:
No one cares.
There will be no war. Putin told me so.
[QUOTE=GunFox;26325376]Hi China, this is the west. We buy most of your stupid shit. Probably best to side with us.[/QUOTE]
If the the US stopped buying the PRC's "shit" the US would collapse (as would the PRC) because they're so dependent on it.
[QUOTE=BCell;26329893]I hate communists. They are so egoistic.[/QUOTE]
China is fucking capitalist and North Korea is "juche" (some say it's communist some say it's not) - a shitty ideology that's far more close to Nazism than communism.
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