• New York Times: Obama Coalition Is Fraying, Poll Finds
    94 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Source;25712099]Theres disagreeing with it then theres just blatantly doing it to be a bunch of dicks the latter of which.....is the republican's[/QUOTE] And the Democrats would be doing the same thing if we were in the opposite situation.
[QUOTE=Meller Yeller;25712135]And the Democrats would be doing the same thing if we were in the opposite situation.[/QUOTE] That makes it somehow better?
[QUOTE=The mouse;25704235]Hurray! Palin will cease power :unsmigghh:[/QUOTE] Fixed for you.
High income tax cuts are the worst idea that I've ever seen, detrimental to economic recovery, and the epitome of Bush-era statistical lobbying and corruption. It's the consumers that buy the products, the corporations that employ, the high incomes that start the corporations. When high income earners aren't taxed, they get all the money -and being completely human - they sit on it, the consumers don't get the products, the rich can hold onto their money rather than spend it on starting new corporations. Instead, the corporations will tailor to another market share - the ones who have the money. It's all a balance. Reagan had the right idea -the right balance, bush threw it completely off balance. All that ultra income tax cuts are going to do is give more money to the rich so they spend as they please. I'm all for more budget cuts, especially with the kind of crazy new-jersey style spending Obama's been doing, but I'm afraid of the other policies that the GOP is going to press. Especially some of ideas of the nutty, misinformed, and quite frankly rather... patronized Tea Party. Like it or not, we require corporations to have a strong economy and a working private sector, but those tend to be GOP strong points so I'm not too worried about them fudging up or lying about that as much as them completely fucking up the system more than it already is. Inflation needs to be controlled as much as employment, so I'm optimistic about a political balance coming that's going to make the necessary compromises, so long as the Republicans hold up to their word. MercZ has the right perspective, the rest of you lot...
I'm sorry that I don't completely agree with your beliefs, that makes me an idiot right? There were better times than this. Taxation is not the solution, taxation is the problem.
Getting rid of taxes doesn't help. having ridiculously high taxes doesn't help(Unless you look at 1950's america, most of the successful "socialist" countries, and a few others). Taxes are incredibly needed because government social programs are incredibly needed.
Thats the problem with party politics like this, anybody who disagrees with one side is automatically labeled wrong. [editline]28th October 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;25712478]Getting rid of taxes doesn't help. having ridiculously high taxes doesn't help(Unless you look at 1950's america, most of the successful "socialist" countries, and a few others). Taxes are incredibly needed because government social programs are incredibly needed.[/QUOTE] What I meant were income taxes were not the solution. People need their money. And when people have a lot of money, they spend it. So therefore make a progressive sales tax, so that through consumption, the government gets taxes.
[QUOTE=Uberman77883;25712482]Thats the problem with party politics like this, anybody who disagrees with one side is automatically labeled wrong. [editline]28th October 2010[/editline] What I meant were income taxes were not the solution. People need their money. And when people have a lot of money, they spend it. So therefore make a progressive sales tax, so that through consumption, the government gets taxes.[/QUOTE] I disagree strongly with "party politics" so I'm with you on that. They do need their money, but they do more often than not simply sit on it when the economy isn't great. They need to be spending that money when the economy isn't great, and they never will. Income taxes play a roll in that by getting that unspent "sitting" money and putting it somewhere in the system. admittedly, the system needs work.
[QUOTE=Uberman77883;25712451]I'm sorry that I don't completely agree with your beliefs, that makes me an idiot right? There were better times than this. Taxation is not the solution, taxation is the problem.[/QUOTE] Right, and allowing the government to waste billions on useless bullshit, pointless construction, defense contracts, earmarks, lobbying, bank bailouts, and worthless social programs is totally going to secure the dollar and decrease the deficit, more so than cutting off the fed's bread baker. Inflation collapse is not pretty. EDIT: Missed earlier post.
[QUOTE=Xen Tricks;25704207]I really doubt there would be a mass, or even significant migration of support to the GOP. I know i'm not exactly happy with the Democrats right now, but the GOP is way, way the greater of two evils.[/QUOTE] Are you a floating voter?
I'm not sure what to think of the situation. Though I can honestly say I don't feel comfortable with more republicans gaining office again. I also laugh at people who think they'll do something about abortion and illegal immigration; Lobbyists will just pay out for there interested parties to keep illegal immigration in and abortion always comes back.
Lol republican obviously wrote this
[QUOTE=Redcow17;25712809]Lol republican obviously wrote this[/QUOTE] lol, Republicans in the New York Times
Dems need to swing back to about where the Republicans were in the 1950's. Raise capital gains to be equal to the income tax rate. Below 30,000 USD a year income, you pay no taxes. If your net total gain in wealth exceeds 500,000 USD a year, it will be taxed to the extent that it stays at 500,000 dollars a year. So either the rich divert existing wealth into other areas, or it gets taken by the government. This basically ensures that the rich cannot become too rich.
Gonna laff when GOP takes control of the house and y'all go apeshit about the world ending. The reality of the situation is the general opinion of this board is now in the minority. You want proof? November 2nd is just around the corner :downs:
[QUOTE=ItchyBarracuda;25713146]Gonna laff when GOP takes control of the house and y'all go apeshit about the world ending. The reality of the situation is the general opinion of this board is now in the minority. You want proof? November 2nd is just around the corner :downs:[/QUOTE] I too will laugh when bad things start happening due to over reactions on all sides.
[QUOTE=Hunt3r.j2;25713095] This basically ensures that the rich cannot become too rich.[/QUOTE] Who are you or the government to decide how much any one person can make? Just because you live on a fixed income and are incapable of creating prosperity and wealth other than maintaining a job doesn't mean other people should be held back because of your inability.
[QUOTE=ItchyBarracuda;25713289]Who are you or the government to decide how much any one person can make? Just because you live on a fixed income and are incapable of creating prosperity and wealth other than maintaining a job doesn't mean other people should be held back because of your inability.[/QUOTE] Clearly all men are islands unto themselves and hold no responsibility for their fellow man. Right? Society is codependent. No one would get rich if there was no society. We all NEED it collectively to get to the places most of want to go. When you get there, you've benefited from the existence of society. Government helps hold that in place. it might seem only natural that taxation acts as the debt to society that you owe, that money then should go back to helping the people. I know this is so morally wrong in your book, and fine, it's "theft" in the loosest term of the word(As in it doesn't even fit) but who are you to say we shouldn't help our fellow man?
[QUOTE=Hunt3r.j2;25713095]If your net total gain in wealth exceeds 500,000 USD a year, it will be taxed to the extent that it stays at 500,000 dollars a year.[/QUOTE] Or they could just slow down production so they don't waste money sending it to the Government. That's a fucking stupid idea.
[QUOTE=BURN DOWN;25707177]They're nothing wrong with blocking something if you disagree with it.[/QUOTE] There's nothing wrong with taking away people's rights to enlist in the army if they're gay. :downs: For those who don't understand, Republicans all voted no on repealing " Don't ask, Don't Tell. "
[QUOTE=ItchyBarracuda;25713146]Gonna laff when GOP takes control of the house and y'all go apeshit about the world ending. The reality of the situation is the general opinion of this board is now in the minority. You want proof? November 2nd is just around the corner :downs:[/QUOTE] why the fuck are you people all obsessed with being the majority. It's like the cornerstone of all republican politics.
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;25714375]why the fuck are you people all obsessed with being the majority. It's like the cornerstone of all republican politics.[/QUOTE] Because when they're the majority in the house, they can just ignore us. When the dems get it, they claim they're ignored but fucks sakes, they just decline any chance or hope of bipartisanship.
[QUOTE=Uberman77883;25707398]Some of the shit congress is pushing through is stupid as shit. Cap and trade, for example. We should be trying to stop corporations from giving off emissions, instead, the government sees this as an opportunity to get more money to spend by having corporations pay fines and literally buy smaller companies "caps" so that the larger factories can increase their emissions.[/QUOTE] You have NO idea what the fuck cap and trade is, do you? [editline]29th October 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Uberman77883;25707513]By 2030? Try 2011. Its already only 1 trillion dollars away from the deficit and the way the government is spending, it will probably exceed that in a year. Which is why we should go 1 year without spending anything, and run the government on 1 trillion dollars. Minimize the size of government to prevent spending, and increase state's power to manage state-side things.[/QUOTE] And just let the economy crumble. great plan! [editline]29th October 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Uberman77883;25709952]Minimize4 federal government by nearly cutting all military spending, cutting spending by 50% or more, and minimize employment and general power the government has. For instance, right now, if the federal government passes a law, they can literally extort the states by imposing a fine because that state will not mandate that federal law. Get rid of that shit. Healthcare will only have a set of standards instituted by the government, but all appropriation will be handled by the states. Education will have a set of governmental standards, but will be instituted by the state. Unemployment benefits should vary by state. Each state should have a militia for itself, while there is a very small standing army arbitrated by the federal government. Eliminate income tax, and institute a progressive sales tax based on the cost of the object being purchased. Taxes will be mandated by the federal government, but 75% of tax money will be given to the state. Also, in the world of foreign affairs, pull out completely or minimize the presence of all US military bases. Basically, just keep some in Europe and South Korea to keep stability. Foreign affairs will be limited to the ability to make treaties. Permanent alliances will be dissolved. No more loans will be taken from other countries. Once we get back on track, focus all efforts on solving domestic issues, and modernizing the country. This is my dream of a perfect America, an America that used to exist, under Thomas Jefferson.[/QUOTE] Thomas Jefferson wanted an equal balance between State and Federal government. You want the articles of confederation + radical You are an idiot, Jefferson was a scholar. [editline]29th October 2010[/editline] Big difference. [editline]29th October 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Ridge;25710335]Nothing to see here. Our Democratic Union is strong. Carry on with your everyday lives, and be sure to get out and vote on November 3rd! [img_thumb]http://img841.imageshack.us/img841/3156/bagdadboblarge.gif[/img_thumb][/QUOTE] You failed in your failure NICE! broski [editline]29th October 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=Uberman77883;25711231]I forgot to include tariffs on trade goods, but that is only common sense. But if we were to implement Jeffersonian ideals today, [B]with a few modifications of course,[/B] would be a model country, that would pioneer the world to the future.[/QUOTE] ok, you see, this is where your opinion falls apart. As demonstrated above, your modifications takes the Jefferson out of Jeffersonian and replaces it with shithouse opinions from uberman
[QUOTE=Jewsus;25707478]The debt is going to exceed the GDP by 2030. So we either need to cut spending drastically, or raise taxes gradually. It looks like this congress couldn't raise taxes (unfortunately). Lets see if Republicans actually cut spending this time. I seriously doubt it, because no Republican President has ever lowered the deficit over the course of their entire term except Eisenhower, who raised taxes and cut spending significantly, and Nixon who did the same. So that's pretty much why I hate Reagan; his economic policy makes no sense and yet we essentially continue to use it.[/QUOTE] Reagan's economic policy worked at the time. The reason the debt was raised during his presidency was excess military spending which perhaps wasn't necessary.
[QUOTE=Strider*;25715403]Reagan's economic policy worked at the time. The reason the debt was raised during his presidency was excess military spending which perhaps wasn't necessary.[/QUOTE] ahahahahaha. Everytime I read "reaganomics works!" a part of me just won't stop laughing.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;25715668]ahahahahaha. Everytime I read "reaganomics works!" a part of me just won't stop laughing.[/QUOTE] Hey if that's what you think I can't change that. Although Aristotle once said "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." How about instead of laughing, questioning and reasoning?
Uh oh polarization.
[QUOTE=Strider*;25715726]Hey if that's what you think I can't change that. Although Aristotle once said "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." How about instead of laughing, questioning and reasoning?[/QUOTE] Because I've never done that? I could never possibly entertain the thought, look at the history of it, learn as much as I can about it, obviously I haven't done that and then formed an opinion, I just hate reaganomics with my genetics. No, I know a lot about it. I've entertained it, and I disagree with it. Aristotle didn't say anything about entertaining it until you accept it.
[QUOTE=Strider*;25715726]Hey if that's what you think I can't change that. Although Aristotle once said "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." How about instead of laughing, questioning and reasoning?[/QUOTE] Reaganomics doesn't deserve to be discussed, it was probably one of the most destructive decisions any modern president ever made
[QUOTE=ZekeTwo;25715799]Reaganomics doesn't deserve to be discussed, it was probably one of the most destructive decisions any modern president ever made[/QUOTE] So you don't think politics need to be discussed? You think that you are the sultan of all great knowledge in the world and you can't possibly be wrong? This is why we need moderation in politics let's debate things and not label them so clearly as right/wrong. As long as people believe two different conclusions about one thing there is room for debate. What's next FDR's social programs "don't deserve to be discussed, they were probably one of the most destructive decisions any modern president ever made"? No. Let's talk about things here I know this is a mostly a democratic favored forum but can we at least talk about things? [editline]29th October 2010[/editline] [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;25715782]Because I've never done that? I could never possibly entertain the thought, look at the history of it, learn as much as I can about it, obviously I haven't done that and then formed an opinion, I just hate reaganomics with my genetics. No, I know a lot about it. I've entertained it, and I disagree with it. Aristotle didn't say anything about entertaining it until you accept it.[/QUOTE] Okay well how about this.. Why do you think Reaganomics didn't work? Do you have any evidence? Or are your thoughts on it all theorized? What were the direct results of Reaganomics which you disagree with? I'm honestly intrigued and I'd like to learn if you can attempt to enlighten.
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