[QUOTE=Skelmech;39214963]of course not?[/QUOTE]
it's a fucking joke
the entire trans thread is here trying to "make their case" against a woman that... made a joke.
Is this the first tranny joke you've ever heard? Are gay jokes off limits? Where's YOUR line (note: it doesn't matter)? As some people may know usually I post on the side of reason while the majority of facepunch whines in women/gay/etc rights SH threads, but this is just absurd. worse than the daniel tosh shit. at least his joke was outright stupid, this joke actually makes sense and has a purpose
edit: note that I think FP's attitude towards trans people is generally disgusting but that's not what this thread is about
[QUOTE=thisispain;39223594]lmao "my verbal battles with 'sanius crew'" get over yourself seriously
we mock the "opposition" because the "opposition" is hilarious and we shake our chubby cheeks with delight every time the "opposition" makes a post
any social stigma you've attained is your own damn fault, not anyone else's[/QUOTE]
Wow you're really conceited and rude
[QUOTE=phygon;39224317]Wow you're really conceited and rude[/QUOTE]
i'm conceited? i'm not the one saying there's a group of people attaching social stigma to me because my opinions take "logic over emotion".
the sanius crew doesn't exist, simski is upset because he said something ridiculous and got flak for it
"flipping the fuck out" because of someone else's posts is absolute bullshit
[QUOTE=halflife_123;39221219]There are some good people out there that simply seek to spread awareness of issues and educate people who do a good job of it. Unfortunately there seem to be just as many who just spew out hate and imply that you're an asshole without actually trying to explain what you might have said/done wrong.[/QUOTE]
it's not the job of minorities to make you feel good about yourself
[QUOTE=thisispain;39224364]i'm conceited? i'm not the one saying there's a group of people attaching social stigma to me because my opinions take "logic over emotion".
the sanius crew doesn't exist, simski is upset because he said something ridiculous and got flak for it[/QUOTE]
i want to find that post where that one dude was all praising the 'sanius crew' of left-wing intellectuals that was a nice change to the usual 'OH NO A THREAD ABOUT WOMEN HERE COMES THE SANIUS CREW'
[QUOTE=Dori;39224429]it's not the job of minorities to make you feel good about yourself[/QUOTE]
I think he's talking about the "social justice warriors" that fight hatred and bigotry with more hatred and bigotry.
He never said that minorities were supposed to make you feel good about yourself.
[QUOTE=phygon;39224535]I think he's talking about the "social justice warriors" that fight hatred and bigotry with more hatred and bigotry.
He never said that minorities were supposed to make you feel good about yourself.[/QUOTE]
not really such a thing to be honest, just a boogeyman bigots invent to justify there awful views
the only "sjw" that are a problem are the ones calling out issues that don't exist (like discrimination against homestuck fans)
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;39224437]i want to find that post where that one dude was all praising the 'sanius crew' of left-wing intellectuals that was a nice change to the usual 'OH NO A THREAD ABOUT WOMEN HERE COMES THE SANIUS CREW'[/QUOTE]
people are so confused we arent intellectuals we sit in steam chat sharing fp posts and jun togawa youtube links
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;39224554]not really such a thing to be honest, just a boogeyman bigots invent to justify there awful views[/QUOTE]
That's not true at all though
They're all over tumblr
[IMG]https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12024286/ahahahahahahaha.PNG[/IMG]
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c45a1WTr-wY[/media]
[editline]15th January 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=phygon;39224630]That's not true at all though
They're all over tumblr
[IMG]https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12024286/ahahahahahahaha.PNG[/IMG][/QUOTE]
read: my post
also good job
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Why reply?" - Megafan))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39224216]it's a fucking joke
the entire trans thread is here trying to "make their case" against a woman that... made a joke.
Is this the first tranny joke you've ever heard? Are gay jokes off limits? Where's YOUR line (note: it doesn't matter)? As some people may know usually I post on the side of reason while the majority of facepunch whines in women/gay/etc rights SH threads, but this is just absurd. worse than the daniel tosh shit. at least his joke was outright stupid, this joke actually makes sense and has a purpose
edit: note that I think FP's attitude towards trans people is generally disgusting but that's not what this thread is about[/QUOTE]
what in the fuck are you talking about? how was the article in the op a joke?
Well, the article is down. Where is the freedom of speech and press anymore? I don't care if people say dumb things. People should have the right to say whatever they want, regardless if their statement is stupid, ignorant, or above all, offensive. Even if somebody is discriminating against another group, they should be able to speak, type, write, etc. their mind, as long as their actions do not oppress others.
[QUOTE=DeathFang;39224811]Well, the article is down. Where is the freedom of speech and press anymore? I don't care if people say dumb things. People should have the right to say whatever they want, regardless if their statement is stupid, ignorant, or above all, offensive. Even if somebody is discriminating against another group, they should be able to speak, type, write, etc. their mind, as long as their actions do not oppress others.[/QUOTE]
the article didn't meet the criteria of standards the guardian has set. she can still put her hate speech up on a blog or some shit noones stopping her from doing that
wow this thread sure took a while to turn to shit, i'm impressed
[QUOTE=DeathFang;39224811]Well, the article is down. Where is the freedom of speech and press anymore? I don't care if people say dumb things. People should have the right to say whatever they want, regardless if their statement is stupid, ignorant, or above all, offensive. Even if somebody is discriminating against another group, they should be able to speak, type, write, etc. their mind, as long as their actions do not oppress others.[/QUOTE]
The company probably removed it because they don't want hatespeech on their website
[QUOTE=DeathFang;39224811]Well, the article is down. Where is the freedom of speech and press anymore? I don't care if people say dumb things. People should have the right to say whatever they want, regardless if their statement is stupid, ignorant, or above all, offensive. Even if somebody is discriminating against another group, they should be able to speak, type, write, etc. their mind, as long as their actions do not oppress others.[/QUOTE]
They have the right to allow or deny whatever they want on their website.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;39224765]what in the fuck are you talking about? how was the article in the op a joke?[/QUOTE]
the woman made a joke. the writer of the article is a different story, but the comment that the trans "community" initially got upset about was a joke
[QUOTE=Lord of Ears;39224889]wow this thread sure took a while to turn to shit, i'm impressed[/QUOTE]
And it finally went bad around the end of page 6.
[QUOTE=DeathFang;39224811]as long as their actions do not oppress others.[/QUOTE]
You know fun fact, but it's women like this that made it so almost [b]NO[/b] insurance companies would provide health insurance to trans people (up until the ACA now has forced them to). So yes, her, and women like her's actions are both oppressing and harming us.
And besides, "Freedom of Speech" only applies to the government, not private publishing firms that don't wish to have blatant [b]hate speech[/b] on their website.
As well, "Freedom of Speech" [b]DOES NOT[/b] equal "Freedom from Criticism". If you say shitty things, you can't be mad when people are angry and complain about you saying them.
[QUOTE=thisispain;39223594]lmao "my verbal battles with 'sanius crew'" get over yourself seriously
we mock the "opposition" because the "opposition" is hilarious and we shake our chubby cheeks with delight every time the "opposition" makes a post
any social stigma you've attained is your own damn fault, not anyone else's[/QUOTE]
This post was so fucking predictable.
In response to Dori, phygon, Lachz0r etc
I wasn't specifically referring to minorities. Anyone who is aware of issues in the world can do a good or bad job of raising more awareness, whether they are minorities or not. 'Social justice' does exist, many people behind those blogs and websites do nothing to raise awareness and simply insult other people for shits and giggles. There are also a number of blogs/sites that would come under a different term, not 'social justice' but what you might describe as 'issue awareness' or a similar term. They seek to make people aware of issues and injustices without insulting people.
Social justice is a bit of a joke really, especially on Tumblr. It gives Tumblr a bad name but I guess there are sections of any internet community that embarrass the rest of it. Look far enough and you will not only find social justice blogs, but anti social justice and anti-anti social justice blogs. I am not even kidding.
[QUOTE=QueenSasha24;39226385]As well, "Freedom of Speech" [b]DOES NOT[/b] equal "Freedom from Criticism". If you say shitty things, you can't be mad when people are angry and complain about you saying them.[/QUOTE]
Actually yes you can, because freedom of speech.
[QUOTE=-Get_A_Life-;39227242]Actually yes you can, because freedom of speech.[/QUOTE]
Freedom of speech does not cover hate speech in a lot of places.
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39224216] As some people may know usually I post on the side of reason[/QUOTE]Ahaha, good one.
[QUOTE=halflife_123;39227407]Freedom of speech does not cover hate speech in a lot of places.[/QUOTE]
Most people view that as a violation of freedom of speech.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;39224765]what in the fuck are you talking about? how was the article in the op a joke?[/QUOTE]
I think it didn't reference the original commentary, but the situation that occured prior to it.
A woman said that women want to have the figure of a brazilian tranny pornstar. As an joke more or less, popculture if you wish.
And was than fairly brutally harassed by members of the tran community, if we're to believe the commentary.
With that in mind, I can fully understand why the commentary was penned up. It could have been worded a lot better, a lot less emotionally but one can understand what led to it getting written in the first place. In a sense I can actually appreciate the reasoning as a law student a lot more. Since ever since I've sat in a few courts I noticed a somewhat sad trend.
People who were disadvantaged against, will very often do some very nasty harassing and feel that they are exempt from any follow up due to the fact that they were disadvantaged against. It doesn't help that in a lot of cases courts did aproach the problematic like that as well, but that has been gradually changing.
One can actually see the whole thing in how the line check your privilege is used. It's generally no longer merely used in unrelated fields, but whenever it's used, it's used against any slight, perceived or real, that often has nothing to do with the fact that the person is a minority.
[QUOTE=-Get_A_Life-;39227242]Actually yes you can, because freedom of speech.[/QUOTE]
The UK does not have unlimited freedom of speech, on top of that in every nation freedom of speech is only legally guaranteed in public spaces. A website of a newspaper is not public space but private space. And said newspaper can decide what they allow and what they do not. For the same reason mods here have freedom to ban you or censor a post you make how they deem fit. There's also a code of ethics most news abide by and a lot of other things. Generally speaking a government will not be able to censor the newspaper, but in most western nations, most news censor themselves.
On top of that, even if freedom of speech would apply in this case (which does not due to private space), freedom of speech does not grant immunity from criticism. As criticism by itself falls under freedom of speech as well. Generally speaking, a critic saying his criticism in a public space will actually have more freedom to deliver said criticism than the person saying the thing in a private space.
What freedom of speech grants you are essentially two things in public space.
a) the certainty of being legally allowed to say what you are saying without prosecution. (again important to differentiate between absolute and relative freedom nations here)
b) the guarantee that you will not be blocked from saying what you are saying (again the same difference to observe)
As criticism happens ex post, neither things that the freedom grants you is affected.
That's not the same as saying though, that the criticism is warranted or unwarrented. But that's a different matter altogether and has nothing to do with the law.
[QUOTE=Paramud;39227789]Most people view that as a violation of freedom of speech.[/QUOTE]
Yes and no. In the US perhaps, but in a lot of other nations this is not the case. It got a bit shafted due to how american teens love to throw the phrase around on the internet, which led to a lot of teens actually getting the US understanding of the phrase.
The funny thing is, the american understanding is also often wrong, as they believe it actually works even in private spaces.
I actually wish we had unlimited amount of freedom of speech.
Perhaps I've been spoiled by 4chan, but I still think the best way to handle intolerance is to be able to confront people with such opinions directly, and be able to discuss it with them and like-minded people even if the chance of them listening might in theory not be worth the effort you put into the explanation.
There is after all a saying we oldfags usually have about 4chan, and especially /b/ since that's where most people start put. /b/ used to be populated by smart people acting retarded, but now it's populated by retarded people acting like retarded people acting smart.
[QUOTE=DeathFang;39224811]Well, the article is down. Where is the freedom of speech and press anymore? I don't care if people say dumb things. People should have the right to say whatever they want, regardless if their statement is stupid, ignorant, or above all, offensive. Even if somebody is discriminating against another group, they should be able to speak, type, write, etc. their mind, as long as their actions do not oppress others.[/QUOTE]
Um how about no. Hate speech should not be something you can freely express as a professional in the news media.
[editline]15th January 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=RoadOfGirl;39225630]the woman made a joke. the writer of the article is a different story, but the comment that the trans "community" initially got upset about was a joke[/QUOTE]
Ok someone has to say it. I don't care anymore.
Shut up. The article was not a "super intellectual joke." It was hate speech and bigotry. Stop being dumb.
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