• John Demjanjuk guilty of Nazi death camp murders
    191 replies, posted
[QUOTE=DogGunn;29787077] you've got to be fucking kidding? are you actually accusing the court of fabricating evidence to seal a conviction?[/QUOTE] yes i fucking am, wanna fight about it?
[QUOTE=Cuntsman;29778477]So murder is okay just because he did it a long time ago?[/QUOTE] It's been almost 70 years, it doesn't even matter anymore. And why put him in jail anyway? it's not like he's going to go out stabbing people. [QUOTE=DogGunn;29787077] you've got to be fucking kidding? are you actually accusing the court of fabricating evidence to seal a conviction?[/QUOTE] Wouldn't be the first time when the court was wrong
ridiculous. Forgive and Forget. It only was 70 years ago.
It honrdylu totally mystifies me how FP is generally pretty ruthless on issues like the death penalty, sentencing for minors, shooting burglars, etc, but thinks a mass murderer should be let off...because he's old. Even my most bleeding-heart liberal, pro-prison-reform, anti-capital punishment, pro-rehabilitation friends see no problem with this whole thing, and I've talked to a fair few about it. [editline]13th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=TH89;29791453]honrdylu[/QUOTE] That was supposed to say "honestly" by the way. Apparently not looking at the keyboard = typing in Na'vi.
[QUOTE=Lord of Ears;29790459]yes i fucking am, wanna fight about it?[/QUOTE] lol [editline]13th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Raiskauskone V2;29791398]Wouldn't be the first time when the court was wrong[/QUOTE] wrong is one thing. accusing them of making up evidence is another. regardless, no one is questioning the conviction. rather why they go to all the effort to prosecute him. and if you're asking that question, you should ask yourself: why should we be forgiving for mass murder? [editline]13th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=The Baconator;29791406]ridiculous. Forgive and Forget. It only was 70 years ago.[/QUOTE] can't tell if this is sarcastic or not.
[QUOTE=TH89;29791453]It honrdylu totally mystifies me how FP is generally pretty ruthless on issues like the death penalty, sentencing for minors, shooting burglars, etc, but thinks a mass murderer should be let off...because he's old.[/QUOTE] Mass murderer? He was a red army soldier that was captured by the Germans and forced to work there as a prison guard. It nevers says that he actually killed any of those people himself.
[QUOTE=CertainDOOM;29791689]Mass murderer? He was a red army soldier that was captured by the Germans and forced to work there as a prison guard. It nevers says that he actually shot any of those people himself.[/QUOTE] [quote]A German court has found John Demjanjuk guilty of helping to murder more than 28,000 Jews at a Nazi death camp in World War II. He was sentenced to five years in prison, one year less than prosecutors had asked for, but will be released pending a possible appeal. Prosecutors said the Ukraine-born Demjanjuk, 91, was a guard at Sobibor camp in Nazi-occupied Poland in 1943. He denied serving as a guard, saying he was a prisoner of war and a victim too. Lawyers for Demjanjuk have said they will appeal against the conviction. "The court is convinced that the defendant... served as a guard at Sobibor from 27 March 1943 to mid-September 1943," presiding Judge Ralph Alt said. "As guard he took part in the murder of at least 28,000 people," he said. An estimated 250,000 people died in the gas chambers at Sobibor. Demjanjuk was convicted of being an accessory to the murder of the 28,060 people who were killed there while he was a guard. [/quote]
Once again, it doesn't say he killed anyone himself. Actually no, i guess that depends on how you interpret "As guard he took part in the murder of at least 28,000 people,". I thought of it as "You were affiliated with the camp, so you were part of the murder."
[QUOTE=CertainDOOM;29791729]Once again, it doesn't say he shot anyone himself.[/QUOTE] "As guard he took part in the murder of at least 28,000 people," gas chambers
Just so everyone knows you are not conscripted into the SS it is an elite military unit that you have to join. This guy knew exactly what he was doing. Fuck him.
[QUOTE=Mudbone;29791853]Just so everyone knows you are not conscripted into the SS it is an elite military unit that you have to join. This guy knew exactly what he was doing. Fuck him.[/QUOTE] Actually, there were some people conscripted into the waffen SS. But i don't know about the SS-totenkopfverbände, who were responsible for the deathcamps.
[QUOTE=CertainDOOM;29791729]Once again, it doesn't say he killed anyone himself. Actually no, i guess that depends on how you interpret "As guard he took part in the murder of at least 28,000 people,". I thought of it as "You were affiliated with the camp, so you were part of the murder."[/QUOTE] Yeah but if you go on street with friend and put knife through someones head you both would be jailed unless your friend rats out on you fast.
That's dumb as shit, you don't prosecute 91 year olds.
[QUOTE=aydin690;29792093]That's dumb as shit, you don't prosecute 91 year olds.[/QUOTE] yes you do. [editline]13th May 2011[/editline] unless you can give a logical reason why you wouldn't
Jews vs The Rest of Facepunch: The Thread
[QUOTE=TH89;29792193]Jews vs The Rest of Facepunch: The Thread[/QUOTE] Basically yeah. Weird how people favor Nazi SS than jews
[QUOTE=Rares;29778397]Might as well start charging the cashiers in the cases of people vs. McDonalds. Not the same thing, i'm aware but still.[/QUOTE] theres a difference between nazi death camps n mcdonalds
[QUOTE=Rares;29778397]Not the same thing, i'm aware but still.[/QUOTE] I really like how you placed that comma. Subtly ruining the context of the sentence. But really, I'd say leave the man alone. He's 91, and by now, he must have regretted his actions if he had anything to do with the events. Besides, what's there to gain for anyone? If they absolutely feel a need to throw him in the slammer, then make him serve in an open prison.
[QUOTE=DasherDigital;29792249]But really, I'd say leave the man alone. He's 91, and by now, he must have regretted his actions if he had anything to do with the events. Besides, what's there to gain for anyone? If they absolutely feel a need to throw him in the slammer, then make him serve in an open prison.[/QUOTE] Because his feeling of regret is enough to satisfy the idea that "it's not okay to murder 28 thousand people". I hate how many people are suggesting that we should let him be. It's not logical, fair or rational. If you're suggesting it for his old age, you should be focusing on the sentencing rather than the conviction. And regardless, he's most likely never going to go to prison because of his old age.
[QUOTE=arleitiss;29792231]Basically yeah. Weird how people favor Nazi SS than jews[/QUOTE] "What the Nazis did was wrong but they sure did have great discipline and a really cool fashion sense! Anyway this poor guy was just doing his job, and also he's old, like a grandparent! Leave him alone!" [editline]13th May 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=DasherDigital;29792249]But really, I'd say leave the man alone. He's 91, and by now, he must have regretted his actions if he had anything to do with the events. Besides, what's there to gain for anyone? If they absolutely feel a need to throw him in the slammer, then make him serve in an open prison.[/QUOTE] What is to gain is to reinforce the perception that you can't just commit crimes against humanity and then go chill in South America until you die of old age. That just because they make the law difficult to enforce doesn't mean it won't be enforced. That's sort of one of the fundamental principles of modern justice systems.
War is hell.
These kind of trials are pointless, if he was forced into labour what's the fuckin point.
[QUOTE=amgoz1;29792786]These kind of trials are pointless, if he was forced into labour what's the fuckin point.[/QUOTE] No they're not, and no he wasn't,
I like how Soviet and Western Allied war crimes almost completely unpunished yet if there was a guy that had any affiliation with anyone that had anything to do with the holocaust, people will spend years hunting them down. Apparently nobody cares about the mass rape commited upon the people of Berlin.
Really? Why don't we punish the U.S. government for nuking 225,000 innocent civilians while we're at it? :downs:
[QUOTE=Communist Nigga;29795280]Really? Why don't we punish the U.S. government for nuking 225,000 innocent civilians while we're at it? :downs:[/QUOTE] they would've if the Japanese won sadly that's how it works. regardless, justice shouldn't be based off "well they did more than me, so i don't deserve to be charged"
[QUOTE=DogGunn;29795294]they would've if the Japanese won sadly that's how it works. regardless, justice shouldn't be based off "well they did more than me, so i don't deserve to be charged"[/QUOTE] It's bullshit though. Both sides should be charged. U.S. fucked up, Russia fucked up, Germany fucked up. All three did major crimes, but only Germany gets bashed.
[QUOTE=Communist Nigga;29795305]It's bullshit though. Both sides should be charged. U.S. fucked up, Russia fucked up, Germany fucked up. All three did major crimes, but only Germany gets bashed.[/QUOTE] yes i agree, people from all sides should be held accountable to variable degrees - but by that post before, are you suggesting that the conviction is bad? if so, why?
[QUOTE=DogGunn;29795324]yes i agree, people from all sides should be held accountable to variable degrees - but by that post before, are you suggesting that the conviction is bad? if so, why?[/QUOTE] At some point, I do. It was war, it happened in war. You don't really get the option to disobey your orders. As you can see, he was a guard, he didn't take a major role in the executions. He was captured by the Germans and forced into the army. He would probably get executed if he didn't obey the orders, so I can pretty much guess how he felt. I would do the same. Not to mention that he wasn't German, I'm sure that the Nazis disliked him for that too.
[QUOTE=DogGunn;29779051]yeah the original article says it: Judge Alt said he had ordered that Demjanjuk should be freed during his appeal as he did not pose a flight risk because of his advanced age, poor health and the fact that he was stateless following his expulsion from the US, where after the war he worked in an Ohio car factory and became an American citizen.[/QUOTE] advanced age always makes a word that means old man sound cool lol
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