U.S. unemployment is down. Consumer confidence is up. Inflation is low. Yet many Americans feel the
135 replies, posted
[QUOTE=adamsz;46322527]If I had the money and wasn't so passionate about U.S. History, I'd move my whole family to Europe. Some European countries actually have a system where a college education won't destroy your life savings. But I'm sure its no rose garden there either.[/QUOTE]
Here in Denmark you get 6 years of SU (simply "Government Support" directly translated. This means that you around ~$1000 a month for going to university, which is free in itself. Depending on where you live, you can survive on this without working on the side. If you want to live in the middle of Copenhagen, you kind of have to work on the side to make do, but compared to the US it seems like a walk in the park.
Mostly you'll be within cycling distance of your university, so transportation in itself will largely be free. If you live two people in an apartment, you can generally get the rates down to about ~$600 per person, which leaves some room for food and other stuff. If you go to one of the smaller cities (Odense for example), you can live quite easily only on SU iirc.
[QUOTE=Miskav;46321325]Business economics. I've been trying to get hired for almost a year, and no, I can't do internships. I'm doing multiple part-time jobs just so I don't lose my apartment, if I do an internship for "experience" I'll lose my apartment and end up on the streets.
I love how everyone seems to say "Do internships to get experience" Yeah, that's fucking dandy if you live with your parents, but beyond that it's not possible.[/QUOTE]
Internships aren't a viable solution unless you have a trust fund or still live with your parents. That's why I don't ever suggest internships.
You have to find a starter job that's related to your degree in some way. With a business economics degree, I would probably start as some form of administrative assistant, estimator, or even as a store manager. You still have to work your way up from the bottom with a degree, you're just able to go higher on the ladder than others.
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;46326867]Internships aren't a viable solution unless you have a trust fund or still live with your parents. That's why I don't ever suggest internships.
You have to find a starter job that's related to your degree in some way. With a business economics degree, I would probably start as some form of administrative assistant, estimator, or even as a store manager. You still have to work your way up from the bottom with a degree, you're just able to go higher on the ladder than others.[/QUOTE]
I don't know how it is for the USA, but in Germany interns get paid money for working. Enough money to live comfortable. At least it was that way for me, in the field of automation/electronics
[QUOTE=Impact1986;46326885]I don't know how it is for the USA, but in Germany interns get paid money for working. Enough money to live comfortable. At least it was that way for me, in the field of automation/electronics[/QUOTE]
There are paid internships, and they can be a fasttrack into your career, but there aren't many.
[B]THIS IS INFO ABOUT ARGENTINA, IF ANYONE IS INTERESTED OR FINDS IT USEFUL, THEN I SUGGEST READING IT.
[/B]
[QUOTE=Metalcastr;46320361]I don't know anyone who still thinks that they're going to be receiving high salary right out of college. Granted it did happen to someone I know, making over $70k right out of the gate. But that's exceedingly rare. The problem is a lack of upward mobility all over the place, so no way to move up and earn more money. Companies want 4-year expensive-ass degrees, years of experience, and still pay peanuts. Nobody's going to spend money if they don't have it...[/QUOTE]
Well,
[B]It totally depends on the person and the contacts he makes. Really.
[/B]
Here in Argentina, technical-education speaking, the best colleges are the Universidad de Buenos Aires (UBA). Public. 100% Free. And one of the best, if not the best, in many fields.
Then there's the ITBA. [URL="http://www.itba.edu.ar/"]Instituto Tecnologico de Buenos Aires.[/URL] Which (I have 3 friends in it) is QUITE, VERY QUITE expensive.[B][I] Its MONTHLY fee can get as high as 8000 pesos per month. At the market exhange rate, that's 500 dollars per month.[/I][/B]. And whoever thinks that they will give you a degree just for paying is E-X-T-R-E-M-E-L-Y wrong. Being accepted into it takes 6 months, and during those months you STILL HAVE to pay. And damn, the amount of stuff given to you is top stuff. My friends just gave the final exam to get into it 3-4 months ago and they had to read half [B]CALCULUS [/B]by[B] TOM APOSTOL.[/B]
Then you can (IF you can) finish the career in 5 years.
[I]Just to get into.[/I]
Do....do you understand what that means?
The [URL="http://www.uba.ar/"]UBA[/URL] doesn't have a SAT or whatever to get into. You have to spend a whole year doing the CBC (Ciclo comun basico- Common Basic Cycle) which is...well, BASICALLY, last high school year all over again. It is done so as to "level" everybody's knowledge and continue with the career.
Engineering takes as much as 6 years (1 CBC year + 5 of the career)
Here comes the financial and business part.
The ITBA is heavily sponsored (As so is the [URL="http://www.utdt.edu/"]UTDT [/URL]- Di Tella, where I'm pursuing a lic. in Econ) by national companies and multi nationals.
Name it, you got it in the ITBA. Microsoft. Google. WV. BMW. Telmex. TECHINT. Chevron. YPF. AEG. Etc etc.
They are doing meetings and conferences all the time. Last time I heard, top guys from Google Argentina went and gave a talk about leadership in a IT oriented business.
And the UBA...meh, its the UBA. They aren't doing that all the time. I've got more than 20 friends and known persons in it and I haven't heard about a single conference/talk/meeting EVER.
[B]TO GIVE YOU AN IDEA:[/B]Min wage in Argentina is around 3000 pesos per month. For one guy, to cover all needs and live decently, he has to make around 7000-8000 per month. 50% of households make less than 9000 per month. In the other 50%, less than 5% (!) makes more than 23.000. The average inside that 5%, being 50.000 (!) (Source: Apertura Magazine. October issue)
A chemical engineer graduated from the UBA who has worked in YPF for 4-5 years earns 10.000 per month. And damn, did he have to find his job searching a lot!
And the chemical engineer graduated from the ITBA, just like that (Literally, take into companies by companies themselves)[B] makes -wait for it- more than 30.000 pesos. The average for these guys is between 45.000 and 50.000.[/B]. [I][U][B]That means, that a single guy, is getting enough money to cover all the needs of a 4 person family AND to spend on himself AND to save.[/B][/U][/I]
And damn, I'm talking about your run of the mill average guy who doesn't give a fuck about experience or is not visionary enough to invest in himself by taking leadership courses, having worked in partial time jobs during college, etc etc, because those guys...those guys are making it big in the first year after having graduated.
Example? UTDT (Di Tella). Girl in Business Economy (Mix of Adm and Econ) assisted the whole college to the Financial Club, which is totally non-obligatory and open to any career.
JP Morgan had some guys in Argentina, who in turn contacted the director of the financial club to recommend anyone...this girl knew english, attended all meetings and participated in the Annual Stock Trading tournament...she got recommended.
Result?
First after year being graduated: Sent by JP Morgan to New York. Free english courses in NY. Salary that surely exceeds the 100k pesos per month.
Tl, dr: Seems that things are totally different in Argentina. And with less money than in US or Europe, you can get a better future. With what someone pays per month in US for college, that person can easily live and study in Argentina.
Personal hope: To do an exchange with the University of Econ in Warsaw, Poland and to be taken into KPMG/Kroll/FTI.
[QUOTE=JohnFisher89;46307657]I have college experience just no degree(like 30 or 40 credit hours?), fought for internships, then worked my way up and changed jobs for more raises and networked with people at other companies for higher pay.
But hey try it your way.[/QUOTE]
think about it like this:
the internships that you yourself got are internships that somebody else [I]didn't[/I] get, despite trying to get them.
sure, [I]anyone[/I] can make it, but by no considerable measure can [I]everyone[/I] make it. there's only so much room in certain classes, dictated by larger socioeconomic conditions.
the right would do itself a favor if it made an effort push forth policy providing free education on how to persevere in a tough job market instead of callously (and occasionally spitefully) dumping the blame on people who are uninformed.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.