Upside-down US flag T-shirt upsets Memorial Day shoppers
141 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Govna;47802669]What's hard to understand? It's a symbol, like all flags are, and it has meaning, like all symbols do.
Also, what kind of schools did you people go to that forced you to "salute" the flag when saying the Pledge of Allegiance? I went to a public school in Missouri, and we only ever said the pledge on Monday (or whenever our week began when holidays and faculty days happened), and we never saluted it; we just put our right hand over our heart while saying the pledge.
I never had an issue with any of this stuff-- again, in Missouri, in a shitsplat Bible-beating bumfuck town with 20ish churches and Christian worship centers of various sizes and denominations-- and most of us in the class just didn't care at the time that we had to do it. We just did it, started the day/school week, and never cared. I have no idea if the teachers cared or not, but they had us do it anyway.
What's the issue here exactly? The only thing about the pledge I really didn't like and still do not like is the "under God" part.[/QUOTE]
Of the four schools I've went to in my life post-preschool, all four forced the kids to do it daily each morning. Two of them had the "god bless our flag" bit. And this wasn't some backwoods-ass part of the country either, this was a river-side South Jersey suburb right on the outskirts of Philadelphia.
[QUOTE=Govna;47802669]What's hard to understand? It's a symbol, like all flags are, and it has meaning, like all symbols do.
Also, what kind of schools did you people go to that forced you to "salute" the flag when saying the Pledge of Allegiance? I went to a public school in Missouri, and we only ever said the pledge on Monday (or whenever our week began when holidays and faculty days happened), and we never saluted it; we just put our right hand over our heart while saying the pledge.
I never had an issue with any of this stuff-- again, in Missouri, in a shitsplat Bible-beating bumfuck town with 20ish churches and Christian worship centers of various sizes and denominations-- and most of us in the class just didn't care at the time that we had to do it. We just did it, started the day/school week, and never cared. I have no idea if the teachers cared or not, but they had us do it anyway.
What's the issue here exactly? The only thing about the pledge I really didn't like and still do not like is the "under God" part.
[editline]25th May 2015[/editline]
Also, how is any of this on the level of North Korean nationalism/Nazi-German nationalism lol? Overreact more, why don't you.[/QUOTE]
putting your hand on your heart is a form of salute
dunno, we pledged allegiance every day but in junior year of high school, which was the last time i actually ever did the pledge, i usually just stood up and went 'ababababababab' to myself and nobody seemed to care. usually the teacher would have us all stand but he never made us recite the pledge if we didn't want to
[QUOTE=VinLAURiA;47802685]Of the four schools I've went to in my life post-preschool, all four forced the kids to do it daily each morning. Two of them had the "god bless our flag" bit. And this wasn't some backwoods-ass part of the country either, this was a river-side South Jersey suburb right on the outskirts of Philadelphia.[/QUOTE]
Yeah all but one of the 5 school I went to had the god bless our flag. It was also absolutely mandatory at all but the last one. Granted, all the first 4 were either in northern michigan, indiana, or a very wealthy conservative town, so take that as you will.
hell, when he pledged he always omitted the 'under god" part and he didn't get any flak for it but that might just be because he was an AP english teacher and most of the kids who would be sitting near him wouldn't mind something like that so who knows
I'd buy one. a fucking shirt shouldnt piss so many people off in the first place even if its 'disrespectful'. im tired of people getting offended about everything these days tbh
[QUOTE=Swebonny;47802663]People getting upset about a freaking flag being turned upside down is almost like Muslims getting upset about drawings of Mohammed.[/QUOTE]
(extremely american voice) noo it's completely different. muslims are idiots whereas people should be yelled at for taking this piece of material with no inherent worth other than that which we ourselves place in it and turning it upside down
[QUOTE=gastyne;47802650]Is that a law or flag code?
Because the flag code is not law...[/QUOTE]
Also, it's a pattern on clothing, not an actual US Flag. What the tshirt is made up of, the actual materials, is not something that at one point in time was a flag either.
also I was going to post that I wouldn't care if someone turned my flag upside down but then realised that both the union flag and st. georges cross are the same both ways. the US really missed a trick there.
but also you could burn both of 'em and I wouldn't care, unless it was my flag in which case I'd be like "hey asshole stop burning my stuff", but that'd be highly unlikely since I don't own a flag
Actually the Union flag, when upside down, is different than it is normally (Presuming it's an actual flag rather than just the pattern, as you can turn the pattern upside down and then flip it, to get it back to the right pattern)
[QUOTE=gastyne;47802650]Is that a law or flag code?
Because the flag code is not law...[/QUOTE]
sorry, didn't mean to imply it was illegal, just pointing out where Ekalektik's idea stemmed from
The High School in my town lets you decide if you want to pledge, or just sit and mind your own business. Also, I don't think an outrage is necessary for a simple shirt, but this is Memorial Day, when you're supposed to honor those who died trying to protect "that flag," and displaying as such is pretty disrespectful, at least today.
lmao at the kids in this thread still salty as fuck about having to say the pledge of allegiance in grade school.
[QUOTE=evlbzltyr;47802726](extremely american voice) noo it's completely different. muslims are idiots whereas people should be yelled at for taking this piece of material with no inherent worth other than that which we ourselves place in it and turning it upside down[/QUOTE]
Both cases are stupid from an objective perspective, but at the same time people are entitled to their beliefs so long as they don't unduly encroach on others'. The only difference is the extremist Muslims who go out and hurt/kill people over it draws more attention, and more pushback.
*sigh* Glenn Beck didn't die for this bullshit....
[QUOTE=lope;47802806]The High School in my town lets you decide if you want to pledge, or just sit and mind your own business. Also, I don't think an outrage is necessary for a simple shirt, but this is Memorial Day, when you're supposed to honor those who died trying to protect "that flag," and displaying as such is pretty disrespectful, at least today.[/QUOTE]
Yeah they died for their right, partly to protest.
Which is actually what that shirt represents.
So saying they should not have this shirt goes against what people fought and died for doesn't it?
[QUOTE=Swebonny;47802663]People getting upset about a freaking flag being turned upside down is almost like Muslims getting upset about drawings of Mohammed.[/QUOTE]
If you think about it it's surprisingly similar.
[QUOTE=Zadrave;47802598]I was never forced to pledge except in middle school. High school though they let you sit quietly.[/QUOTE]
it's illegal in all schools for a student to be forced to stand for the pledge
North Korea style indoctrination? Holy shit you guys can be children.
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;47802696]putting your hand on your heart is a form of salute[/QUOTE]
Yeah, just as a sign of respect, but the way people are talking about it here, they make it sound like it was a militarized phenomenon reminiscent of the Hitler Youth they were taking part in.
Which for them, maybe it was wherever they went to school at. I don't know. All I know is the way we did it, it wasn't this way, and it wasn't a big deal to us, and I think it's safe to assume nobody in my school ever had a serious problem with it or had this much resentment about it. Nobody bothered complaining to the faculty about it while I was there at least.
Were the teachers and administrators dicks about making you all say it or something?
[editline]25 May 2015[/editline]
Again, my perception on this issue is limited. The school I went to was a pretty decent public school in a town of maybe 6,000 people. Size definitely makes a difference on how people behave. I never had problems with any of this; what problems I did have were limited to other kids being dicks about religion (my family never went to church like everyone else did) and sports (we didn't give a fuck about sports either; we were basically cityfolk through and through and didn't care about any of the typical small town stuff the locals' lives hinged on).
[editline]25 May 2015[/editline]
I'm sorry if you all had teachers and administrators that were this jackassed about this stuff. I really am. Encouraging basic civic nationalism is fine as far as I'm concerned, but getting cruel and hateful about it in the process and ridiculously strict about it isn't okay.
[QUOTE=xalener;47802532]"God bless our flag" SEE, this is the shit that pisses me the FUCK OFF.
All it does is trivialize all the horrible and awesome events that made America come to be. God bless the flag? What about the fucking PEOPLE?
I don't believe in any god, but if you did, why? why this?
Why fucking this?[/QUOTE]
The flag is a symbol of the nation and the people in it, dick
Calling the pledge indoctrination is overly dramatic, but that doesn't make it any less superfluous. It doesn't cause ridiculous fanatic behavior, but it certainly can contribute to it.
[QUOTE=TheTalon;47802611]Our public schools really do have some [B]North Korean level of nationalism[/B] going on. Every single morning, of every single day, of every single year, (About 2,300 times total) I had to stand up, put my hand on my heart, face the flag, and recite the pledge of allegiance.[/QUOTE]
LMAO.
wtf is the big deal with saying the pledge of allegiance? it's only 20 seconds out of your day, and throwing a fit over it is just ridiculous. i can get maybe being upset about the "under god" part, but that's it.
[quote=TheTalon;47802611]This country and its patriotism is over the top and misplaced. There's no reason to be proud to be American. Land of the incarcerated, and greedy where Money trumps everything. Change the stars to dollar signs on our flag then the pledge of allegiance would make much more sense[/quote]
ok...
[QUOTE=Al Bundy;47802534]We're literally taught from the day we walk in to school to stand up, salute, and pledge allegiance to a flag every single school day from our first to our last. Its pretty fucked up. I have seen students get reprimanded for refusing to do it. We're basically taught to worship the damn thing.[/QUOTE]
We never do that at my school. And I live in the Central Valley.
Welcome to the land of the free and the easily offended.
[QUOTE=TheWhiteFox1;47802935]
wtf is the big deal with saying the pledge of allegiance? it's only 20 seconds out of your day, and throwing a fit over it is just ridiculous.[/QUOTE]
I predict someone will say that cumulatively the 20 seconds add up to days of our lives over the course of a school career
As if they wouldn't have wasted those 20 seconds doing something else
[QUOTE=V12US;47802954]Welcome to the land of the free and the easily offended.[/QUOTE]
It's my right to be offended!
The fact that kids are taught to say a pledge of allegiance to the country every day in the US is pretty fucking creepy tbh
Even if you're allowed to sit through it, just the fact that you do it at all
[QUOTE=Swiket;47802844]*sigh* Glenn Beck didn't die for this bullshit....[/QUOTE]
Oh fuck for a moment there I thought he actually died lol
[t]http://i.imgur.com/CPA4tc0.jpg[/t]
ban this sick filth [img]http://fi.somethingawful.com/images/smilies/emot-britain.gif[/img]
[QUOTE=Eric95;47802977]The fact that kids are taught to say a pledge of allegiance to the country every day in the US is pretty fucking creepy tbh
Even if you're allowed to sit through it, just the fact that you do it at all[/QUOTE]
What's the issue with it? its part of our culture and a pretty harmless part.
[editline]25th May 2015[/editline]
[QUOTE=OutspokenGolf;47802981][t]http://i.imgur.com/CPA4tc0.jpg[/t]
ban this sick filth [img]http://fi.somethingawful.com/images/smilies/emot-britain.gif[/img][/QUOTE]
Hey that Union Jack is upside down!!!!!!
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