Valve: "We don't have any plans to change after EU Court Ruling" - Polidicks

[QUOTE=parket;36723317]tough shit thats business[/QUOTE] Not always Tough shit and not always the fault of the developer. Good for consumer =/= good for industry, and if valve does have to follow this ruling, then it's going to be bad for all consumers because they'll probably lessen or even get rid of sales, either because they have to, to keep making money, or because the publishers of the games tell Valve they can't sell them at sale prices, and thats at best, at worse is regional locking, even worse than it is now, that publishers may introduce to basically not let the EU buy a whole bunch of games from Steam. Thats not good for the consumer, and thats not good for the industry.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723327]you are a REALLY bad poster[/QUOTE] hey no need for this we're trying to have an intellectual discussion, if you don't understand what's going on just dont post

You're arguing over the fact that you can't trade or sell a license you don't own, I don't see much of an intellectual discussion coming from you.

[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;36723335]That's what the transfer fee is for.[/QUOTE] Hardly makes up for it, lets say a game is resold at $15, valve would get approx 75cents from that. Which isn't a whole lot.

[QUOTE=parket;36723317]tough shit thats business[/QUOTE] wow congratulations you made a really stupid post. give me a second to elaborate on why; you think the developer means absolutely nothing and that the consumers should handle distribution amongst themselves congratulations, this ideal knocked away the development of sequels and even future IPs due to poor revenue to the developers and publishers, causing them to move onto a different title and eventually shut down, if not right away if they're a smaller company. a+ thinking.

[QUOTE=RayvenQ;36723359]Not always Tough shit and not always the fault of the developer. Good for consumer =/= good for industry, and if valve does have to follow this ruling, then it's going to be bad for all consumers because they'll probably lessen or even get rid of sales, either because they have to, to keep making money, or because the publishers of the games tell Valve they can't sell them at sale prices, and thats at best, at worse is regional locking, even worse than it is now, that publishers may introduce to basically not let the EU buy a whole bunch of games from Steam. Thats not good for the consumer, and thats not good for the industry.[/QUOTE] lol all they need to do is take a cut of the resale, i mean what is the argument for piracy? it's not a loss cause they weren't going to buy it in the first place? this probably means that it'll be a substantial gain for the companies

[QUOTE=BlkDucky;36722370]I'm completely cool with not being able to resell my steam games if I can still get these 75% off sales. Because I'm pretty sure they won't happen otherwise.[/QUOTE] This is the same logic that console developers use to say they should get a cut in used games sales or used games cant be resold at all. In other words, stupid bullshit spewed from the mouths of greedy cunts.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723373]You're arguing over the fact that you can't trade or sell a license you don't own, I don't see much of an intellectual discussion coming from you.[/QUOTE] well this ruling says I do own it and I can sell it, I don't see your problem

[QUOTE=parket;36723388]lol all they need to do is take a cut of the resale, i mean what is the argument for piracy? it's not a loss cause they weren't going to buy it in the first place? this probably means that it'll be a substantial gain for the companies[/QUOTE] do you even know how steam works you don't properly own any of the games on your account, you're leasing the account with access to the certain games you pay for, you're under valve's jurisdiction and EU laws on License trade wont change that because Valve doesn't sell licenses. [editline]11th July 2012[/editline] This ruling doesn't say that at all, it says that if you DO own a license you can sell it, it doesn't say "oh you rented a movie from netflix? YOU OWN IT NOW RESELL"

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723320]jesus fucking christ Valve is leasing you the account and you're basically renting the games onto that account for an indeterminate amount of time, you don't own your steam games at all so you're not going to be able to trade them to people.[/QUOTE]Uhh, learn what a license is?

Of course they are not going to do anything as it is a bit hard to apply European law in the USA. Now they are probably going to wait until the first court case over it (like everyone else) then make the decision on what to do but they in the end can only apply it to their games and nothing else. All the other games will need their publishers to allow this.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723410]do you even know how steam works you don't properly own any of the games on your account, you're leasing the account with access to the certain games you pay for, you're under valve's jurisdiction and EU laws on License trade wont change that because Valve doesn't sell licenses.[/QUOTE] you do realize they have an entire section of their ToS detailing the terms of the licenses you buy to use the software don't you

[QUOTE=Ybbats;36723434]Uhh, learn what a license is?[/QUOTE] the leased account is essentially enabled access to certain titles once you pay for them, this does not mean you own the license to the game at all, it means you are capable of accessing it. these are different things. it states "Valve hereby grants, and you accept, a limited, terminable, non-exclusive license and right to use the Software for your personal use in accordance with this Agreement and the Subscription Terms. The Software is licensed, not sold. Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software." which is basically the same thing, you don't own a license game, you own a license to access it which is hardly even a license.

I know what a License is, but Valve's system is pretty fucking fool proof. It doesn't need to follow this law because they're not technically transferring the full license because the account is still theirs, and they're loaning it to you until you get banned.

I would love to see the responses in this thread if you changed the words "Valve" to "EA" and "Steam" to "Origin".

"Valve hereby grants, and you accept, a limited, terminable, non-exclusive license and right to use the Software for your personal use in accordance with this Agreement and the Subscription Terms. The Software is licensed, not sold. Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software."

[QUOTE=parket;36723446]you do realize they have an entire section of their ToS detailing the terms of the licenses you buy to use the software don't you[/QUOTE] you do realize that you don't own your steam account right, that's why at any point in time you can get it taken away in an instant, and you can't file suits over theft because you lost all the games you paid for. [editline]11th July 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=parket;36723460]"Valve hereby grants, and you accept, a limited, terminable, non-exclusive license and right to use the Software for your personal use in accordance with this Agreement and the Subscription Terms. The Software is licensed, not sold. Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software."[/QUOTE] "Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software." good fucking job contradicting yourself moron [editline]11th July 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=ketchup v2;36723458]I would love to see the responses in this thread if you changed the words "Valve" to "EA" and "Steam" to "Origin".[/QUOTE] I'd be arguing the same fact, because it's the same exact deal

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723479]you do realize that you don't own your steam account right, that's why at any point in time you can get it taken away in an instant, and you can't file suits over theft because you lost all the games you paid for. [editline]11th July 2012[/editline] "Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software." good fucking job contradicting yourself moron[/QUOTE] i'm not though because this ruling says despite the ToS I own the license, lmao there's nothing to discuss here, by enforcing that part of their ToS they're making themselves prone to legal repercussions in the EU

[QUOTE=parket;36723490]i'm not though because this ruling says despite the ToS I own the license, lmao[/QUOTE] god damn I'm so sick and tired of you going 'lol' and 'lmao' as if it adds to your argument at all, it makes you look like an entitled piece of shit.

"a limited, terminable, non-exclusive license" "Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software." "No title or OWNERSHIP in the Software" NO TITLE OR [B]OWNERSHIP[/B] I swear you are retarded or something

[QUOTE=Character;36723506]god damn I'm so sick and tired of you going 'lol' and 'lmao' as if it adds to your argument at all, it makes you look like an entitled piece of shit.[/QUOTE] lmao ur fuckign retarded

[QUOTE=RayvenQ;36723379]Hardly makes up for it, lets say a game is resold at $15, valve would get approx 75cents from that. Which isn't a whole lot.[/QUOTE] Well it's doesn't necessarily have to be 5%, I was using that as an example. You could set a definitive percent or you could have the percentage fluctuate depending on how much it is being sold for.

[QUOTE=parket;36723490]i'm not though because this ruling says despite the ToS I own the license, lmao there's nothing to discuss here, by enforcing that part of their ToS they're making themselves prone to legal repercussions in the EU[/QUOTE] kk i guess i can move to europe and sell movies i rent from redbox now? thanks for telling

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723517]"a limited, terminable, non-exclusive license" "Your license confers no title or ownership in the Software." "No title or OWNERSHIP in the Software" NO TITLE OR [B]OWNERSHIP[/B] I swear you are retarded or something[/QUOTE] this ruling nullifies that, this is not hard to comprehend

[QUOTE=parket;36723532]this ruling nullifies that, this is not hard to comprehend[/QUOTE] then what are you selling if the license states you don't own anything?

[QUOTE=parket;36723490]i'm not though because this ruling says despite the ToS I own the license, lmao there's nothing to discuss here, by enforcing that part of their ToS they're making themselves prone to legal repercussions in the EU[/QUOTE] [quote]Vote Up 3 July 2012 1 week 1 day ago Story by: Dan Griliopoulos Comments 1 Court of Justice of the European Union rules This is incredible; the Court of Justice of the European Union has just published a ruling stating that [B]creators of software[/B] cannot [B]oppose the re-sale of that software[/B][/quote] Valve isn't the creator of the software, it's the retailer, the only licence you could own, was the licence to use the Steam Client (and not your Account, because the account isn't actually software), the ruling wouldn't apply to them. At best, all you'd be able to do is sell your full account to another person, not individual titles. Although, infact, this would seem to imply that they can't stop you from selling the [B]Steam client[/B], which is free anyway. Your account isn't software, it's basically a free subscription.

No, this ruling doesn't, this ruling says that any license that you DO own FULLY is resellable with no problems no questions asked. it doesn't say anywhere that you own things you rent.

[QUOTE=No Party Hats;36723530]kk i guess i can move to europe and sell movies i rent from redbox now? thanks for telling[/QUOTE] well unless movies are all of a sudden software no you cant moron

i swear being this idiotic should be fucking bannable [editline]11th July 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=parket;36723564]well unless movies are all of a sudden software no you cant moron[/QUOTE] this just in video files aren't software guys, we've got a fucking genious

[QUOTE=RayvenQ;36723552]Valve isn't the creator of the software, it's the retailer, the only licence you could own, was the licence to use the Steam Client (and not your Account, because the account isn't actually software), the ruling wouldn't apply to them. At best, all you'd be able to do is sell your full account to another person, not individual titles. Although, infact, this would seem to imply that they can't stop you from selling the [B]Steam client[/B], which is free anyway.[/QUOTE] “Where the copyright holder makes available to his customer a copy – tangible or intangible – and at the same time concludes, in return form payment of a fee, a licence agreement granting the customer the right to use that copy for an unlimited period, that rightholder sells the copy to the customer and thus exhausts his exclusive distribution right. Such a transaction involves a transfer of the right of ownership of the copy. Therefore, even if the licence prohibits a further transfer, the rightholder can no longer oppose the resale of that copy.” rightholder in this case is obviously steam