• German Transgendered girl Alex, has been institutionalized.
    301 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291040]Surely you agree that the multitudes of surgeries to change a 50 yo male (for example), inclluding for example electrolysis over much of the body, peeling back the face and shaving the skull down to a more feminine shape/size, and of course, inversion of the penis, are less ideal than an effective, hypothetical, safe gender identity therapy?[/QUOTE] Well, you'd have to go back and [I]retroactively change how the brain develops[/I] (because surely you're aware that male and female brains develop different) and such a thing seems, y'know, kind of impossible and/or inhumane. [editline]25th March 2012[/editline] And at the very least, more difficult.
[QUOTE=SgtCr4zyGunz;35289289]Yeah and the Holocaust pales in comparison to racism. First of all, many, many gay and trans people have been KILLED for being gay/trans, so it's a pretty big problem. Secondly, why would it even matter? Point is, people are still being hurt so don't try to downplay what they go through.[/QUOTE] Can't argue with that.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291040]Why am I saying this? I get mysellf into so much shit.[/QUOTE] Yeah, why [I]are[/I] you saying this? What point exactly are you trying to make? What injustice are you trying to combat? Think carefully.
[QUOTE=Herb;35290842]Understatement of the year. Transgender people in the United States face a 1 in 12 chance of being murdered.[/QUOTE] No offense, but I really would like a source on this information.
[QUOTE=Turnips5;35291260]Yeah, why [I]are[/I] you saying this? What point exactly are you trying to make? What injustice are you trying to combat? Think carefully.[/QUOTE] I don't see why I should not contribute to the conversation. It's just sometimes I get into some shit, whether or not I am in the wrong. [editline]25th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Ray-The-Sun;35291153]Well, you'd have to go back and [I]retroactively change how the brain develops[/I] (because surely you're aware that male and female brains develop different) and such a thing seems, y'know, kind of impossible and/or inhumane. [editline]25th March 2012[/editline] And at the very least, more difficult.[/QUOTE] I didn't really put that into consideration, as such my idea becomes less feasible, yet I continue to contend that WERE it possiblle it might be more ideal.
i don't really think altering someone's fundamental identity is ideal under any circumstances
[QUOTE=Jetblack357;35291279]No offense, but I really would like a source on this information.[/QUOTE] It comes from a statement released by the Human Rights Campaign, circa 2008. However, the original article (normally found [URL="http://www.hrc.org/issues/1508.htm"]here[/URL]) seems to be missing. In it, they cited [I]Kay Brown, instructor for “20th Century Transgender History and Experience” at the Harvey Milk Institute in San Francisco, Washington Blade, Dec. 10, 1999 [/I] as their source.
[QUOTE=HighdefGE;35289447]Or maybe the father is the good parent here trying to fight for his son's right for treatment? It's funny how some refer to me and others that we're simply "dictating his life" while at the same time, you're stuffing the kid with ideas that could [i]permanently[/i] affect his life.[/QUOTE] His [i]daughter[/i] doesn't need to be institutionalized for who she is. Trying to make someone into something they're not is dictating their life and that's what this father, and that court, are doing. Parents are supposed to (for the most part) accept their children for who they are, not make them be whoever they want.
[QUOTE=Lazor;35291486]i don't really think altering someone's fundamental identity is ideal under any circumstances[/QUOTE] So we resort to inverting the penis, shaving the skull to be smaller (which was a tremendously painful procedure iirc) , electrolysis, hormone repllacement, voice training, et cetera The alternative isn't so hot either. Furthermore the specific example I brought up was a 50yo male who recently came to terms with his (current) identity. Presumably he has a wife and kids, who might not necessarily take the whole swap very well.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291967]So we resort to inverting the penis, shaving the skull to be smaller (which was a tremendously painful procedure iirc) , electrolysis, hormone repllacement, voice training, et cetera [/QUOTE] It's easier for the body to recover from a sex change than it is for the mind to recover from brainwashing.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291967]The alternative isn't so hot either. Furthermore the specific example I brought up was a 50yo male who recently came to terms with his (current) identity. Presumably he has a wife and kids, who might not necessarily take the whole swap very well.[/QUOTE] Didn't that story specifically say the family was alright with it? Also that's just all the more reason to get it done sooner.
[QUOTE=Herb;35290842]Understatement of the year. Transgender people in the United States face a 1 in 12 chance of being murdered.[/QUOTE] Isn't that the case for every minority in the US anyway ? Maybe not up to this point but in general ?
[QUOTE=Ganerumo;35292438]Maybe not up to this point but in general ?[/QUOTE] I [I]think[/I] the point here is that it [I]is[/I] up to that point.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291967]So we resort to inverting the penis, shaving the skull to be smaller (which was a tremendously painful procedure iirc) , electrolysis, hormone replacement, voice training, et cetera[/QUOTE] The difference being that the operation is actually demanded by the person who receives it, while brainwashes are being forced upon. It's much easier to go through a hard operation when you absolutely want to make it through and see the results than to be forcedly brainwashed and be forced to deny your own identity against your will. [editline]25th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Ray-The-Sun;35292474]I [I]think[/I] the point here is that it [I]is[/I] up to that point.[/QUOTE] Yeah I know but if every minority in the US is threatened by death all the time, it's not exactly their vision of transgenders that's the issue, it's their entire education.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291967]So we resort to inverting the penis, shaving the skull to be smaller (which was a tremendously painful procedure iirc) , electrolysis, hormone repllacement, voice training, et cetera The alternative isn't so hot either. Furthermore the specific example I brought up was a 50yo male who recently came to terms with his (current) identity. Presumably he has a wife and kids, who might not necessarily take the whole swap very well.[/QUOTE] have you even talked to a single trans* person about this
[quote=thelocal.de]Klaus Beier, professor of psychotherapy and sexual medicine at Berlin’s Charité hospital, believes it is irresponsible to give a child medication to prevent puberty developing naturally. [/quote] [url=http://www.thelocal.de/society/20120210-40647.html]from here[/url] Which goes against all established treatments for transgendered chilldren. Also please note, again from the charite, a paper again going against all current established knowledge and treatments: [url]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2697020/[/url] (summary is them saying should wait till after puberty) Yes this place is absurd.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291967]So we resort to inverting the penis, shaving the skull to be smaller (which was a tremendously painful procedure iirc) , electrolysis, hormone repllacement, voice training, et cetera The alternative isn't so hot either. Furthermore the specific example I brought up was a 50yo male who recently came to terms with his (current) identity. Presumably he has a wife and kids, who might not necessarily take the whole swap very well.[/QUOTE] you don't need to do GRS to transition, a lot of people choose not to. Electrolysis isn't mandatory either, and not exclusive to transwomen at all never even heard of skull shaving before, seems pretty drastic and rare outside of that, I don't see what's so bad or desperate or whatever about growing breasts and being happy with yourself? especially at a younger age so you have less regrets before making the needlessly huge step of transitioning?
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35291967]So we resort to inverting the penis, shaving the skull to be smaller (which was a tremendously painful procedure iirc) , electrolysis, hormone repllacement, voice training, et cetera The alternative isn't so hot either. Furthermore the specific example I brought up was a 50yo male who recently came to terms with his (current) identity. Presumably he has a wife and kids, who might not necessarily take the whole swap very well.[/QUOTE] Do you realize that a majority of transgirls JUST do hormones and MAYBE Facial Feminization Surgery. sometimes SRS? You're trying to say-without-saying "I don't like this and i think its weird!" like you were a few threads before, i think maybe even the last one, by pretending its a horribly painful thing.
[QUOTE=Jetblack357;35288150]Racism has caused the enslaving and killing thousands of human beings. While yes, people are assholes to gays and transgenders, I still think their problems pale in comparison to what racism has caused.[/QUOTE] Are you fucking kidding me? People get [B]KILLED[/B] just by being transgender just like they do for being gay or another race. It's called bigotry/intolerance. [editline]25th March 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=HighdefGE;35289447]Or maybe the father is the good parent here trying to fight for his son's right for treatment? It's funny how some refer to me and others that we're simply "dictating his life" while at the same time, you're stuffing the kid with ideas that could [I]permanently[/I] affect his life.[/QUOTE] What the fuck are you on? You can't change their gender identity. You're just being extremely rude and ignorant.
Coming into these transgender threads is always like stumbling into some weird parallel universe
[QUOTE=RobbL;35294821]Coming into these transgender threads is always like stumbling into some weird parallel universe[/QUOTE] Oh, [URL="http://www.facepunch.com/threads/1?p=34808168&viewfull=1#post34808168"]I remember you[/URL].
[QUOTE=Ray-The-Sun;35294840]Oh, [URL="http://www.facepunch.com/threads/1?p=34808168&viewfull=1#post34808168"]I remember you[/URL].[/QUOTE] Yeah that's why I tried to avoid taking part in this thread. Don't want to risk getting carried away again :v: Although, I was suffering from insomnia at the time so that might explain my dickish behaviour
I feel so bad for him. That's awful.
[QUOTE=Red Toaster;35295048]I feel so bad for him. That's awful.[/QUOTE] Her* It even says she's a girl in the title.
[QUOTE=HighdefGE;35289447]Or maybe the father is the good parent here trying to fight for his son's right for treatment? It's funny how some refer to me and others that we're simply "dictating his life" while at the same time, you're stuffing the kid with ideas that could [i]permanently[/i] affect his life.[/QUOTE] Now here sits somebody with an open mind, I can feel the draught from here.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;35294551]Do you realize that a majority of transgirls JUST do hormones and MAYBE Facial Feminization Surgery. sometimes SRS? You're trying to say-without-saying "I don't like this and i think its weird!" like you were a few threads before, i think maybe even the last one, by pretending its a horribly painful thing.[/QUOTE] Oh shut up. I'm saying that there might be a better alternative, and that they don't necessarily do all-of-the-above treatments doesn't change that.
[QUOTE=Elecbullet;35295135]Oh shut up. I'm saying that there might be a better alternative, and that they don't necessarily do all-of-the-above treatments doesn't change that.[/QUOTE] For someone who is adamant on keeping their gender identity there is no better alternative.
[QUOTE=Boxbot219;35295069]Her* It even says she's a girl in the title.[/QUOTE] It's a transgender boy, no? The pronouns don't matter.
[QUOTE=Red Toaster;35295309]It's a transgender boy, no? The pronouns don't matter.[/QUOTE] She is a transgender girl, Male TO Female, and pronouns matter out of common courtesy.
NINJA'd [QUOTE=Red Toaster;35295309]It's a transgender boy, no? The pronouns don't matter.[/QUOTE] A transgender girl.
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