• Poll: Nearly half of Iowan Republicans don't believe Obama was born here
    130 replies, posted
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;29349677]all societies are just large webs person-to-person perspectives [editline]22nd April 2011[/editline] language is transitory but not so transitory that it is meaningless. transitory means that it changes over time, but it still has, within each group that is aware of it's existence, a generally accepted meaning at any given moment of time. faggot meant something different a long time ago and it will probably mean something different in the future, but currently, at this moment in the year of our lord 2011, it is a hateful word and so, until it transitions to a non-hateful word, you shouldn't use it unless you're ok with people rightfully assuming that you're hateful [editline]22nd April 2011[/editline] sure. maybe you should not go around calling people sluts and retards because i'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed to do that, i'm just saying you shouldn't expect people to not make judgments about you for it[/QUOTE] It can't transition if it can't be used, if you can't let me use it to change its meaning it'll forever be stuck in that position. Your horror and hatred of the word generate the shock value that make the word so powerful, not any ingrained sort of meaning. You're basically dictating a circular set of pretenses around the evolution of a word, it's got to be used to change, and you have to realize that. I personally almost never hear it with any sort of homophobia tied to it, maybe that's because I live in a hugely pro-gay city, but who knows.
[QUOTE=Aman V;29325292]They can obviously, its just that to be the president of the United States you HAVE to be born in the U.S.[/QUOTE] No you don't. However, you do have to have been born to at least one parent who holds citizenship with the USA.
The worst part about this birther shit is that it doesn't solve anyone's problems. Ordinary Americans want jobs, they want the defecit to be cut... they aren't getting what they want because of petty ideological bullshit. When the fuck will people just say 'enough is enough'?
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;29350312]Your horror and hatred of the word generate the shock value that make the word so powerful, not any ingrained sort of meaning.[/QUOTE] But why would I respond negatively to the word if it didn't have any meaning? I didn't toss darts at a dictionary to choose words to dislike. Saying "just stop being offended" is a shallow way to look at it. I'm offended for a good reason: [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;29350312]it's got to be used to change, and you have to realize that.[/QUOTE] it won't change in any meaningful way by casually throwing it around. up until the 1960's people in the deep south threw the word 'nigger' around like it was nothing. people who weren't actually racist used it because it was just part of their vocabulary. it was part of colloquialisms. you've probably got an elderly relative who grew up calling brazil nuts 'nigger toes'. But it's still a hateful word today because saturating an environment with a word doesn't make the word lose meaning, it just legitimizes the the mentality behind the word. [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;29350312]I personally almost never hear it with any sort of homophobia tied to it,[/QUOTE] because: [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;29350312]maybe that's because I live in a hugely pro-gay city, but who knows.[/QUOTE] homophobia and gay bashing are still widespread in most parts of the country. that's the problem. just because you don't see it as having any meaning doesn't mean everybody else does. do you realize how some homosexual teenager sees it, someone who's been harassed, possibly attacked because their peers have labeled them as a faggot? You can talk in ideals about the transitive nature of language all you want but for the people around you who you are interacting with the has real meaning. using a homophobic slur won't make the word any better, it will just convince the people who are constantly hearing the word and the children who grow up hearing it that homophobia is ok
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;29350643]But why would I respond negatively to the word if it didn't have any meaning? I didn't toss darts at a dictionary to choose words to dislike. Saying "just stop being offended" is a shallow way to look at it. I'm offended for a good reason: it won't change in any meaningful way by casually throwing it around. up until the 1960's people in the deep south threw the word 'nigger' around like it was nothing. people who weren't actually racist used it because it was just part of their vocabulary. it was part of colloquialisms. you've probably got an elderly relative who grew up calling brazil nuts 'nigger toes'. But it's still a hateful word today because saturating an environment with a word doesn't make the word lose meaning, it just legitimizes the the mentality behind the word. because: homophobia and gay bashing are still widespread in most parts of the country. that's the problem. just because you don't see it as having any meaning doesn't mean everybody else does. do you realize how some homosexual teenager sees it, someone who's been harassed, possibly attacked because their peers have labeled them as a faggot? You can talk in ideals about the transitive nature of language all you want but for the people around you who you are interacting with the has real meaning. using a homophobic slur won't make the word any better, it will just convince the people who are constantly hearing the word and the children who grow up hearing it that homophobia is ok[/QUOTE] Considering i'm of mixed sexuality myself, it doesn't alleviate any use of the word but I know how it feels to be a bullied teenager in highschool hearing that word. Still doesn't even slightly change my opinion on the word.
but still [QUOTE=SigmaLambda;29350643] it won't change in any meaningful way by casually throwing it around. up until the 1960's people in the deep south threw the word 'nigger' around like it was nothing. people who weren't actually racist used it because it was just part of their vocabulary. it was part of colloquialisms. you've probably got an elderly relative who grew up calling brazil nuts 'nigger toes'. But it's still a hateful word today because saturating an environment with a word doesn't make the word lose meaning, it just legitimizes the the mentality behind the word.[/quote]
[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;29350643] you've probably got an elderly relative who grew up calling brazil nuts 'nigger toes'.[/QUOTE] My parents still do that and I almost did it near a black chick once She thought it was hilarious but I felt fucking terrible
The irony was they made such a big deal out of it last election, when McCain's claims to citizenship were even more questionable. [url]http://www.snopes.com/politics/mccain/citizen.asp[/url]
Damn americans need to bitch about everything. First they bitch he's black, now they bitch about some birth cert. Fuck guys, decide already.
[QUOTE=johan_sm;29361390]Damn americans need to bitch about everything. First they bitch he's black, now they bitch about some birth cert. Fuck guys, decide already.[/QUOTE] It's always been about the fact that he's black and hasn't shown proof of his birth in the U.S. Mostly about the fact that he's black.
[QUOTE=Sanius;29361452]It's always been about the fact that he's black and hasn't shown proof of his birth in the U.S. Mostly about the fact that he's black.[/QUOTE] He's shown that proof more times than I can count on two hands he's also been background vetted by an organization that does it's job better than any group of "tea partiers" so it's almost entirely because he's black
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