Holocaust Memorial Day 2016: Soaring anti-Semitism in Europe 'the reality Jews have to live in' - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649857]cool, so in america where muslims are generally disliked [img]http://www.pewforum.org/files/2014/07/PF_14.07.16_interreligiousRelations_ALL.png[/img] [img]http://www.brookings.edu/~/media/Blogs/markaz/2015/12/09-what-americans-think-of-muslims-and-islam-telhami/attitudes_toward_islam01.jpg?la=en[/img] would i be right in saying that you, as an american, dislike muslims?[/QUOTE] As an Israeli Jew, I am cautious around them. The history of the Islamic Conquest quite literally started with the slaughter of Jews of Medina and Jews have been second class citizens in Islamic societies ever since. Add in the hadith [QUOTE]Book 041, Number 6985: Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him; but the tree Gharqad would not say, for it is the tree of the Jews.[/QUOTE] There's a phrase that has become common in Israel in regards to the recent terrorist attacks, "Respect but suspect." I will respect Muslims but I cannot ignore the hatred that their religion has of me.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49649777]Serious question, does that allow me as an Israeli to make jokes about slaughtering Palestinians?[/QUOTE] Gudman's reply nailed it. [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649798]how the fuck people can get away with saying shit like and not get thrown out for being a racist/xenophobe is amazing literal generalisations about arabs and for some reason people think this is OK [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] better inform a few of my arabic friends that they actually hate jews, sorry guys[/QUOTE] Why dont you ask them if they really have any qualms with Jews, also do not forget to ask them if they are seriously religious.

[QUOTE=momoiro;49649880]You could say that in general, americans dislike muslims.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=dark-vivec;49649877]Judging by the huge following Trump has, yeah I'd say America in general has problems with Islamophobia.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=momoiro;49649875]What are you doing? You could make the assumption that within a random selection of americans, the majority will dislike muslims.[/QUOTE] you managed to beautifully dodge actually saying the words "americans hate muslims" i mean, in line with rangergxi's post which compared muslims and nazis, and then said that western governments are bringing in arabic refugees that "absolutely despise jews" so americans hate muslims?

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649857]cool, so in america where muslims are generally disliked [img]http://www.pewforum.org/files/2014/07/PF_14.07.16_interreligiousRelations_ALL.png[/img] [img]http://www.brookings.edu/~/media/Blogs/markaz/2015/12/09-what-americans-think-of-muslims-and-islam-telhami/attitudes_toward_islam01.jpg?la=en[/img] would i be right in saying that you, as an american, dislike muslims? [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] or that "americans hate muslims"[/QUOTE] 61% =/= 95% No one is calling for the extermination of Muslims in the US.

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49649918]61% =/= 95% No one is calling for the extermination of Muslims in the US.[/QUOTE] you have a presidential candidate who wants to ban muslims from the country, and suggested making a database of them [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] i mean, sure you can point out that arabic states have a terrible record for antisemitism (in the news recently) but one of the presidential candidates for the united states suggested banning muslims from entering the country, and has said that "And if Obama has brought some to this country they are leaving, they're going, they're gone." like, holy fuck

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649925]you have a presidential candidate who wants to ban muslims from the country, and suggested making a database of them [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] i mean, sure you can point out that arabic states have a terrible record for antisemitism (in the news recently) but one of the presidential candidates for the united states suggested banning muslims from entering the country, and has said that "And if Obama has brought some to this country they are leaving, they're going, they're gone."[/QUOTE] According to Polifact, Trump wants a database of refugees but wouldn't rule out Muslim database [URL="http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/nov/24/donald-trumps-comments-database-american-muslims/"]http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2015/nov/24/donald-trumps-comments-database-american-muslims/[/URL]

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649925]you have a presidential candidate who wants to ban muslims from the country, and suggested making a database of them [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] i mean, sure you can point out that arabic states have a terrible record for antisemitism (in the news recently) but one of the presidential candidates for the united states suggested banning muslims from entering the country, and has said that "And if Obama has brought some to this country they are leaving, they're going, they're gone."[/QUOTE] Donald Trump represents the will of the American people, clearly. He's a fringe candidate. Temporarily banning Muslims from entering the US =/= calling for the extermination of Jews.

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49649944]Donald Trump represents the will of the American people, clearly. He's a fringe candidate. Temporarily banning Muslims from entering the US =/= calling for the extermination of Jews.[/QUOTE] "fringe candidate" nice polls say otherwise [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] even without trump, the two surveys above show that americans hate muslims so i don't know why you're disputing this i mean just accept that americans hate muslims what's so disagreeable about that

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649950]"fringe candidate" nice polls say otherwise [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] even without trump, the two surveys above show that americans hate muslims so i don't know why you're disputing this i mean just accept that americans hate muslims what's so disagreeable about that[/QUOTE] dude you're from fucking GB, all you know are news reports

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649950]"fringe candidate" nice polls say otherwise [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] even without trump, the two surveys above show that americans hate muslims so i don't know why you're disputing this i mean just accept that americans hate muslims what's so disagreeable about that[/QUOTE] Uh, Trump is polling around 35% in the Republican primaries. That's nowhere near representing the will of the American people. I understand that Trump being a fringe candidate threatens your newfound view that Americans are planning "Holocaust v2: Muslim Edition" but Trump is a fringe candidate. Can you tell me again how 61% holding an "unfavorable" view of Muslims is equivalent to 95% of people in the Arab world, or how Trump is just as bad as Muslim clerics calling for Allah to smite all Jews, or Jews being barred from entry to certain areas, or Jews being murdered, etc...

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49649982]dude you're from fucking GB, all you know are news reports[/QUOTE] cool so when you talked about saudi arabia, you posted it because you lived in saudi arabia right? [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49649983]Uh, Trump is polling around 35% in the Republican primaries. That's nowhere near representing the will of the American people. I understand that Trump being a fringe candidate threatens your newfound view that Americans are planning "Holocaust v2: Muslim Edition" but Trump is a fringe candidate. Can you tell me again how 61% holding an "unfavorable" view of Muslims is equivalent to 95% of people in the Arab world, or how Trump is just as bad as Muslim clerics calling for Allah to smite all Jews, or Jews being barred from entry to certain areas, or Jews being murdered, etc...[/QUOTE] the 95% figure you posted was from three arabic countries so, stop talking about the arab world because you haven't used a figure about the 'arab world' and we weren't talking about the 'arab world', we're talking about arabs the point i'm making is that, because statistically americans are likely to dislike/hate muslims doesn't mean i'm entitled to say that americans hate muslims because that's generalising

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49649982]dude you're from fucking GB, all you know are news reports[/QUOTE] [QUOTE] cool so when you talked about saudi arabia, you posted it because you lived in saudi arabia right? [/QUOTE] Nothing stops a British national from being informed regarding American politics, the thing is Cloak Raider clearly isn't. It's obvious his only insight into American politics is left-wing tabloids with scary headlines claiming Trump is some kind of super-villain who's taken the American people by storm. [QUOTE]the 95% figure you posted was from three arabic countries so, stop talking about the arab world because you haven't used a figure about the 'arab world' and we weren't talking about the 'arab world', we're talking about arabs the point i'm making is that, because statistically americans are likely to dislike/hate muslims doesn't mean i'm entitled to say that americans hate muslims because that's generalising [/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure 95% or greater in three major Arab states, combined with examples of prominent Muslim leaders holding and enforcing extremely discriminatory views, is enough to draw a conclusion that the Arab world doesn't like Jews. Y'know, that part of the world where the overwhelming majority of Arabs live and have lived in for their entire lives?

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649999]cool so when you talked about saudi arabia, you posted it because you lived in saudi arabia right? [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] the 95% figure you posted was from three arabic countries so, stop talking about the arab world because you haven't used a figure about the 'arab world' and we weren't talking about the 'arab world', we're talking about arabs the point i'm making is that, because statistically americans are likely to dislike/hate muslims doesn't mean i'm entitled to say that americans hate muslims because that's generalising[/QUOTE] no because I'm not allowed in Saudi Arabia because I'm a filthy Jew

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649950]"fringe candidate" nice polls say otherwise [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] even without trump, the two surveys above show that americans hate muslims so i don't know why you're disputing this i mean just accept that americans hate muslims what's so disagreeable about that[/QUOTE] Well, when the majority of terrorist attacks on American soil and against American citizens elsewhere in the last 16 years are committed by jihadists, I can totally see why Americans are opposed to let more muslims in their country, especially when one of the perpetrators in the San Bernardino shootings got a green card while having blatant jihadist worldviews. And that is not even mentioning the dozens of jihadi terrorist plots against America that have been prevented in those 16 years.

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49650011]no because I'm not allowed in Saudi Arabia because I'm a filthy Jew[/QUOTE] cool so why are you talking about saudi arabia, all you know is news reports also, how's the israeli situation on arabs, it'd be a pretty poor show if you were discriminating against them [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Jordax;49650030]Well, when the majority of terrorist attacks on American soil and against American citizens elsewhere in the last 16 years are committed by jihadists, I can totally see why Americans are opposed to let more muslims in their country, especially when one of the perpetrators in the San Bernardino shootings got a green card while having blatant jihadist worldviews. And that is not even mentioning the dozens of jihadi terrorist plots against America that have been prevented in those 16 years.[/QUOTE] [URL]http://www.mintpressnews.com/white-americans-are-the-biggest-terror-threat-in-the-united-states/211608/[/URL] [URL]http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/25/us/tally-of-attacks-in-us-challenges-perceptions-of-top-terror-threat.html?_r=0[/URL] you're wrong your starting point of most terrorist attacks in the US being done by jihadists is plain incorrect i'm afraid but that won't stop you from parroting the line that most terrorists are muslims, when in fact, they're mostly white anti-government.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49649913] i mean, in line with rangergxi's post which compared muslims and nazis, and then said that western governments are bringing in arabic refugees that "absolutely despise jews" so americans hate muslims?[/QUOTE] Quite a few Americans do. Not 95% but a politician that wants to ban them from the country kinda tops the charts.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49650044]cool so why are you talking about saudi arabia, all you know is news reports also, how's the israeli situation on arabs, it'd be a pretty poor show if you were discriminating against them[/QUOTE] Arabs do quite well in Israel. Arabs are represented in the Israeli government, treated as equal before the law, and generally live much better than they would within the Islamic world; especially Christian Arabs, who face extermination in countries like Syria. News reports, articles, and other pieces of writing are excellent sources. It's evident that you're not citing any reputable reports, articles or other pieces of writing, though, that your source regarding America and American politics is left-wing UK tabloids. [QUOTE][url]http://www.mintpressnews.com/white-a...states/211608/[/url] [url]http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/25/us...reat.html?_r=0[/url] you're wrong your starting point of most terrorist attacks in the US being done by jihadists is plain incorrect i'm afraid but that won't stop you from parroting the line that most terrorists are muslims, when in fact, they're mostly white anti-government. [/QUOTE] If you define any idiot with a shotgun or a pipebomb as a 'terrorist', yes, Muslims don't commit the majority of terrorist attacks. But some idiot with a shotgun didn't kill 2,000+ people and destroy an internationally known landmark in 2001. Some idiot with a shotgun didn't go on a massacre in San Bernardino a few months ago. [QUOTE]white anti-government.[/QUOTE] Gotta mention that it's whitey who's behind the world's sins.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49650044]cool so why are you talking about saudi arabia, all you know is news reports also, how's the israeli situation on arabs, it'd be a pretty poor show if you were discriminating against them[/QUOTE] there's Arabs on the supreme Court and in the Knesset

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650073]Arabs do quite well in Israel. Arabs are represented in the Israeli government, treated as equal before the law, and generally live much better than they would within the Islamic world; especially Christian Arabs, who face extermination in countries like Syria. News reports, articles, and other pieces of writing are excellent sources. It's evident that you're not citing any reputable reports, articles or other pieces of writing, though, that your source regarding America and American politics is left-wing UK tabloids. If you define any idiot with a shotgun or a pipebomb as a 'terrorist', yes, Muslims don't commit the majority of terrorist attacks. But some idiot with a shotgun didn't kill 2,000+ people and destroy an internationally known landmark in 2001. Some idiot with a shotgun didn't go on a massacre in San Bernardino a few months ago. Gotta mention that it's whitey who's behind the world's sins.[/QUOTE] [URL]http://www.haaretz.com/news/civil-rights-group-israel-has-reached-new-heights-of-racism-1.234831[/URL] [URL]https://www.hrw.org/news/2001/12/04/israeli-schools-separate-not-equal[/URL] [URL]http://www.scotsman.com/news/world/arab-spouses-face-israeli-legal-purge-1-1117832[/URL] [URL]http://www.haaretz.com/netanyahu-israel-s-arabs-are-the-real-demographic-threat-1.109045[/URL] [URL]http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3285075,00.html[/URL] [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Svinnik;49650094]there's Arabs on the supreme Court and in the Knesset[/QUOTE] which were apparently beaten by police at demonstrations [URL="https://web.archive.org/web/20070927214122/http://www.arabhra.org/publications/reports/PDF/SilencingDissentFinal.pdf#search="]https://web.archive.org/web/20070927214122/http://www.arabhra.org/publications/reports/PDF/SilencingDissentFinal.pdf#search="arab knesset silencing dissent"[/URL] personal favourite line "So harsh have been some of the attacks that seven of the MKs have hadto be treated in hospital for their injuries." [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] oh also, with regard to you trying to redefine terrorists [URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman[/URL] sorry that the statistics don't show your worldview that only muslims can be terrorists [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] also this thread isn't about israeli racism against arabs in israel, it's about not generalising that people are X for evident reasons i'm not about to argue that israel is as bad as saudi arabia because it isn't but if you're trying to convince me that you're entitled to say that arabs hate jewish people, you're coming up short.

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49650114][URL]http://www.haaretz.com/news/civil-rights-group-israel-has-reached-new-heights-of-racism-1.234831[/URL] [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] oh also, with regard to you trying to redefine terrorists [URL]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman[/URL] [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] also this thread isn't about israeli racism against arabs in israel, it's about not generalising that people are X for evident reasons[/QUOTE] As long as we're talking about the definition of terrorists can I say that anyone who's ever committed any violent action with the intent being to cause a reaction is a terrorist? Can I brand a toddler throwing a tantrum as a terrorist? People like the Oregon militia aren't terrorists. They're not massacring civilians because God told them to. [QUOTE]but if you're trying to convince me that you're entitled to say that arabs hate jewish people, you're coming up short. [/QUOTE] It's your choice what you believe and you evidently have chosen to ignore very obvious evidence of anti-semitism among Arabs.

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650162]As long as we're talking about the definition of terrorists can I say that anyone who's ever committed any violent action with the intent being to cause a reaction is a terrorist? Can I brand a toddler throwing a tantrum as a terrorist? People like the Oregon militia aren't terrorists. They're not massacring civilians because God told them to.[/QUOTE] you don't get to dispute figures with your own personal definition of terrorists the statistics do not back up your argument

[QUOTE=Svinnik;49649893]Book 041, Number 6985: Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: The last hour would not come unless the Muslims will fight against the Jews and the Muslims would kill them until the Jews would hide themselves behind a stone or a tree and a stone or a tree would say: Muslim, or the servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me; come and kill him; but the tree Gharqad would not say, for it is the tree of the Jews.[/QUOTE] First of all, this from a hadith, not the Quran. Second of all, this passage refers to the Jews at the end of time who will oppress and corrupt the world by joining forces with the Anti-Christ against Jesus. [QUOTE]As an Israeli Jew, I am cautious around them. The history of the Islamic Conquest quite literally started with the slaughter of Jews of Medina and Jews have been second class citizens in Islamic societies ever since. Add in the hadith [/QUOTE] Islamic societies have never expelled the Jews from their nation. Islamic societies have never forced the Jews into ghettos. Islamic societies have never committed genocide against the Jews. For most of history Muslims have been Jews' closest ally. [QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650073]Arabs do quite well in Israel. Arabs are represented in the Israeli government, treated as equal before the law, and generally live much better than they would within the Islamic world; especially Christian Arabs, who face extermination in countries like Syria.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE] Income/poverty • Arab families are greatly over-represented among Israel’s poor: over halfof Arab families in Israel are classified as poor, compared to an averagepoverty rate of one-fifth among all families in Israel. Arab towns andvillages are heavily over-represented in the lowest socio-economicrankings, and the unrecognized Arab Bedouin villages in the Naqab arethe poorest communities in the state. • Gaps in income and poverty rates are directly related to institutionaldiscrimination against Arab citizens in Israel.[/QUOTE] [URL="http://www.adalah.org/uploads/oldfiles/upfiles/2011/Adalah_The_Inequality_Report_March_2011.pdf"]Source[/URL]

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650162] It's your choice what you believe and you evidently have chosen to ignore very obvious evidence of anti-semitism among Arabs.[/QUOTE] nope, i even said that saudi arabia is far worse for anti-semitism than israel i've got no problem admitting that there's a problem of anti-semitism in many arabic countries but i'm not about to generalise because that would make me an arsehole

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49650167]you don't get to dispute figures with your own personal definition of terrorists the statistics do not back up your argument[/QUOTE] The question is "how do you define a terrorist" and I'm saying that some hillbilly wandering around with an AR-15 isn't a terrorist any more than an Arab who robs a convenience store is a jihadist. This figure that "well, see, most terrorists are actually white republicans" is [U]highly[/U] questionable. [QUOTE]nope, i even said that saudi arabia is far worse for anti-semitism than israel i've got no problem admitting that there's a problem of anti-semitism in many arabic countries but i'm not about to generalise because that would make me an arsehole [/QUOTE] If 95% of a population holds one very strong belief, we can assume when we meet a member of that population that they hold that belief. If 95% of, say, Frenchmen hate toast passionately will you offer free toast to a passing Frenchman because generalizing is bad?

Even my liberal professors disagree with the term "terrorist" being thrown around like candy because its so non-descriptive and doesn't really tell you anything about who you're attempting to describe. It doesn't tell you who they actually are, what they're attempting to do or anything like that. It's such a broad term that it's useless.

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650162]As long as we're talking about the definition of terrorists can I say that anyone who's ever committed any violent action with the intent being to cause a reaction is a terrorist?[/QUOTE] *political reaction

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650185]The question is "how do you define a terrorist" and I'm saying that some hillbilly wandering around with an AR-15 isn't a terrorist any more than an Arab who robs a convenience store is a jihadist. This figure that "well, see, most terrorists are actually white republicans" is [U]highly[/U] questionable. If 95% of a population holds one very strong belief, we can assume when we meet a member of that population that they hold that belief. If 95% of, say, Frenchmen hate toast passionately will you offer free toast to a passing Frenchman because generalizing is bad?[/QUOTE] that's cool, because what you're saying doesn't have a bearing on the definition of terrorist which, judging by studies, says there's more anti-government white people who are terrorists also good job belittling the subject of racism/anti-semitism to liking or not liking toast, your comparison is fucking terrible no, it's not acceptable because you're talking about something as deeply offensive as fucking racism [editline]1st February 2016[/editline] and also, again, you're using the 95% figure which i already explained is inaccurate

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49650212]that's cool, because what you're saying doesn't have a bearing on the definition of terrorist which, judging by studies, says there's more anti-government white people who are terrorists also good job belittling the subject of racism/anti-semitism to liking or not liking toast, your comparison is fucking terrible[/QUOTE] Good job avoiding my question. Pretend "toast" is "latka" and "Frenchman" is "Saudi" if that makes you more comfortable. On the issue of terrorism, it is, again, a matter of quantity vs. impact and also of definition. Five guys who each get in a drunken brawl with a Democrat is not equivalent to jihadists killing 2,000 people. I would also be skeptical of notably liberal publications claiming that most terrorists are White republicans in the same way I would be skeptical of Fox News claiming that most terrorists are radical left-wing. [QUOTE] and also, again, you're using the 95% figure which i already explained is inaccurate [/QUOTE] How? Three major Arab states coming in at 95% or greater suggests that 95% is a reasonable estimate for the Arab world as a whole, especially given the popular and rabidly anti-semitic rhetoric of many prominent Arab leaders.

[QUOTE=Shovel Mech;49650238]Good job avoiding my question. Pretend "toast" is "latka" and "Frenchman" is "Saudi" if that makes you more comfortable. On the issue of terrorism, it is, again, a matter of quantity vs. impact and also of definition. Five guys who each get in a drunken brawl with a Democrat is not equivalent to jihadists killing 2,000 people. I would also be skeptical of notably liberal publications claiming that most terrorists are White republicans in the same way I would be skeptical of Fox News claiming that most terrorists are radical left-wing. How? Three major Arab states coming in at 95% or greater suggests that 95% is a reasonable estimate for the Arab world as a whole.[/QUOTE] no, it isn't as i said, you're trying to desperately redefine terrorist so that you're right, but you're not stop trying to redefine a word to mean what you want it to mean. also, no, i didn't avoid your question, i answered your question, i'll say it again "no, it's not acceptable because you're talking about something as deeply offensive as fucking racism" also "and also, again, you're using the 95% figure which i already explained is inaccurate" imagine if i used the three most white countries to indicate the opinions of white people or i guess you believe that arabic people are some sort of hivemind

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;49650251]no, it isn't as i said, you're trying to desperately redefine terrorist so that you're right, but you're not stop trying to redefine a word to mean what you want it to mean. also, no, i didn't avoid your question, i answered your question, i'll say it again "no, it's not acceptable because you're talking about something as deeply offensive as fucking racism" also "and also, again, you're using the 95% figure which i already explained is inaccurate"[/QUOTE] Define terrorist for me. If we apply that label to any dumb hick who shoots at a police car because of the gubmint then the word has virtually no impact and is just as meaningless as "vandal" or "thug" [QUOTE]"no, it's not acceptable because you're talking about something as deeply offensive as fucking racism" [/QUOTE] So you're saying you agree with me... ? I thought this was part of your renowned "Wow, comparing racism to toast is so fucking offensive shitlord!" argument. [QUOTE]imagine if i used the three most white countries to indicate the opinions of white people or i guess you believe that arabic people are some sort of hivemind [/QUOTE] Statistics are a good indication of a population's beliefs. If you find irrefutable evidence that 95% of white people wholeheartedly support Trump, then we can agree that the average passing white person supports Trump and treat him as such.