• Tim Berners-Lee gave us an opening to stop DRM in Web standards. Imagine thinking DRM is good LOL
    70 replies, posted
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;51169160]But it isn't a bitch to use at all[/QUOTE] But it's still DRM. Just better implemented DRM
[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;51169160]But it isn't a bitch to use at all[/QUOTE] Nor would Netflix or anything using EME.
The DRM in spotify is completely unnecessary. People who want to pirate things will still pirate them. If the DRM was removed completely i'm 99 percent sure the piracy rates would stay the same since it's a well implemented distribution service that doesn't give people a reason to want to pirate.
DRM just doesn't work and is fairly pointless. The only system of DRM I've seen that hasn't been cracked yet is Denuvio for games, and even them some of those games have been cracked, and there is a problem with it; you need to dial in to game servers to get access to the game. I'm hoping that for Doom 2016, for instance, iD eventually moves away from that system. GOG has proven that DRM isn't needed for video games and doesn't increase sales.
[QUOTE=space1;51169059]All DRM is bad, hand's down. At one time in this damned country it was perfectly legal to record mixtapes from the radio and share them with your friends(so long as you weren't selling it), but now you can't give your buddy your mp3s because it's a criminal offense. Abolishing copyright(as it exists today) for works of art would make the world a much better place.[/QUOTE] so i can sell copies of your video games without any repercussions, right? "no copyright"
[QUOTE=LordCrypto;51169491]so i can sell copies of your video games without any repercussions, right? "no copyright"[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=space1;51169059]Abolishing copyright([b]as it exists today[/b])[/QUOTE] Is this obvious enough for you?
[QUOTE=gokiyono;51167976]It's amazing that these companies would rather waste money on making it a slight bit more inconvinient for pirates to download, rather than make it easier for everyone to access your product. I mean, it's almost like having a [URL="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2016/07/04/internet-piracy-falls-to-record-lows-amid-rise-of-spotify-and-ne/"]better service will make people want to use it or something[/URL][/QUOTE] Really sucks because we probably won't see much reform for licensing laws and such for awhile, a lot of foreign people pirate because shit just isn't available. And even as an American, the amount of music on spotify and google play music is pretty trash with huge gaps. EME is probably just a way to stroke the cocks of the media owners to say "see, we're fighting piracy!" because I'd wager that Netflix etc. know it won't stop shit.
DRM's goal is pretty much to delay, not stop, anyway.
[QUOTE=Map in a box;51169741]DRM's goal is pretty much to delay, not stop, anyway.[/QUOTE] Which makes EME pointless, because ripping video and audii is easy af.
[QUOTE=Map in a box;51169089]Spotify has DRM too. So um.[/QUOTE] Yes, and? Spotifys service is also miles better than pirating. [I]Which is why it helps against it. [/I]
Same goes for drm like steam. Technically it is a drm, yet it offers a way better experience than a pirated game with its store recommendations, friend list, workshop, market, trading cards etc. Why can't companies understand that?
[QUOTE=J!NX;51166837]DRM a lot of the time ends up punishing consumers and making it better to get around it than to use it legitimately. EX: What happens when your monitor bugs out and your computer doesn't see it as "HDCP" capable? You can't watch HD"CopyProtection" content now. Those amazon prime videos you bought? Nope, your monitor isn't a LEGITIMATE display, can't want them in HD even though you paid for it.[/QUOTE] I use a perfectly fine 1080p LCD as my third monitor. Sadly it only supports VGA so content that is requires HDCP is literally unwatchable on my computer unless I disable that monitor. It's literally easier and faster to pirate movies that are included in Amazon Prime than to watch them legitimately.
[QUOTE=Robber;51170502]I use a perfectly fine 1080p LCD as my third monitor. Sadly it only supports VGA so content that is requires HDCP is literally unwatchable on my computer unless I disable that monitor. It's literally easier and faster to pirate movies that are included in Amazon Prime than to watch them legitimately.[/QUOTE] Not to mention many active HDMI splitters can be circuit bended to act as HDCP 'strippers', and the fact that affordable HDMI capture cards exists, well, you get the picture...
i don't understand why people are against this, it literally will make content easier to watch as netflix and such likely will stop being shitty silverlight/flash based. The DRM already exists and is probably not going to go away, this just makes it easier to deal with.
[QUOTE=Shadaez;51171155]i don't understand why people are against this, it literally will make content easier to watch as netflix and such likely will stop being shitty silverlight/flash based. The DRM already exists and is probably not going to go away, this just makes it easier to deal with.[/QUOTE] Would be better to just wait until Silverlight and Flash are phased out.
[QUOTE=Darkwater124;51171159]Would be better to just wait until Silverlight and Flash are phased out.[/QUOTE] they won't be unless a replacement drm solution exists, and if they are, a lot of content producers will likely be a lot more hesitant about allowing their content to be streamed on sites like Netflix
[QUOTE=Shadaez;51171155]i don't understand why people are against this, it literally will make content easier to watch as netflix and such likely will stop being shitty silverlight/flash based. The DRM already exists and is probably not going to go away, this just makes it easier to deal with.[/QUOTE] Silverlight isn't that bad though. It doesn't bypass browser sandboxing, it doesn't crash at bizarre or inopportune moments, it runs almost as fast as HTML5 video, and is generally a model citizen for what a browser plugin SHOULD do. I don't like the way corporations keep mucking around with my computer behind the scenes in the name of "copyright protection", but since Silverlight effectively can't touch data without explicit authorization I can't exactly say it's an example of DRM being bad. (In an ideal world, information would be free, and these companies would adapt to survive, but...)
The only DRM I have an issue with is the one that forces you to buy a $40 usb dongle and forces you to have it in your computer if you want to use the software you bought.
[QUOTE=lavacano;51171431]Silverlight isn't that bad though. It doesn't bypass browser sandboxing, it doesn't crash at bizarre or inopportune moments, it runs almost as fast as HTML5 video, and is generally a model citizen for what a browser plugin SHOULD do. I don't like the way corporations keep mucking around with my computer behind the scenes in the name of "copyright protection", but since Silverlight effectively can't touch data without explicit authorization I can't exactly say it's an example of DRM being bad. (In an ideal world, information would be free, and these companies would adapt to survive, but...)[/QUOTE] Isn't there also software that actually makes Silverlight work great under Linux now, Or did people just stop bitching about it?
[QUOTE=Van-man;51172995]Isn't there also software that actually makes Silverlight work great under Linux now, Or did people just stop bitching about it?[/QUOTE] Great is not the word to use there.
I think people just stopped bitching about it when everyone stopped using it it also wasnt great under windows
[QUOTE=space1;51169059]All DRM is bad, hand's down. At one time in this damned country it was perfectly legal to record mixtapes from the radio and share them with your friends(so long as you weren't selling it), but now you can't give your buddy your mp3s because it's a criminal offense. Abolishing copyright(as it exists today) for works of art would make the world a much better place.[/QUOTE] No, DRM is not bad hands down, and DRM has nothing to do with the legality of distributing and copying copyrighted music. Invasive DRM is bad but the concept is not.
[QUOTE=phygon;51174419]No, DRM is not bad hands down, and DRM has nothing to do with the legality of distributing and copying copyrighted music. Invasive DRM is bad but the concept is not.[/QUOTE] The concept is cool, but it's impossible to make DRM that works and is not invasive.
[QUOTE=Map in a box;51174282]Great is not the word to use there.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=thelurker1234;51174396]I think people just stopped bitching about it when everyone stopped using it it also wasnt great under windows[/QUOTE] Had a hunch it was the latter, since I don't have any personal experience with using Silverlight at all.
[QUOTE=eirexe;51175639]The concept is cool, but it's impossible to make DRM that works and is not invasive.[/QUOTE] I can agree that there are currently no good models of drm but the concept itself is not inherently bad.
[QUOTE=redBadger;51171558]The only DRM I have an issue with is the one that forces you to buy a $40 usb dongle and forces you to have it in your computer if you want to use the software you bought.[/QUOTE] What DRM is that? :wideeye:
[QUOTE=gokiyono;51170298]Yes, and? Spotifys service is also miles better than pirating. [I]Which is why it helps against it. [/I][/QUOTE] with spotify you're also not buying the songs -- you're paying for a subscription to listen to those songs. same thing for netflix: you're paying to watch all the content on nexflix for a set duration. you don't own any of the content you consume on netflix or spotify.
[QUOTE=shad0w440;51178847]What DRM is that? :wideeye:[/QUOTE] Pretty common in high end software like Avid, some CAD software. I know in my highschool graphic design class the software for our vinyl cutter needed one.
[QUOTE=FurrehFaux;51166754]It's been proven time and time again that the solution to piracy is to make the product more easily accessible and have a centralized distribution platform, not lock it down with loads of DRM.[/QUOTE] I always find it interesting how on Facepunch the non-viability of DRM is a known fact thanks to a handful of anecdotal examples and thought experiments, while out in the real world companies that invest literally millions of dollars into research and actuarial (not actual, actuarial) analysis of the issue come to the opposite conclusion. For every wild success story of a DRM-free game you have another that gets pirated ten times more than it's sold and fades into obscurity. For every GOG you have a Steam. It's been thoroughly demonstrated that easily-circumvented but intrusive and annoying DRM is ineffective- but the same does not apply to DRM methods that are effective at their intended task without impacting legitimate users, as the success of Denuvo has demonstrated. DRM's not going anywhere as long as the return on investment makes it worth implementing.
[QUOTE=catbarf;51179148]I always find it interesting how on Facepunch the non-viability of DRM is a known fact thanks to a handful of anecdotal examples and thought experiments, while out in the real world companies that invest literally millions of dollars into research and actuarial (not actual, actuarial) analysis of the issue come to the opposite conclusion. For every wild success story of a DRM-free game you have another that gets pirated ten times more than it's sold and fades into obscurity. For every GOG you have a Steam. It's been thoroughly demonstrated that easily-circumvented but intrusive and annoying DRM is ineffective- but the same does not apply to DRM methods that are effective at their intended task without impacting legitimate users, as the success of Denuvo has demonstrated. DRM's not going anywhere as long as the return on investment makes it worth implementing.[/QUOTE] Got some examples or study sources to back that up? I'm not even gonna mention how studies conducted by billion dollar corporations usually have the truth bent to a right angle or just outright lie. Here's some sources backing up the fact that getting rid of DRM reduces piracy. [url]https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20111011/17205216309/course-study-shows-that-getting-rid-drm-reduces-piracy.shtml[/url] [url]http://www.geek.com/tech/cd-projekt-proves-that-games-drm-is-a-complete-waste-of-time-1662434/[/url] [url]http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2011/10/a-game-we-all-win-dumping-drm-can-increase-sales-while-reducing-piracy/[/url]
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