Obama told Putin on the phone that Russia has violated international law
163 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Del91;44098247]Going by wikipedia, the whole of the Spanish armed forces is smaller than Ukraine's.
This seems to be Spain's one and only Aircraft carrier.
[t]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/ba/Spanish_ship_Juan_Carlos_I_entering_Ferrol.jpg/800px-Spanish_ship_Juan_Carlos_I_entering_Ferrol.jpg[/t][/QUOTE]
World nations don't tend to have much aircraft carriers, don't ask me why, I wouldn't know what the reasons are.
You guys are forgetting that we just came out of a God awful war and are slashing military budgets. If the American populace can avoid a war right now then that would be the most favorable route. The most likely thing to happen is America et al will force trade sanctions on Russia in an attempt to cripple them until they back down.
[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;44098266]You guys are forgetting that we just came out of a God awful war and are slashing military budgets. If the American populace can avoid a war right now then that would be the most favorable route. The most likely thing to happen is America et al will force trade sanctions on Russia in an attempt to cripple them until they back down.[/QUOTE]
After our Middle Eastern shit-show we should definitely try to avoid fighting.
[QUOTE=Aw_Heck;44098246]By that line of reasoning only countries with credibility should send their forces, thus [B]gaining more experience and becoming more credibility while other countries don't.[/B] Eventually this means that a select few countries would do everything and the others would sit on the sideline. Saying we should do all the fighting because we're one of the biggest kids "on the playground" is foolish.
In my opinion this should be a joint effort, I hate how the US is the strongarm for other countries, it's draining the fuck out of us.[/QUOTE]
But that's kind of the reality of it, a country with that kind of strength will gain credibility with their threats due to simple intimidation. Now that doesn't mean that one country is obligated to do the fighting, I do agree with you on that. It's also easy as fuck for a less "credible" country to take a seat on the sideline and criticize.
[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;44098266]You guys are forgetting that we just came out of a God awful war and are slashing military budgets. If the American populace can avoid a war right now then that would be the most favorable route. The most likely thing to happen is America et al will force trade sanctions on Russia in an attempt to cripple them until they back down.[/QUOTE]
in light of these recent events I don't think that "military slashing" will be taking place soon
[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;44098266]You guys are forgetting that we just came out of a God awful war and are slashing military budgets. If the American populace can avoid a war right now then that would be the most favorable route. The most likely thing to happen is America et al will force trade sanctions on Russia in an attempt to cripple them until they back down.[/QUOTE]
The US just came out of a disappointing series of wars, but mainly what this means is that we're particularly irritable.
The part I like is almost no one I know even knows about anything even happening in Ukraine.
[QUOTE=lope;44098282]in light of these recent events I don't think that "military slashing" will be taking place soon[/QUOTE]
Except they are. We're losing significant amounts of armed service members (I know in ROTC at least we are cutting back on I believe it's like 400 upcoming commissioning officers. That's a lot when such Detachments such as my own commission like 12).
I'm not sure how it works in other services, but at least in ours the way it was put was "unless you've been selected and are on the waitlist for the next rank, you are currently at risk of being dropped." That's for currently commissioned officers.
[editline]Edited:[/editline]
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44098289]The US just came out of a disappointing series of wars, but mainly what this means is that we're particularly irritable.[/QUOTE]
I don't think anyone's excited to get into another war after just leaving the longest war in U.S. history.
[QUOTE=Del91;44098295]The part I like is almost no one I know even knows about anything even happening in Ukraine.[/QUOTE]
I know.
We're all going to die in a blaze of glory, right?
[QUOTE=Del91;44098295]The part I like is almost no one I know even knows about anything even happening in Ukraine.[/QUOTE]
Everyone here knows what's happening and it's nice to be able to discuss the Ukrainian situation with [I]everyone[/I] in any given class.
[QUOTE=Aw_Heck;44098246]In my opinion this should be a joint effort, I hate how the US is the strongarm for other countries, it's draining the fuck out of us.[/QUOTE]
This I can agree with. We're waning, and we can't be NATO's muscle forever.
[QUOTE=Psychokitten;44098324]This I can agree with. We're waning, and we can't be NATO's muscle forever.[/QUOTE]
NATO shouldn't have a single "muscle." It should work more like a chiseled six-pack.
[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;44098309]
I don't think anyone's excited to get into another war after just leaving the longest war in U.S. history.[/QUOTE]
I'm not arguing that anyone in the US is excited about the prospect of getting into another conflict. It's more that the next conflict we get into is going to be one where we're not very keen to help pick up the pieces afterward. And there will be a lot of pieces.
[QUOTE=Grimhound;44098347]I'm not arguing that anyone in the US is excited about the prospect of getting into another conflict. It's more that the next conflict we get into is going to be one where we're not very keen to help pick up the pieces afterward. And there will be a lot of pieces.[/QUOTE]
I guess you can speculate if you want. The fact of the matter is, imposed trade sanctions as opposed to armed conflict is what we will most likely be seeing.
What's Putin's angle on this? What does Russia gain from occupying parts of Ukraine right now? It seems incredibly arrogant of them if they eventually claim that they're sending troops purely for peacekeeping reasons to avoid the label of "invasion".
[QUOTE=StrawberryClock;44098416]What's Putin's angle on this? What does Russia gain from occupying parts of Ukraine right now? It seems incredibly arrogant of them if they eventually claim that they're sending troops purely for peacekeeping reasons to avoid the label of "invasion".[/QUOTE]
Warm water ports, mainly. Gotta keep the Naval base and shipping from Sevastopol safe.
I'm not sure if this has been posted before, and I can't confirm it's authenticity, but apparently this is a video that was taken in Crimea two days ago:
[video=youtube;z9ucir5HsvY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9ucir5HsvY&feature=youtu.be[/video]
[QUOTE=StrawberryClock;44098446]I'm not sure if this has been posted before, and I can't confirm it's authenticity, but apparently this is a video that was taken in Crimea two days ago:
[video=youtube;z9ucir5HsvY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9ucir5HsvY&feature=youtu.be[/video][/QUOTE]
Yeah, was posted back then, in the really long thread about Russia invading Ukraine.
[QUOTE=StrawberryClock;44098446]I'm not sure if this has been posted before, and I can't confirm it's authenticity, but apparently this is a video that was taken in Crimea two days ago:
[video=youtube;z9ucir5HsvY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z9ucir5HsvY&feature=youtu.be[/video][/QUOTE]
It has been.
Crimea is probably more inclined to call this a "liberation" if anything. I would focus more on places like Kiev.
[QUOTE=Del91;44098247]Going by wikipedia, the whole of the Spanish armed forces is smaller than Ukraine's.
This seems to be Spain's one and only Aircraft carrier.
[t]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/b/ba/Spanish_ship_Juan_Carlos_I_entering_Ferrol.jpg/800px-Spanish_ship_Juan_Carlos_I_entering_Ferrol.jpg[/t][/QUOTE]
The Australian navy has just bought two helicopter carries off spain. Don't forget China only has one aircraft carrier as well.
[QUOTE=Aw_Heck;44098262]What is even the point of that little fucking boat. Can you even load aircraft into it? Can you land an aircraft on it?[/QUOTE]
It's for helicopters, obviously
[QUOTE=Craigewan;44098427]Warm water ports, mainly. Gotta keep the Naval base and shipping from Sevastopol safe.[/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/4b36QGR.png[/IMG]
??
I don't understand the problem. They have "warm water ports".
[QUOTE=patq911;44098555][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/4b36QGR.png[/IMG]
??
I don't understand the problem. They have "warm water ports".[/QUOTE]
Sevastapol is right in the middle of the Black Sea, why are you even questioning the importance of the port
Also safe from what? Does anyone think that Ukraine will just cut all relations with Russia if they don't occupy Crimea? Forgive my ignorance of the situation, I'm trying. If Ukraine continues on it's european path, it won't just stop trading with russia.
I'm probably missing the point though.
[editline]2nd March 2014[/editline]
[QUOTE=ionuttzu;44098566]Sevastapol is right in the middle of the Black Sea, why are you even questioning the importance of the port[/QUOTE]
Refer to the post above.
[QUOTE=patq911;44098572]Also safe from what? Does anyone think that Ukraine will just cut all relations with Russia if they don't occupy Crimea? Forgive my ignorance of the situation, I'm trying. If Ukraine continues on it's european path, it won't just stop trading with russia.
I'm probably missing the point though.[/QUOTE]
Russia has the military bases in Crimea with Ukraine's approval. If Ukraine continues on it's path with EU, and eventually NATO, those bases are in danger of being changed to NATO hands. Think of the future.
[QUOTE=Hole;44098264]World nations don't tend to have much aircraft carriers, don't ask me why, I wouldn't know what the reasons are.[/QUOTE]
Costs.
[QUOTE=Limed00d;44096058][video=youtube;fnd0qg4I_MM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnd0qg4I_MM[/video][/QUOTE]
completely unrelated but holy shit the president in Red Alert 2 is goddamn Leland Palmer from Twin Peaks, what the fuck :v:
I don't like the idea of the US getting into another war. Then again, I don't like the idea of Russia trying it's hand at the expansion again. I'm really confused on what stance I should have here.
[video=youtube;-PWskO9s5x4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PWskO9s5x4[/video]
Hopefully everything will be fine.
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