[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;32535959]I didn't know the Mafia ran half the US and nearly had the Police running scared.[/QUOTE]
semantics
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;32535959]I didn't know the Mafia ran half the US and nearly had the Police running scared.[/QUOTE]
Even more reasons to do it.
Their size doesn't change the fact that their main income is drug money.
This is just getting worse. I'm nowhere near mexico and this is horrifying.
What kind of human bei- [B]Monsters[/B] can do this to people?
[editline]29th September 2011[/editline]
Fuck now they're gonna come get me for slandering them online :v:
Elementary school textbooks have to suck in Mexico.
"If Pedro has three severed heads, and Jesus has two severed heads, how much profit has been gained for the cartel?"
[QUOTE=ewitwins;32524761]I'm starting to think that the Mexican government and the Mexican military can't handle all of this alone. This is out of control.[/QUOTE]
Most of them might be corrupt from what I heard. Might as well inva- I mean liberate them like we did in the middle east.
[QUOTE=Kybalt;32535996]semantics[/QUOTE]
Well it kind of makes a difference, even if it gets legalized and they do start to lose power they'll still have the power to go out on a rampage if they so choose, fight or flight, and when you have as much power as they do you can be pretty sure that they're going to fight hard.
[QUOTE=Apache249;32529969]No, this is the Mexican army we're talking about.[/QUOTE]
Don't forget their Air Force:
[IMG]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/99/PC-7_FAM.jpg/800px-PC-7_FAM.jpg[/IMG]
They also have a few F-5s, and about 80 unarmed Cessnas for reconnaissance.
[QUOTE=Venezuelan;32533483]Legalizing cocaine = everyone does it then dies
okay professor[/QUOTE]
I'd rather not legalize the drugs that can actually kill you if you make a mistake guessing the appropriate dosage. You don't see people getting killed by overdosing on cigarettes, do you? Alcohol can kill you if you drink too much, but it's too widespread to make illegal again.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;32534090]so if cocaine or meth was legal you'd do it huh?[/QUOTE]
Because putting words in my mouth is an excellent way to maintain a credible argument.
[QUOTE=Carne;32535695]Legalizing won't help at all. It's not like the cartels are just going to disappear.[/QUOTE]
Sure, they in all likelihood, will not just disappear, but they will lose a large cut of their funding. Which means less money for guns and buying out everyone in power.
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;32535959]I didn't know the Mafia ran half the US[/QUOTE]
I didn't know the cartels run half of mexico
wait they dont thats why
[editline]29th September 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Xenomoose;32540396]I'd rather not legalize the drugs that can actually kill you if you make a mistake guessing the appropriate dosage. You don't see people getting killed by overdosing on cigarettes, do you? Alcohol can kill you if you drink too much, but it's too widespread to make illegal again.[/QUOTE]
Being legal = regulation = safer
[QUOTE=ewitwins;32525088]The thing that people don't realize is that even if we did legalize it (which I'm fine with) the cartels would simply undercut domestic pricing.[/QUOTE]
Uh no, they'd turn to other black market operations.
Sex trade (just as fucked up as this cartel bullshit), black market organ sales, weapons trade, etc.
[QUOTE=NorthernGate;32539684]Well it kind of makes a difference, even if it gets legalized and they do start to lose power they'll still have the power to go out on a rampage if they so choose, fight or flight, and when you have as much power as they do you can be pretty sure that they're going to fight hard.[/QUOTE]
are you stupid on purpose?
the cartels are first and foremost a business. how the fuck would it help them if they became a terrorist organization? where's the profit in blowing up a bus full of people? fear? fear only lasts so long. it would be the dying last breath if it even happened. the smart drug lords would pack up their profits and go commercial, doing away with all the goons and just become a legitimate business.
[editline]29th September 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Xenomoose;32540396][b]I'd rather not legalize the drugs that can actually kill you if you make a mistake guessing the appropriate dosage.[/b] You don't see people getting killed by overdosing on cigarettes, do you? Alcohol can kill you if you drink too much, but it's too widespread to make illegal again.
Because putting words in my mouth is an excellent way to maintain a credible argument.[/QUOTE]
like pharmaceuticals? :downs:
anything can kill you if you overdose on it. legalization would mean regulation, regulation would mean that you wouldn't have to guess, it would be printed on the box.
also he's making fun of your argument that suddenly everyone would start doing coke because its legal.
[editline]29th September 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Ultra Violence;32543526]Uh no, they'd turn to other black market operations.
Sex trade (just as fucked up as this cartel bullshit), black market organ sales, weapons trade, etc.[/QUOTE]
and yet nowhere near the profit margins of the drug trade which would make them common thugs. also legalize the sex trade. it shouldn't be illegal in the first place.
[QUOTE=Xenomoose;32540396]I'd rather not legalize the drugs that can actually kill you if you make a mistake guessing the appropriate dosage. You don't see people getting killed by overdosing on cigarettes, do you? Alcohol can kill you if you drink too much, but it's too widespread to make illegal again.
Because putting words in my mouth is an excellent way to maintain a credible argument.[/QUOTE]
haha you're talking about credible arguments when your first one against legalization was "well everyone will overdose on meth and cocaine!" and hey you realize every drug can kill you if you make a mistake guessing the appropriate dosage right? at the moment prescription drugs kill shitloads of people every year.
personally though i think that if shit like cocaine or meth was made legal, and manufactured by a credible pharmaceutical company it would be far safer than say, someone buying cocaine cut with washing powder or meth made in some assholes trailer
[QUOTE=Kybalt;32544486]and yet nowhere near the profit margins of the drug trade which would make them common thugs. also legalize the sex trade. it shouldn't be illegal in the first place.[/QUOTE]I've been reading your posts and this one would make me laugh if it wasn't so fucking ridiculous. Do some serious research into human trafficking before you post like this. I have to ask, [i]are you fucking kidding me?[/i] I know you meant straight-up prostitution but HE meant something much, much worse. A good deal of that business is fucking disgusting and will never, ever be legal in any country and for damn good reason.
Seriously, are you expecting sane, reasonable people to accept the myriad of hard drugs that the cartels deal in to [i]ever[/i] be legal? Are you fucking insane, dude? Weed, yes, that's understandable, even some of the typical party drugs are iffy in a lot of people's eyes but they aren't very profitable. Why aren't they very profitable? They're not addictive, soul-sucking drugs that will leave you a sad, burned-out shell of a man. The people who buy those drugs, the ones that REALLY make money for cartels, buy them because they're so far in that they can't get out, it's akin to fucking slavery no matter which way you cut it. Don't try to impose on us that stupid, imbecilic argument that legalization is the solution to any social issue regarding drugs. [i]Most of the fucking issues exist [u]because[/u] of the drugs.[/i] You're clearly trying to portray intelligence, but are you honestly expecting everyone who reads your posts to be dumb as shit or something? Legalization worked for prohibition because the demand never went away, it was there prior to, during and after prohibition. It's apples to oranges when you attempt to apply that to the drug war, especially since there's such vast social stigma against even the kiddy shit (like weed) much less the hard drugs.
Not only that, but you opened that post up with, "the cartels are first and foremost a business." Let me tell you, the nature of a black market is it's profitable enough to venture into despite the risks. There will ALWAYS be a reason for the cartels to exist, and they won't be "common thugs" as you predict. They'll be just as malicious, dangerous and terrifying as they are now, just pushing a different product. Contrary to popular belief, they're smart individuals and will find a way. They're not going to go, "oh fuck me! It's legal now! I can put away all my guns, beheading knives and fire all my thugs so I can be an upstanding businessman! Thanks, government!" They have [b]power[/b] and there's no reason to assume they'd give that up.[QUOTE=Kybalt;32544486]are you stupid on purpose?[/QUOTE]Are [i]you?[/i]
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;32546337]I've been reading your posts and this one would make me laugh if it wasn't so fucking ridiculous. Do some serious research into human trafficking before you post like this. I have to ask, [i]are you fucking kidding me?[/i] I know you meant straight-up prostitution but HE meant something much, much worse. A good deal of that business is fucking disgusting and will never, ever be legal in any country and for damn good reason.
Seriously, are you expecting sane, reasonable people to accept the myriad of hard drugs that the cartels deal in to [i]ever[/i] be legal? Are you fucking insane, dude? Weed, yes, that's understandable, even some of the typical party drugs are iffy in a lot of people's eyes but they aren't very profitable. Why aren't they very profitable? They're not addictive, soul-sucking drugs that will leave you a sad, burned-out shell of a man. The people who buy those drugs, the ones that REALLY make money for cartels, buy them because they're so far in that they can't get out, it's akin to fucking slavery no matter which way you cut it. Don't try to impose on us that stupid, imbecilic argument that legalization is the solution to any social issue regarding drugs. [i]Most of the fucking issues exist [u]because[/u] of the drugs.[/i] You're clearly trying to portray intelligence, but are you honestly expecting everyone who reads your posts to be dumb as shit or something? Legalization worked for prohibition because the demand never went away, it was there prior to, during and after prohibition. It's apples to oranges when you attempt to apply that to the drug war, especially since there's such vast social stigma against even the kiddy shit (like weed) much less the hard drugs.
Not only that, but you opened that post up with, "the cartels are first and foremost a business." Let me tell you, the nature of a black market is it's profitable enough to venture into despite the risks. There will ALWAYS be a reason for the cartels to exist, and they won't be "common thugs" as you predict. They'll be just as malicious, dangerous and terrifying as they are now, just pushing a different product. Contrary to popular belief, they're smart individuals and will find a way. They're not going to go, "oh fuck me! It's legal now! I can put away all my guns, beheading knives and fire all my thugs so I can be an upstanding businessman! Thanks, government!" They have [b]power[/b] and there's no reason to assume they'd give that up.Are [i]you?[/i][/QUOTE]
actually sorry but legalisation IS the solution to issues regarding drugs. with regulation comes safety standards which would greatly reduce the danger of the drugs in question, with legalisation comes understanding, so no more addicts being too scared to try and get treatment because they'll be shunned or thrown in prison. and yes noones denying that the cartels wont suddenly disappear, we're arguing that they will lose a shitload of their powerbase (the drug trade is a multi-billion dollar industry) and hey maybe without all that power the police force will have a easier time with dealing with the other criminal shit they get up to?
[QUOTE=Kybalt;32544486]are you stupid on purpose?
the cartels are first and foremost a business. how the fuck would it help them if they became a terrorist organization? where's the profit in blowing up a bus full of people? fear? fear only lasts so long. it would be the dying last breath if it even happened. the smart drug lords would pack up their profits and go commercial, doing away with all the goons and just become a legitimate business.
[editline]29th September 2011[/editline]
like pharmaceuticals? :downs:
anything can kill you if you overdose on it. legalization would mean regulation, regulation would mean that you wouldn't have to guess, it would be printed on the box.
also he's making fun of your argument that suddenly everyone would start doing coke because its legal.
[editline]29th September 2011[/editline]
and yet nowhere near the profit margins of the drug trade which would make them common thugs. also legalize the sex trade. it shouldn't be illegal in the first place.[/QUOTE]
that was mean
Only the heads of the organization would have the smarts and abilities to do anything more with their lives if the drug part of cartel shut down. All of their little minions and what not, most of them don't really have much else they can do if the big dogs abandon them. They don't mind killing people as it is now, it's well possible that they could think, in the heat of their lives going down the toilet, that killing more people could solve their problem. I'm not saying it's going to or is likely to happen but it is a possibility.
No need to be a douche about your opinion bra.
[QUOTE=NorthernGate;32548427]that was mean
Only the heads of the organization would have the smarts and abilities to do anything more with their lives if the drug part of cartel shut down. All of their little minions and what not, most of them don't really have much else they can do if the big dogs abandon them. They don't mind killing people as it is now, it's well possible that they could think, in the heat of their lives going down the toilet, that killing more people could solve their problem. I'm not saying it's going to or is likely to happen but it is a possibility.
No need to be a douche about your opinion bra.[/QUOTE]
they're still killing people every day over there, i don't think we should just keep the status quo because of the possibility of more violence.
I wonder how long it will be before the violence goes through the U.S. border and the cartels start to attack U.S. citizens. Maybe then, the U.S. military will fight them on our border like a conventional enemy.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;32548498]they're still killing people every day over there, i don't think we should just keep the status quo because of the possibility of more violence.[/QUOTE]
Oh, I'm definitely not saying we should let things stay the way they are. I just don't think legalizing it is going to do much for the situation right now, having done so before the Cartel got their boot in the door would have been great.
Right now I think Mexico needs to suck up their ego and ask for some help.
[QUOTE=NorthernGate;32548554]Oh, I'm definitely not saying we should let things stay the way they are. I just don't think legalizing it is going to do much for the situation right now, having done so before the Cartel got their boot in the door would have been great.
Right now I think Mexico needs to suck up their ego and ask for some help.[/QUOTE]
i think it will help to begin gradually taking money away from the cartels. calling in help will do nothing but escalate the conflict further i think.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;32548257]actually sorry but legalisation IS the solution to issues regarding drugs. with regulation comes safety standards which would greatly reduce the danger of the drugs in question, with legalisation comes understanding, so no more addicts being too scared to try and get treatment because they'll be shunned or thrown in prison. and yes noones denying that the cartels wont suddenly disappear, we're arguing that they will lose a shitload of their powerbase (the drug trade is a multi-billion dollar industry) and hey maybe without all that power the police force will have a easier time with dealing with the other criminal shit they get up to?[/QUOTE]While I'll agree with you that legalization and regulation will make some of the drugs safer, in theory, the social issues from the use of those drugs will not go away. There's a good reason why we laugh at coked out movie stars, mostly because they're pathetic. Not only that, but there is absolutely no way the real profit-making drugs the cartels are pushing will ever be legalized. You also won't abolish the social stigma of drug use, not when there's still social stigma about other things much more trivial than substance abuse. The real solution, the quick solution, is something nobody wants to admit out of moral reasoning or fear that we'll "become like them." To effectively combat an enemy like this is to fight him on his level and do it with no mercy and such ferocity that nobody will be stupid enough to take his place. This has worked many, many times before throughout history, but we fancy ourselves as "civil" and disregard such notions as "barbaric." What is truly more barbaric? Allowing a vicious, brutal cycle continuing, perpetuating itself or ending it quickly with enough bloodshed to ensure it won't come back?
To be honest, that will probably happen before hookers and blow are legal.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;32549483]While I'll agree with you that legalization and regulation will make some of the drugs safer, in theory, the social issues from the use of those drugs will not go away. There's a good reason why we laugh at coked out movie stars, mostly because they're pathetic. Not only that, but there is absolutely no way the real profit-making drugs the cartels are pushing will ever be legalized. You also won't abolish the social stigma of drug use, not when there's still social stigma about other things much more trivial than substance abuse. The real solution, the quick solution, is something nobody wants to admit out of moral reasoning or fear that we'll "become like them." To effectively combat an enemy like this is to fight him on his level and do it with no mercy and such ferocity that nobody will be stupid enough to take his place. This has worked many, many times before throughout history, but we fancy ourselves as "civil" and disregard such notions as "barbaric." What is truly more barbaric? Allowing a vicious, brutal cycle continuing, perpetuating itself or ending it quickly with enough bloodshed to ensure it won't come back?
To be honest, that will probably happen before hookers and blow are legal.[/QUOTE]
of course legalisation will make the social issues go away, noone thought anything was wrong with shit like weed or cocaine until it was made illegal. and the whole thing with celebrity drug users is a far different issue. and no that's not the real solution. why do people keep thinking this will work? haven't you seen how far the cartels will escalate things? if they're leaving severed heads outside schools in response to a goddamn strike, what do you think they'll do if the government came after them in the same way? these people are psychopaths. and i would like you to point out when your idea has ever worked throughout history.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;32549889]of course legalisation will make the social issues go away, noone thought anything was wrong with shit like weed or cocaine until it was made illegal. and the whole thing with celebrity drug users is a far different issue. and no that's not the real solution. why do people keep thinking this will work? haven't you seen how far the cartels will escalate things? if they're leaving severed heads outside schools in response to a goddamn strike, what do you think they'll do if the government came after them in the same way? these people are psychopaths. and i would like you to point out when your idea has ever worked throughout history.[/QUOTE]I don't think it will at all, but there's no solid evidence supporting either of our viewpoints. There's evidence, yes, but it's nowhere near conclusive and therefore solid, but let's agree to disagree there. As for the actual dealing with them, the cartels would need to be hit fast, hard and completely without any quarter at all. Yes, they are psychopaths and that's the exact reason why they need to be dealt with in such a swift, brutal manner. They won't learn unless you teach them in the only language they apparently communicate in. If the government (by that I mean not just the Mexican government, they're profoundly inept at this point) does act it should be done with surgical strikes.
Oh, and an example of brutality being a discouragement? The fall of Spartacus. 20km or so of crucified slaves that decided to revolt right alongside the highway. Nobody got wise to the idea for a looooong time and you could honestly argue the Roman slave's position to be a much more desperate one.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;32550033]I don't think it will at all, but there's no solid evidence supporting either of our viewpoints. There's evidence, yes, but it's nowhere near conclusive and therefore solid, but let's agree to disagree there. As for the actual dealing with them, the cartels would need to be hit fast, hard and completely without any quarter at all. Yes, they are psychopaths and that's the exact reason why they need to be dealt with in such a swift, brutal manner. They won't learn unless you teach them in the only language they apparently communicate in. If the government (by that I mean not just the Mexican government, they're profoundly inept at this point) does act it should be done with surgical strikes.
Oh, and an example of brutality being a discouragement? The fall of Spartacus. 20km or so of crucified slaves that decided to revolt right alongside the highway. Nobody got wise to the idea for a looooong time and you could honestly argue the Roman slave's position to be a much more desperate one.[/QUOTE]
no i'm not gonna agree to disagree with you because you're wrong, there IS solid evidence supporting my view point (such as the situation in portugal) and there's none supporting yours. you realize that for this entire drug war these cartels have been doing all this shit to each other? they're used to dealing with this brutality. and lol, surgical strikes against groups that don't have a central command and don't wear uniforms (unless it's the soldiers who have been bribed to work for the cartels that is!) and who blend into the civilian populace?? good luck with that.
and no that example isn't relevant at all. that was an uprising of a weak group against a far stronger one, the cartels are already established and very powerful.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;32549483]While I'll agree with you that legalization and regulation will make some of the drugs safer, in theory, the social issues from the use of those drugs will not go away. There's a good reason why we laugh at coked out movie stars, mostly because they're pathetic. Not only that, but there is absolutely no way the real profit-making drugs the cartels are pushing will ever be legalized. You also won't abolish the social stigma of drug use, not when there's still social stigma about other things much more trivial than substance abuse. The real solution, the quick solution, is something nobody wants to admit out of moral reasoning or fear that we'll "become like them." To effectively combat an enemy like this is to fight him on his level and do it with no mercy and such ferocity that nobody will be stupid enough to take his place. This has worked many, many times before throughout history, but we fancy ourselves as "civil" and disregard such notions as "barbaric." What is truly more barbaric? Allowing a vicious, brutal cycle continuing, perpetuating itself or ending it quickly with enough bloodshed to ensure it won't come back?
To be honest, that will probably happen before hookers and blow are legal.[/QUOTE]
What gives you the idea that marijuana isn't a significant part of Mexican cartel profits? Hard drug production is mostly limited to other countries and trafficked through Mexico; for this reason profits are relegated for Mexican Cartels. The consensus percentage of profits from marijuana, the estimate given by the U.S. government, is 50%-60% ([url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/06/AR2009100603847.html[/url]), with one very biased study by RAND contesting this. This study gives an extremely low estimate of marijuana revenues by deriving them from individual usage, even though cartels are a whole-sell organizations; even then they acknowledge that it could represent up to a quarter of cartel profits. ([url]http://www.rand.org/pubs/occasional_papers/2010/RAND_OP325.pdf[/url])
Furthermore, what gives you the impression that anyone is calling for the social stigma to be solved? That's the moral issue if anything.
[editline]30th September 2011[/editline]
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;32550099]no i'm not gonna agree to disagree with you because you're wrong, there IS solid evidence supporting my view point (such as the situation in portugal) and there's none supporting yours. you realize that for this entire drug war these cartels have been doing all this shit to each other? they're used to dealing with this brutality. and lol, surgical strikes against groups that don't have a central command and don't wear uniforms (unless it's the soldiers who have been bribed to work for the cartels that is!) and who blend into the civilian populace?? good luck with that.
and no that example isn't relevant at all. that was an uprising of a weak group against a far stronger one, the cartels are already established and very powerful.[/QUOTE]
Also this.
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;32550099]no i'm not gonna agree to disagree with you because you're wrong, there IS solid evidence supporting my view point (such as the situation in portugal) and there's none supporting yours. you realize that for this entire drug war these cartels have been doing all this shit to each other? they're used to dealing with this brutality. and lol, surgical strikes against groups that don't have a central command and don't wear uniforms (unless it's the soldiers who have been bribed to work for the cartels that is!) and who blend into the civilian populace?? good luck with that.
and no that example isn't relevant at all. that was an uprising of a weak group against a far stronger one, the cartels are already established and very powerful.[/QUOTE]You want evidence supporting my view point? Alaska attempted legalization, didn't work, went back to being criminalized. Also, Portugal has not legalized the use, and you could argue the therapy and aggressive campaigns to get drug users help did far more than decriminalization. Dealers, distributors and producers are still prosecuted under the full extent of the law. So, no, there isn't solid evidence that [i]legalization[/i] solves anything. Combating the effects of the drugs and treatment of users does. As for surgical strikes, do you think ANY insurgent group, anywhere have ever worn a fucking uniform, dude? We did it in Vietnam, the Bosnian War, Kosovo War, Iraq, Afghanistan and as far as I can tell, attacking them where they hide DOES show results. There is a central command, there are known centers of operation, there's storehouses, supply buildings and everything else a military needs to fight. Are you seriously implying that the USAF is severely underpowered compared to the cartels? The worse they could do is throw a hissy fit, kill some people and we'd just hammer the shit out of them all over again. We wouldn't even need to cross an ocean to do it, we could even launch cruise missiles from our bases right onto them! They're powerful, yes, but so much more so than they are. The only thing that stands in our way is lack of casus belli and the Mexican government.
In fact, you know what? That was a shit example, at least Spartacus had a chance.[QUOTE=Billiam;32550706]What gives you the idea that marijuana isn't a significant part of Mexican cartel profits? Hard drug production is mostly limited to other countries and trafficked through Mexico; for this reason profits are relegated for Mexican Cartels. The consensus percentage of profits from marijuana, the estimate given by the U.S. government, is 50%-60% ([url]http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/10/06/AR2009100603847.html[/url]), with one very biased study by RAND contesting this. This study gives an extremely low estimate of marijuana revenues by deriving them from individual usage, even though cartels are a whole-sell organizations; even then they acknowledge that it could represent up to a quarter of cartel profits. ([url]http://www.rand.org/pubs/occasional_papers/2010/RAND_OP325.pdf[/url])[/QUOTE]Fine, let's say it's a quarter of their profits just for shits and giggles. Those profits aren't going to go anywhere once marijuana is legal, regulated and taxed. They may diminish somewhat, but to be perfectly honest with you the black market for marijuana won't disappear at all. It's been how long since prohibition? There's still a black market for alcohol, because it's "the good shit." As long as a black market exists, the cartels will seek to gain profit from it because they can. Who's going to stop them, really? You? Me? The fucking Mexican government that's failed miserably for seven fucking years straight? It's my opinion that this is well beyond mere business, this is about power and control now and that's when it gets really dangerous.[QUOTE=Billiam;32550706]Furthermore, what gives you the impression that anyone is calling for the social stigma to be solved? That's the moral issue if anything.[/QUOTE]That social stigma looms over everything. Prevents the legalization or decriminalization for one. That's a very good reason for the "moral issue" to be resolved if you want anything done. Also it could contribute to lack of proper care (one of the reasons why Portugal is doing so well) addicts need to kick the habit.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;32551339]You want evidence supporting my view point? Alaska attempted legalization, didn't work, went back to being criminalized. Also, Portugal has not legalized the use, and you could argue the therapy and aggressive campaigns to get drug users help did far more than decriminalization. Dealers, distributors and producers are still prosecuted under the full extent of the law. So, no, there isn't solid evidence that [i]legalization[/i] solves anything. Combating the effects of the drugs and treatment of users does. As for surgical strikes, do you think ANY insurgent group, anywhere have ever worn a fucking uniform, dude? We did it in Vietnam, the Bosnian War, Kosovo War, Iraq, Afghanistan and as far as I can tell, attacking them where they hide DOES show results. There is a central command, there are known centers of operation, there's storehouses, supply buildings and everything else a military needs to fight. Are you seriously implying that the USAF is severely underpowered compared to the cartels? The worse they could do is throw a hissy fit, kill some people and we'd just hammer the shit out of them all over again. We wouldn't even need to cross an ocean to do it, we could even launch cruise missiles from our bases right onto them! They're powerful, yes, but so much more so than they are. The only thing that stands in our way is lack of casus belli and the Mexican government.
In fact, you know what? That was a shit example, at least Spartacus had a chance.[/QUOTE]
got any linkage for this alaska thing? never heard about it. and well, decriminalisation sure helped to reduce the social stigma of drug use and has made people more willing to come out and ask for rehab which is kinda what we were talking about with that anyway? and i don't know if those are very good examples of success in fighting an insurgent force.... and i don't think you understand, the cartels are still pretty much part of the civilian population, i still don't see how you can fight them in such conventional ways.
If the cartel is so powerful, why don't they start a revolution themselves?
[QUOTE=BCell;32552120]If the cartel is so powerful, why don't they start a revolution themselves?[/QUOTE]
because it's not "the cartel" there's shitloads of them. the only significant cartel losses are caused by other cartels not the government.
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