Fucking awesome
Say what you will about her, I think she's more than served an acceptable sentence, even if I did hold what she did against her. 35 years was [I]always[/I] excessive. I think the trans community will welcome her with open arms.
I guess this is like a 'last two weeks I don't have to deal with the fallout of anything not illegal so haha fuck all y'alls' kind of thing?
[QUOTE=nox;51685812]To anyone who is against this, I know of a land where you can enjoy zero government transparency and being lied to; North Korea.[/QUOTE]
Snowden was a better whistleblower and his country turned his back on him. I'm pissed he wont get better treatment.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;51685853]Exposing the crimes and other problems as Manning did was a genuinely good thing. But the main issue a lot of people (who aren't rabidly against her because of "pratriotism" or bigotry) see with it was how scattergun the data was. I've not had a look at it, but what I've seen written about it claims the following; It wasn't curated very well, a lot of data that didn't need to be released was just thrown out there. And that it wasn't redacted totally, so any sensitive information about informants or positions could have been exposed.
One issue with whistleblowing is that the official avenues for doing it tend to be rife with collusion, so the guys you're exposing know you did it, and will do everything they can do fuck with you. But going through Wikileaks or similar groups is hugely risky as they don't give a single fuck about what they're publishing, as long is it paints their target of the month negatively. Even if it is to the detriment of innocent people mentioned in the documents.[/QUOTE]
Good point, the lack of redacts was pretty horrifying. Especially considering that identities of US interpreters and informants were leaked. Pretty surprising that WikiLeaks hardly took any steps to curate the documents considering their commitment to sanitizing leaks for credit card numbers, socials, and other personal info. Assange himself has even touted WikiLeaks' skill in this regard, although in this case it was too little too late.
[QUOTE=niiiiiiiiok;51685784]Honestly, I still try to like obama but fucking seriously?[/QUOTE]
This is a step forward for protection for whistleblowers. What's your beef with it?
[QUOTE=mcharest;51685786]Exposing war crimes and other illegal/immoral behavior isn't treason; it's patriotism.
If you've got an issue with Chelsea Manning or Edward Snowden, take it up with the people and agencies whose behavior they exposed - don't shoot the messenger.[/QUOTE]
The little good she did does not excuse the wreckless release of information which put people in danger. No one really gave a shit about her till they found out she was trying killing herself and just happened to be trans. Then suddenly it became a humanitarian crisis.
Fuck all them people put into danger right.
Well that sucks, why is commuting sentences even a thing? Most people that got commuted by presidents seem like theyre actually guilty...
7 years sounds pretty good. She served her time for crimes she has committed (I hope nobody's denying that she committed a crime when she as a member of the military leaked classified military information, damning though it may be), and there's no point keeping her imprisoned anymore.
[QUOTE=Judas;51685609]I hope the trump administration doesn't reverse it[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=evilweazel;51685748]Hopefully, this is something a new administration can put a halt to or reverse.[/QUOTE]
A President can revoke a sentence but he cannot impose a sentence. If the person has been pardoned, there is nothing another President can do to reinstate it, aside from possibly challenging it in court and trying to get the pardon ruled as invalid due to a technicality.
[QUOTE=mcharest;51685786]Exposing war crimes and other illegal/immoral behavior isn't treason; it's patriotism.
If you've got an issue with Chelsea Manning or Edward Snowden, take it up with the people and agencies whose behavior they exposed - don't shoot the messenger.[/QUOTE]
I thought that Manning was the one that did the document dump with no redaction, editing, or anything else that put a bunch of people in danger
[QUOTE=Lambeth;51685758]Probably because she was sent to trial and imprisoned almost immediately.[/QUOTE]
Well yeah, because we have the 6th amendment.
[editline]17th January 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=phygon;51685940]I thought that Manning was the one that did the document dump with no redaction, editing, or anything else that put a bunch of people in danger[/QUOTE]
You'd think that and you're right.
Of fucking course he did
[QUOTE=Sally;51685872]Snowden was a better whistleblower and his country turned his back on him. I'm pissed he wont get better treatment.[/QUOTE]
He is? I mean he ran to Russia and they've picked his brain for secrets and goingons at the NSA, his execution was less than stellar.
fuck obama for locking up this patriotic whistleblower!
fuck obama for releasing this traitor to the republic!
[QUOTE=Saxon;51685966]He is? I mean he ran to Russia and they've picked his brain for secrets and goingons at the NSA, his execution was less than stellar.[/QUOTE]
The smart ones aren't currently in a US prison either, so keep that in mind.
I'd rather see a pardon for Snowden. At least he worked with the press to redact dangerous information. Manning was reckless.
People want to pardon Snowden even though he hasn't been convicted of a crime yet. You need to be convicted of a crime before you may be pardoned.
[QUOTE=J$ Psychotic;51686040]People want to pardon Snowden even though he hasn't been convicted of a crime yet. You need to be convicted of a crime before you may be pardoned.[/QUOTE]
Not true. Nixon was pardoned by Ford despite never being charged with a crime. Ford preemptively pardoned him for the Watergate scandal.
[QUOTE=abcpea;51685998]fuck obama for locking up this patriotic whistleblower!
fuck obama for releasing this traitor to the republic![/QUOTE]
This is why he didnt do it earlier. Did not want it to be used against the dems during the election
[QUOTE=FlandersNed;51685556]Good, but I won't be impressed unless he pardons Snowden.[/QUOTE]
I'm under the impression that the president can't pardon a person that hasn't been trialed and found guilty first?
[editline]17th January 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;51686061]Not true. Nixon was pardoned by Ford despite never being charged with a crime. Ford preemptively pardoned him for the Watergate scandal.[/QUOTE]
Oh ok.
[QUOTE=rilez;51686028]I'd rather see a pardon for Snowden. At least he worked with the press to redact dangerous information. Manning was reckless.[/QUOTE]
Wikileaks was reckless imo. Snowden had the benefit of coming after Manning and he read up on her case to avoid the same mistakes.
[QUOTE=Medevila;51685624]Um, Manning instead of Snowden? that's surprising[/QUOTE]
I mean, I guess Manning stood there and took it, while Snowden became an international fugitive of sorts.
If Snowden had stayed put and let himself get jailed for the rest of his life, Obama probably would've let him out. I mean, fuck I know, but it seems like it'd be really bad form to pardon someone who's voluntarily exiled themselves and is now in the hands of your newly-belligerent rival world power.
Nice of him to pardon a traitor. Surprised he didn't pardon Bergdahl while he was at it.
[QUOTE=Snake7;51685712]She exposed war crimes and as a reward was looking forward to a life of solitary confinement or worse as a reward. If even Obama "drone strike Mcgee" knows that's wrong it's ridiculous people are mad about this.[/QUOTE]
She didnt just expose warcrimes, she dumped a lot of compromising data onto the web that pit her brothers and sisters in arms into danger. She didnt follow proper whistleblowing procedures at all. What she did wasnt heroic or patriotic, it was blatantly reckless and treasonous.
She had good things in mind when she did this and didnt intend to put others in danger, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. She deserves better treatment in prison but her trial and sentencing is completely justified.
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51686491]She didnt just expose warcrimes, she dumped a lot of compromising data onto the web that pit her brothers and sisters in arms into danger. She didnt follow proper whistleblowing procedures at all. What she did wasnt heroic or patriotic, it was blatantly reckless and treasonous.
She had good things in mind when she did this and didnt intend to put others in danger, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. She deserves better treatment in prison but her trial and sentencing is completely justified.[/QUOTE]
Didnt it list the names of Afghan coalition collaborators and interpreters also?
This irks me a little. I wonder if this still would've happened if Manning hadn't transitioned and become a symbol of identity politics.
[QUOTE=Swiket;51685642]one of them is chillin in russia and the other was about to be handed over to [b]president wario[/b][/QUOTE]
Now that's just rude and uncalled for. No reason to be so unfair and drag Wario's name through the mud like that.
[editline]17th January 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=KommradKommisar;51685681]At least joe taxpayer and I don't have to pay for her surgery.[/QUOTE]
Yea. It's going to something useful like Senator Joe Scoundrel's paycheck.
[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;51686491]She didnt just expose warcrimes, she dumped a lot of compromising data onto the web that pit her brothers and sisters in arms into danger. She didnt follow proper whistleblowing procedures at all. What she did wasnt heroic or patriotic, it was blatantly reckless and treasonous.
She had good things in mind when she did this and didnt intend to put others in danger, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. She deserves better treatment in prison but her trial and sentencing is completely justified.[/QUOTE]
Snowden was no better.
I don't understand how people fell for this myth that these two were anything other than traitorous shitbags:
[url]http://intelligence.house.gov/uploadedfiles/hpsci_snowden_review_declassified.pdf[/url]
[QUOTE=L'Citizen;51686837]Yea. It's going to something useful like Senator Joe Scoundrel's paycheck.[/QUOTE]
At least some of us voted for Senator Scoundrel.
[QUOTE=Saxon;51685966]He is? I mean he ran to Russia and they've picked his brain for secrets and goingons at the NSA, his execution was less than stellar.[/QUOTE]
He didn't put American lives at risk so his execution was great in that respect
[QUOTE=Sally;51686944]He didn't put American lives at risk so his execution was great in that respect[/QUOTE]
Uh, he kinda did.
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