Victory for paid mod boycotters: Valve removes payment feature from TES: Skyrim area of the Steam Wo - Polidicks

[QUOTE=geel9;47618632]You don't have to. They don't have to give you shit for free, and you don't have to buy their shit. It's a basic fucking concept dude come on [/QUOTE] My digestive system puts forth more effort to create shit than most of the GMod community puts forth to create theirs. I would know, I came from and left there.

[QUOTE=andrewmcwatters;47618658]My digestive system puts forth more effort to create shit than most of the GMod community puts forth to create theirs. I would know, I came from and left there.[/QUOTE] Congratulations! You did nothing to contribute to the discussion, or provide a countargument in any way.

You confuse entitlement with value. There's no value there. There's so little value you can just about scalp it from communities from CoderHire, etc. But there's nothing there.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618655]YOU ARE NOT FUCKING ENTITLED TO FREE THINGS HOLY FUCK[/QUOTE] Oh but I am entitled to buy unofficial DLC now, right?

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47618576]Taking photographs is a different field entirely so much so that the analogy you gave is fucking worthless[/QUOTE] So are all the other analogies and hypothetical situations that people brought up, really. It was a good idea, implemented horribly, and the community went apeshit and started bouncing off the walls over it. Sure, Valve and Beth are to blame for setting the stage for this shitshow, but the so-called community is what really made it fun to watch. [I]blah blah[/I] PAYWALL [I]blah blah[/I] FREE THE MODS [i]blah[/i] KILL GABEN [i]blah[/i] MODDERS DO IT FOR PASSION/COMMUNITY/SEXUAL FAVORS I'm ready for the boxes.

[QUOTE=andrewmcwatters;47618669]You confuse entitlement with value. There's no value there. There's so little value you can just about scalp it from communities from CoderHire, etc. But there's nothing there.[/QUOTE] Don't give a shit. You don't get it for free just because you WAAAAAANT to. [QUOTE=bdd458;47618670]Oh but I am entitled to buy unofficial DLC now, right?[/QUOTE] Yes. You are. Jesus Christ. Content has value. Content is not free. Time is money. People do not have to work for free.

Do you honestly think someone from CoderHire's old community, for instance, should be able to make a living off their stuff? What makes any other mod community better? They're so close in comparison. I've come from HaloMods, the Elder Scolls mod community, and Facepunch's GMod community. I've seen and made several game modifications, and I'm struggling to create my own full fledged game and engine, but I still haven't produced real value that I believe in that isn't fucking consumers over. I can understand you being a greedy fuck considering you monetize hats as well, but wow you're so disconnected I could understand if you had a hat for your ass cheeks, too since your head is so far up your rectum you can't see the light.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618655]YOU ARE NOT FUCKING ENTITLED TO FREE THINGS HOLY FUCK[/QUOTE] Why is a shitty car maker allowed to sell a death trap? Why is a modded allowed to sell a broke mod? What the fuck do you want? The fucking Wild West of mods? Yeah that's really great for fucking no one

[QUOTE=geel9;47618632]The 25% cut is far too low (it is, however, up from 0%), and the issues of copyright infringement and game compatibility are real -- but there are already laws to protect from copyright infringement. That's not a new scenario. [/QUOTE] If a mod creator sells one unit of a 25 cent mod, he will get back 25% of that purchase, which would be 6.25 cents, rounded out to about 6 cents. So, in reality, the creator doesn't get back 25%, but actually less than that. In addition, the creator must make 400 dollars worth of sales to get the full cut back. If the mod creator wants to get his first paycheck, he must sell a whopping 1600 units to get paid. Even without the massive negative backlash, it would be near impossible to thrive on this sort of money. That being said, the creator would make an exponential amount of money through donations rather than selling mods.

I didn't think it was that bad of an idea at first, but it was pretty terribly implemented so I'm glad it's gone.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618688]Don't give a shit. You don't get it for free just because you WAAAAAANT to. Yes. You are. Jesus Christ. Content has value. Content is not free. Time is money. People do not have to work for free.[/QUOTE] You never answered my question: [QUOTE=Starlight 456;47618652]Can you explain why donations don't work, but for some reason people will willingly spend a dollar or two on a mod if they're forced to? If someone isn't going to pay, they're not going to pay, period. Locking it behind a paywall just means less people use what the modder put time and effort into.[/QUOTE] Can you explain why you think this?

[QUOTE=andrewmcwatters;47618703]Do you honestly think someone from CoderHire's old community, for instance, should be able to make a living off their stuff? What makes any other mod community better? They're so close in comparison. I've come from HaloMods, the Elder Scolls mod community, and Facepunch's GMod community. I've seen and made several game modifications, and I'm struggling to create my own full fledged game and engine, but I still haven't produced real value that I believe in that isn't fucking consumers over. I can understand you being a greedy fuck considering you monetize hats as well, but wow you're so disconnected I could understand if you had a hat for your ass cheeks, too since your head is so far up your rectum you can't see the light.[/QUOTE] They don't necessarily deserve to make a living, you just don't deserve their content for free. They won't make a living if their content is shit. You don't deserve their shit for free. [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47618704]Why is a shitty car maker allowed to sell a death trap? Why is a modded allowed to sell a broke mod? What the fuck do you want? The fucking Wild West of mods? Yeah that's really great for fucking no one[/QUOTE] No, I want content creators to be able to sell mods. Obviously there are legitimate issues that I agree with but nobody cares about that -- all anyone cares about is getting MUH FREE CONTENT.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618688] You are. Jesus Christ. Content has value. Content is not free. Time is money. People do not have to work for free.[/QUOTE] Modding is a fucking hobby and will never be anything more. It is NOT a job or career, you can NOT make a career of just editing other peoples games. and I fucking make mods. I've helped beta test mods, I know a lot of fucking modders and they all think this was a bad fucking idea. If anyone is entitled its [B]YOU[/B] for thinking you need money for every fucking thing you do in life.

[QUOTE=Starlight 456;47618717]You never answered my question: Can you explain why you think this?[/QUOTE] Because if something is available for free people will take it for free. If you have to pay for something you want as opposed to having the [b]option[/b] of donating then it drives more sales. Fewer people will download the mod but revenue will be massively higher.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47618704]Why is a shitty car maker allowed to sell a death trap? Why is a modded allowed to sell a broke mod? What the fuck do you want? The fucking Wild West of mods? Yeah that's really great for fucking no one[/QUOTE] Wasn't there a 24-hour refund period?

[QUOTE=bdd458;47618721]Modding is a fucking hobby and will never be anything more. It is NOT a job or career, you can NOT make a career of just editing other peoples games. and I fucking make mods. I've helped beta test mods, I know a lot of fucking modders and they all think this was a bad fucking idea. If anyone is entitled its [B]YOU[/B] for thinking you need money for every fucking thing you do in life.[/QUOTE] Good job actually reading what I said, genius. You're just spouting the same stupid entitled cheap bullshit everyone else is without thinking about what you're actually saying. MODDING IS A HOBBY BECAUSE NOBODY WAS ALLOWED TO SELL THEIR SHIT BEFORE NOW, GENIUS.

[QUOTE=Kljunas;47618735]Wasn't there a 24-hour refund period?[/QUOTE] refund was in steam funbux.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618733]Because if something is available for free people will take it for free. If you have to pay for something you want as opposed to having the [b]option[/b] of donating then it drives more sales. Fewer people will download the mod but revenue will be massively higher.[/QUOTE] That doesn't mean anything that revenue will be higher. A penny would be higher then nothing. And you would get pennies if you sold your mod through the steam store with how Valve had it set up. "If you like what I do, send some money my way" is demonstrably more effective then "Give me a buck or you get nothing".

[QUOTE=Kljunas;47618735]Wasn't there a 24-hour refund period?[/QUOTE] Yeah so you have one chance to catch the bugs in a mod and decide you don't want it before you're fucked forever. You have no recourse outside of that window

[QUOTE=geel9;47618718]They don't necessarily deserve to make a living, you just don't deserve their content for free. They won't make a living if their content is shit. You don't deserve their shit for free. No, I want content creators to be able to sell mods. Obviously there are legitimate issues that I agree with but nobody cares about that -- all anyone cares about is getting MUH FREE CONTENT.[/QUOTE] Hey you know what, you're a business oriented person who seems to give more shits about making a profit than producing something that isn't shit, why don't you go an run some numbers for me and give me an example of one person who is making at least minimum wage. In fact, why don't you at least give me an example of a modification that is worth my money. I mean, hey, most modifications have been redone to hell and back but they're still worth money right? Or so [I]you'd[/I] believe I'm sure.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47618755]Yeah so you have one chance to catch the bugs in a mod and decide you don't want it before you're fucked forever. You have no recourse outside of that window[/QUOTE] And that's a serious problem that should be addressed. [editline]28th April 2015[/editline] [QUOTE=andrewmcwatters;47618756]Hey you know what, you're a business oriented person who seems to give more shits about making a profit than producing something that isn't shit, why don't you go an run some numbers for me and give me an example of one person who is making at least minimum wage. In fact, why don't you at least give me an example of a modification that is worth my money. I mean, hey, most modifications have been redone to hell and back but they're still worth money right? Or so [I]you'd[/I] believe I'm sure.[/QUOTE] It's not about if the business model is viable, it's about content creators being forced to give their shit away for free. I've said this a thousand times. You don't have to make a [b]living[/b] off something to be [b]allowed to sell it.[/b]

[QUOTE=geel9;47618740]Good job actually reading what I said, genius. You're just spouting the same stupid entitled cheap bullshit everyone else is without thinking about what you're actually saying. MODDING IS A HOBBY BECAUSE NOBODY WAS ALLOWED TO SELL THEIR SHIT BEFORE NOW, GENIUS.[/QUOTE] Nobody said anybody wasn't allowed to sell their mods. We just said that the method which this was implemented was absolute shit.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618718]No, I want content creators to be able to sell mods. Obviously there are legitimate issues that I agree with but nobody cares about that -- all anyone cares about is getting MUH FREE CONTENT.[/QUOTE] Can you understand why people are apprehensive about being charged for more content when games still cost $60 new and are almost guaranteed to have paid DLC? Especially when a lot of the content in the workshop can be considered little more than a bugfix or incremental gameplay improvement?

In fact geel, what have [I]you[/I] made that is worth anyone's money? Can you give me an example? Hell even scrap.tf in all its entirety is a redone concept.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618757]It's not about if the business model is viable, it's about content creators being forced to give their shit away for free. I've said this a thousand times. You don't have to make a [b]living[/b] off something to be [b]allowed to sell it.[/b][/QUOTE] If being *forced* to give away shit for free was the problem, there wouldn't be a modding community of any sort, whatsoever.

[QUOTE=andrewmcwatters;47618775]In fact geel, what have [I]you[/I] made that is worth anyone's money? Can you give me an example? Hell even scrap.tf in all its entirety is a redone concept.[/QUOTE] It's worth whatever money people give me. That's kind of how capitalism works. As a content creator I'm allowed to charge a fee for my services. A very large amount of people have found my services to be worth that fee.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618757]And that's a serious problem that should be addressed. [editline]28th April 2015[/editline] It's not about if the business model is viable, it's about content creators being forced to give their shit away for free. I've said this a thousand times. You don't have to make a [b]living[/b] off something to be [b]allowed to sell it.[/b][/QUOTE] Nobody will buy mods eventually if they're forced to pay for them by people who think babies first 3DS Max model is worth a dollar.

[QUOTE=Starlight 456;47618783]Nobody will buy mods eventually if they're forced to pay for them by people who think babies first 3DS Max model is worth a dollar.[/QUOTE] You don't have to buy shitty mods.

[QUOTE=geel9;47618784]You don't have to buy shitty mods.[/QUOTE] But it's the shitty mods charging a dollar for baby's first 3DS Max model that really exposed the flaws in Valve's system, and their idea of the self-managed community market.

[QUOTE=Protocol7;47618797]But it's the shitty mods charging a dollar for baby's first 3DS Max model that really exposed the flaws in Valve's system.[/QUOTE] Okay, and those are downvoted and not purchased. Same as every other group of products in the world that has shitty products.