Victory for paid mod boycotters: Valve removes payment feature from TES: Skyrim area of the Steam Wo - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Vipes;47613520]I'm just peeved they folded and kinda acting just a tiny bit childish. I mean the idea was good, somewhat. All they had to do was make it so that it's donations only. But instead they went the "my way or no way" route.[/QUOTE] What the fuck They saw the community reaction, which was *overwhelmingly* negative, the general opinion saying "no, stop, this is bad," and so they go "alright," and stop, even admitting that they weren't going along with the best idea. Where in hell do you get childish from this in the least?

[video=youtube;MdN0NXgjsn8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MdN0NXgjsn8[/video]

I would have liked to have seen it more as "pay what you want" instead of "pay this amount to get it". I do hope they bring it back in a much better way that doesn't screw the community over and gives back to the mod makers.

[QUOTE=usaokay;47613539]The Skyrim mod quality check album[/QUOTE] what is this?

[QUOTE=LegndNikko;47613606]What the fuck They saw the community reaction, which was *overwhelmingly* negative, the general opinion saying "no, stop, this is bad," and so they go "alright," and stop, even admitting that they weren't going along with the best idea. Where in hell do you get childish from this in the least?[/QUOTE] They had in the works a donation like feature, and well, guess what's going to happen to that? They removed everything.

I wish Valve had gotten it right, I'm not against people getting some sort of payment so they can keep going on with their work. I hope that if they come back they come back 100 percent better.

Good. They finally wise up.

[QUOTE=robotman5;47613591]They should have made it a donation button in the first place.[/QUOTE] They have no obligation or business incentive to start handling your donations. Just link to your paypal donation button or your Patreon or whatever. Paid mods as a concept isn't bad, but I agree that starting with Skyrim as a testbed was a pretty bad decision. Community exploded over that one. Should've started with Cities: Skylines or something, would've been far more straightforward.

[QUOTE=ColdWave;47613527]Jesus Christ this was literally the most autistic idea ever[/QUOTE] Yeah this was definitely the most "pertaining to, or having autism" idea ever

[QUOTE=WhyNott;47613501]Can people like valve again now[/QUOTE] fuck that the damage is done. but anyway AYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

This is why I like VALVe as a company, they are happy to admit they have screwed up and try and make things better. Hopefully now they can focus on making it an acceptable service to everyone.

[QUOTE=toaster468;47613543]Yeah mod developers don't deserve money. We better keep them and valve in line...[/QUOTE] Cue exact same argument number 900, seriously read up before making these types of assumptions, it's not about whether the modders "deserved" the money or not. Anyways, amazingly, the consumers had a victory..?

[QUOTE=Jsm;47613666]This is why I like VALVe as a company, they are happy to admit they have screwed up and try and make things better. Hopefully now they can focus on making it an acceptable service to everyone.[/QUOTE] i really doubt they did this because "they admit they have screwed up" and more "oh shit 99% of the community is calling us out on this"

People's faith in Valve has already been falling for the past few years so don't view this as "Now people can like Valve again." I do respect them for openly admitting they made a mistake, though.

[QUOTE=TheWhiteFox1;47613674]i really doubt they did this because "they admit they have screwed up" and more "oh shit 99% of the community is calling us out on this"[/QUOTE] That is admitting that they have screwed up, by listening to the community they are accepting that they made a poor decision.

I once paid 10€ for a mod. Which is how I found facepunch

[QUOTE=Jsm;47613682]That is admitting that they have screwed up, by listening to the community they are accepting that they made a poor decision.[/QUOTE] To be honest, it was kind of a shitty apology, it's clear they think the community is wrong but decided to back down anyways, which is respectful, considering most companies would just go "Fuck you guys, money!" [QUOTE=opaali;47613683]I once paid 10€ for a mod. Which is how I found facepunch[/QUOTE] oh my god it's like im in a time machine Garry's mod transcended mod status and became it's own game is it that hard to understand

[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;47613686]To be honest, it was kind of a shitty apology, it's clear they think the community is wrong but decided to back down anyways, which is respectful, considering most companies would just go "Fuck you guys, money!"[/QUOTE] Did you actually read it. This bit makes it pretty clear that they didn't understand what they were getting into. Hardly a shitty apology. [quote]We understand our own game's communities pretty well, but stepping into an established, years old modding community in Skyrim was probably not the right place to start iterating.[/quote]

[QUOTE=Te Great Skeeve;47613669]Cue exact same argument number 900, seriously read up before making these types of assumptions, it's not about whether the modders "deserved" the money or not. Anyways, amazingly, the consumers had a victory..?[/QUOTE] You'd be just as ignorant and childish to assume there was no arguments [b]for[/b] this. I was initially excited for the idea but let down by how poorly valve moderated it, and the revenue split. Modders are content creators and allowing them to sell their hard work is a good thing.

Like I said before, it should have been a Workshop tip jar. Make a big to do about it, give away steam trading cards to encourage tipping. Valve would take a percentage of the tip and offset the pennies they lose from the cards, Bethesda takes a percentage, and the mod maker gets at least 50% of the tip. People will tip good mods, mod makers they like, and there's no incentive to shit out the crap they were using as poster children for paid mods. Mods stay free, better mods are encouraged, mod makers get paid, Valve and Bethesda get paid. Everybody is happy.

[QUOTE=ColdWave;47613527]Jesus Christ this was literally the most autistic idea ever, I understand Garry's point on the matter but I'm pretty sure Garry didn't just make a shitty half working badly textured armor set to get him his millionaire status. Garry put in some real work and came out on the other side with an original and interesting idea, that is how you should get your money. Now when someone takes Skyrim and converts it into something totally different, original and interesting let me know, I might cast a few bucks out.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=opaali;47613683]I once paid 10€ for a mod. Which is how I found facepunch[/QUOTE] garrys comparison fell short in that regard. i didnt even realize there was a backlash against him for gmod 10, i was only 14ish when it came out but i thought it was well worth buying it day 1 considering the overhaul to it. there is a clear difference between a complete overhaul to a game or a mod just utilizing the engine/assets, and a mod that adds additional content to a game. with a game like skyrim it just becomes a nickel and dime situation because you are going to end up having to shell $50-100 on small mods if you want to mod it out like you use to be able to. i wouldnt mind it if big mods with talented people came out and were paid for, or if smaller mods had a donation button, but with donations people would probably be more salty that 75% of their donation doesnt even go to the creator. [QUOTE=Vipes;47613520]I'm just peeved they folded and kinda acting just a tiny bit childish. I mean the idea was good, somewhat. All they had to do was make it so that it's donations only. But instead they went the "my way or no way" route.[/QUOTE] when the response is so bad, its better to take it out and then if they decide to go another direction put it in later fixed up, rather than have people get more and more salty towards them.

[QUOTE=usaokay;47613619]Personally, I think that despite Valve pulling the payable modding, the system already created an adverse effect in the Skyrim modding community. Modders are now more aware that they should gain some stipend for taking the time to create mods. Some of which will lock out an update of their most popular creations behind a paywall because they know people want it. Valve already removed the Skyrim workshop payment system from their store, but those modders will find a way to get some money.[/QUOTE] I made a few small mods for Oblivion in the past, even after this I'd never even consider trying to sell a mod since modding has never been about making a profit, sure donations are nice but actually selling it, nope.

[QUOTE=Limed00d;47613498]I was never against it, but I can agree the implementation + presentation was horrid. suddently implementing the feature without any sort of announcement a week or so beforehand was a bad move on its own, and 25% is way too small, maybe 50%-75% would have been more fair. other than that, though, I would welcome a comeback gladly.[/QUOTE] I think its stupid to just straight out the box scrap it rather then try to iterate and improve it. But they probably will iterate on it, it just won't be with skyrim.

[QUOTE=Elspin;47613700]You'd be just as ignorant and childish to assume there was no arguments [B]for[/B] this. I was initially excited for the idea but let down by how poorly valve moderated it, and the revenue split. Modders are content creators and allowing them to sell their hard work is a good thing.[/QUOTE] I don't know where you got that from that particular comment, I am perfectly aware there are good arguments for having it, but the way valve did it was out of line. Assumptions are fun!! [QUOTE=Cold;47613715]I think its stupid to just straight out the box scrap it rather then try to iterate and improve it. But they probably will iterate on it, it just won't be with skyrim.[/QUOTE] They should just take the hint and do what Unreal is doing - better mod = higher revenue, all problems solved. But then again, that would require actual curation on valve's part...

I'm still not happy with them on the whole but this was a respectable thing to do and to own up to. It also means the community can make a difference if enough of them speak up, which is great

[QUOTE=Cold;47613715]I think its stupid to just straight out the box scrap it rather then try to iterate and improve it. But they probably will iterate on it, it just won't be with skyrim.[/QUOTE] IMO this isn't the sort of thing you can work on in public. They need to find out what people really want before they try and bring it back. I honestly think that in some games it would work perfectly well. For example I could see it as being a nice way for developers who make (well established) total conversion mods to get a step into game development by being able to sell their mod. However in that case you would really need VALVe to do some QC on what is allowed to be sold. Much like they used to do with allowing source mods to be publicised via steam.

[QUOTE=Cushie;47613704] there is a clear difference between a complete overhaul to a game or a mod just utilizing the engine/assets, and a mod that adds additional content to a game. with a game like skyrim it just becomes a nickel and dime situation because you are going to end up having to shell $50-100 on small mods if you want to mod it out like you use to be able to.[/QUOTE] I am not sure why you're expecting it to be "Dragon Bow Reskin for 14.99". The market might as well has balanced around major mods like SkyUI costing a dollar, and most stuff still being free because very few bought it.

[QUOTE=JXZ;47613630]what is this?[/QUOTE] An FPer posted a huge mod review on all of the paid mods that were pushed by Valve, and it was almost universally extremely bad, the mods were either broken, really low low effort, or plainly cheating in terms of gameplay.

As someone who started getting into game development by modding, and who has also developed two commercially successful games (both of which have modding support), the overall reaction has been incredibly disheartening.

Well that didn't last long. I'm just surprised they are issuing refunds, given valve's past history of not having a good refund policy.