Suspect in Tucson's Chick-Fil-A Shooting Eludes Capture - Polidicks

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897408]Or it could be that we established political systems that forbade a lot of the violence entailed by religions, including separating religions from state, yet in Islam any law is Sharia is considered the gravest of sins and therefore the states actively participates in the religiously sanctioned violence.[/QUOTE] It's not only laws, it's the people. If certain laws would be removed regarding this issue, there would be significantly less crimes or religious violence today, than had there been 500 or 1000 years ago.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897383]That's the whole point, the religion didn't change, but the people did. The people aren't using their religion anymore as motivation or excuse for violence, at least not in the way it was done a 1000 years ago. However, in Islam, people still use it to motivate or excuse violence. Again, not like how it has been 1000 years ago, but it's still unacceptable levels. I don't have a problem with the people and their culture, I have a problem with them (some of them at least) using their religion to incite hate and encourage violence.[/QUOTE] So then you can't say Islam is bad while other religions are somehow better, because it's all dependent on the culture and theocracy.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897408]Or it could be that we established political systems that forbade a lot of the violence entailed by religions, including separating religions from state, yet in Islam any law is Sharia is considered the gravest of sins and therefore the states actively participates in the religiously sanctioned violence. [editline]07:07AM[/editline] Typical, if you want to refute my arguments go ahead and try. I wonder how many times I've had to say this to you people.[/QUOTE] 1) You realize the main catalyst for the Islamic Revolution in Iran was Anglo-American foreign policy, no? 2) You seriously need an attitude adjustment.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897408]Or it could be that we established political systems that forbade a lot of the violence entailed by religions, including separating religions from state, yet in Islam any law is Sharia is considered the gravest of sins and therefore the states actively participates in the religiously sanctioned violence. [editline]07:07AM[/editline] Typical, if you want to refute my arguments go ahead and try. I wonder how many times I've had to say this to you people.[/QUOTE] assuming you're talking about the US, we preach separation of church and state, we don't follow it. you have no arguments to refute, you've said nothing but hated Muslims for no reason other than someone along the line told you they were bad

[QUOTE=Mingebox;22897423]So then you can't say Islam is bad while other religions are somehow better, because it's all dependent on the culture.[/QUOTE] Maybe, but the fact is that there are more extremists Muslims who use religion to support their terror than there are Christians or Jews or any other religion in the world, is the cause for my criticism of Islam, while criticizing other religions a lot less.

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897430]assuming you're talking about the US, we preach separation of church and state, we don't follow it. you have no arguments to refute, you've said nothing but hated Muslims for no reason other than someone along the line told you they were bad[/QUOTE] he doesn't like all muslims because he knows, along with only a few thousand other people, that they secretly want to take over the world and shit

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897439]Maybe, but the fact is that there are more extremists Muslims who use religion to support their terror than there are Christians or Jews or any other religion in the world, is the cause for my criticism of Islam, while criticizing other religions a lot less.[/QUOTE] there are way more peaceful Muslims than there are terrorists who are Muslim, and there are plenty of Christians and Jews who use religion as justification for anything

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897439]Maybe, but the fact is that there are more extremists Muslims who use religion to support their terror than there are Christians or Jews or any other religion in the world, is the cause for my criticism of Islam, while criticizing other religions a lot less.[/QUOTE] Look at Christianity 1400 years after it was founded. Lots of burning heretics, going on Inquisitions, Crusades all that shit. Islam has been around for about 1400 years, and it's having its moments like that. [editline]07:12AM[/editline] [QUOTE=JerryK;22897456]there are way more peaceful Muslims than there are terrorists who are Muslim, and there are plenty of Christians and Jews who use religion as justification for anything[/QUOTE] that doesn't count though because the koran told them to blow themselves up pretty much every muslim out there is a sleeper agent who's wearing a suicide vest at all times [editline]07:13AM[/editline] even snoop dogg is a terrorist since he's a muslim

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897456]there are way more peaceful Muslims than there are terrorists who are Muslim, and there are plenty of Christians and Jews who use religion as justification for anything[/QUOTE] I didn't say that most Muslims are terrorists, but that there are a lot more Muslim terrorist extremists who use religion for as motivation or an excuse, than any other religious group.

[QUOTE=PrismatexV8;22897461]Look at Christianity 1400 years after it was founded. Lots of burning heretics, going on Inquisitions, Crusades all that shit. Islam has been around for about 1400 years, and it's having its moments like that. [editline]07:12AM[/editline] that doesn't count though because the koran told them to blow themselves up pretty much every muslim out there is a sleeper agent who's wearing a suicide vest at all times [editline]07:13AM[/editline] even snoop dogg is a terrorist since he's a muslim[/QUOTE] i don't even get where people got this whole "The Quran tells Muslims to blow themselves up" first of all, suicide bombing is a very controversial topic in Islam, second the Quran never said ANYWHERE to blow yourself up what it DOES say is that if you die fighting to defend your family, your home, and/or your belief then you die a martyr, upon dieing as a martyr you are guaranteed 72 virgins in heaven the whole terrorist idea that people believe came from some asshole who decided to twist words to convince other people to do what he wanted

[QUOTE=PrismatexV8;22897461]Look at Christianity 1400 years after it was founded. Lots of burning heretics, going on Inquisitions, Crusades all that shit. Islam has been around for about 1400 years, and it's having its moments like that.[/QUOTE] Considering Islam was founded 600 years after Christianity, in a different time and place, that doesn't say much. [QUOTE]that doesn't count though because the koran told them to blow themselves up pretty much every muslim out there is a sleeper agent who's wearing a suicide vest at all times [editline]07:13AM[/editline] even snoop dogg is a terrorist since he's a muslim[/QUOTE] Are you trying to make me sound like a racist or something? [editline]02:17PM[/editline] [QUOTE=JerryK;22897511]i don't even get where people got this whole "The Quran tells Muslims to blow themselves up" first of all, suicide bombing is a very controversial topic in Islam, second the Quran never said ANYWHERE to blow yourself up what it DOES say is that if you die fighting to defend your family, your home, and/or your belief then you die a martyr, upon dieing as a martyr you are guaranteed 72 virgins in heaven the whole terrorist idea that people believe came from some asshole who decided to twist words to convince other people to do what he wanted[/QUOTE] Pretty sure it was sarcasm bro.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897513]Considering Islam was founded 600 years after Christianity, in a different time and place, that doesn't say much. Are you trying to make me sound like a racist or something? [editline]02:17PM[/editline] Pretty sure it was sarcasm bro.[/QUOTE] i know it was sarcasm, i was just addressing it while it was brought up

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897513]Are you trying to make me sound like a racist or something?[/QUOTE] I was describing ClinicalThought's line of reasoning.

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897439]Maybe, but the fact is that there are more extremists Muslims who use religion to support their terror than there are Christians or Jews or any other religion in the world, is the cause for my criticism of Islam, while criticizing other religions a lot less.[/QUOTE] That's because of a lot of reasons, mainly that most Islamic countries aren't very well off, which gives rise to theocracy and violence, and the damage caused by Western meddling makes for a useful scapegoat unite people against.

CriticalThought, Middle East isn't the only place that associates Church and State, Vatican, and even Poland have blaspehmic laws. Criticize the Bible and you go to jail. Stop making sound like "rararaa Islam bad, worse then others, will take over world"

[QUOTE=Mingebox;22897543]That's because of a lot of reasons, mainly that most Islamic countries aren't very well off, which gives rise to theocracy and violence, and the damage caused by Western meddling makes for a useful scapegoat unite people against.[/QUOTE] see: mohammad mossadegh

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897430]assuming you're talking about the US, we preach separation of church and state, we don't follow it. you have no arguments to refute, you've said nothing but hated Muslims for no reason other than someone along the line told you they were bad[/QUOTE] Most first world countries actually. And no, you Americans never follow your constitution. In fact recent polls show that 7942% of Americans hate the constitution and love when your politicians tread all over it. [QUOTE=PrismatexV8;22897428]1) You realize the main catalyst for the Islamic Revolution in Iran was Anglo-American foreign policy, no? 2) You seriously need an attitude adjustment.[/QUOTE] You mean motivated by Islam's detest of Western shirk? As well as numerous other things to make the country more Orthodox. [QUOTE=PrismatexV8;22897461]Look at Christianity 1400 years after it was founded. Lots of burning heretics, going on Inquisitions, Crusades all that shit. Islam has been around for about 1400 years, and it's having its moments like that.[/QUOTE] Except at that point in history so was everyone else. Today no one is doing any of that, yet Islam still insists on it.

[QUOTE=Mingebox;22897543]That's because of a lot of reasons, mainly that most Islamic countries aren't very well off, which gives rise to theocracy and violence, and the damage caused by Western meddling makes for a useful scapegoat unite people against.[/QUOTE] I don't care much about the reason. The Jews have every right in the world to be pissed at Germany for the holocaust, but they don't claim that "According to Jewish war ethics, an entire city holds collective responsibility for the immoral behaviour of individuals." (From starpluck's post last page) this sentence means Germany must pay in blood for this. Not even the most extremist Jews say this, or has said this, even during the holocaust (the resistance groups for example were completely a-religious, and the religious leadership was against resistance). What I'm trying to say is, that it doesn't matter if they're suffering or whatever. Using your religion as an excuse or motivation for violence, isn't a good thing, no matter what.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897605]Most first world countries actually. And no, you Americans never follow your constitution. In fact recent polls show that 7942% of Americans hate the constitution and love when your politicians tread all over it. You mean motivated by Islam's detest of Western shirk? As well as numerous other things to make the country more Orthodox. Except at that point in history so was everyone else. Today no one is doing any of that, yet Islam still insists on it.[/QUOTE] you're hopeless i'm out of here

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897511]i don't even get where people got this whole "The Quran tells Muslims to blow themselves up" first of all, suicide bombing is a very controversial topic in Islam, second the Quran never said ANYWHERE to blow yourself up what it DOES say is that if you die fighting to defend your family, your home, and/or your belief then you die a martyr, upon dieing as a martyr you are guaranteed 72 virgins in heaven the whole terrorist idea that people believe came from some asshole who decided to twist words to convince other people to do what he wanted[/QUOTE] [B]if you die fighting to defend[/B] your family, your home, and/or [B]your belief then you die a martyr[/B] Didn't you used to have shifty eyes as your avatar?

[QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22897607]I don't care much about the reason. The Jews have every right in the world to be pissed at Germany for the holocaust, but they don't claim that "According to Jewish war ethics, an entire city holds collective responsibility for the immoral behaviour of individuals." (From starpluck's post last page) this sentence means Germany must pay in blood for this. Not even the most extremist Jews say this, or has said this, even during the holocaust (the resistance groups for example were completely a-religious, and the religious leadership was against resistance). What I'm trying to say is, that it doesn't matter if they're suffering or whatever. Using your religion as an excuse or motivation for violence, isn't a good thing, no matter what.[/QUOTE] Not saying it is, I'm just saying you can't pretend Islam is inherently bad to validate your own.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897643][B]if you die fighting to defend[/B] your family, your home, and/or [B]your belief then you die a martyr[/B] Didn't you used to have shifty eyes as your avatar?[/QUOTE] fighting to defend your belief and blowing yourself up, killing civilians in the process are two different things

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897673]fighting to defend your belief and blowing yourself up, killing civilians in the process are two different things[/QUOTE] Define civilians. And answer my question.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897684]Define civilians. And answer my question.[/QUOTE] define civilians? are you even serious or are you just trolling? and what does my avatar have to do with anything?

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897704]define civilians? are you even serious or are you just trolling? and what does my avatar have to do with anything?[/QUOTE] I want to know your full definition of civilians. And I'm curious, humour me. Although I do remember better now and I know that you did, and you dodging answering it is your typical behaviour. You're another one of the Muslims on here, I'm going to watch out for your bullshit.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897720]I want to know your full definition of civilians. And I'm curious, humour me. Although I do remember better now and I know that you did, and you dodging answering it is your typical behaviour. Your another one of the Muslims on here, I'm going to watch out for your bullshit.[/QUOTE] Fucking. Lol. it's only 6:30 AM and i think you just made my day bravo

[QUOTE=JerryK;22897704]and what does my avatar have to do with anything?[/QUOTE] He can't debate correctly so he has to resort to ad hominen, instead of debating you, he attacks you.

They should have got his waffle fries.

[QUOTE=CriticalThought;22897720]I want to know your full definition of civilians. And I'm curious, humour me. Although I do remember better now and I know that you did, and you dodging answering it is your typical behaviour. You're another one of the Muslims on here, I'm going to watch out for your bullshit.[/QUOTE] LOL Hahahahaha

[QUOTE=PrismatexV8;22897614]you're hopeless i'm out of here[/QUOTE] He makes a good point about the history thing though. You can't judge religions based on their age, you have to judge them according to the respective time period you're looking at. Let's look at the early years of Christianity - 200 AD: Christianity is pretty much more moral and humane than Paganism, the other powerful religion. Now 450 years later - 650 AD: Christianity has taken over large parts of Europe and is spreading, sometimes by the sword, and there are a lot of bad things going on like burning heretics, force converting, and others. Islam has recently started and is also spreading by the swords. Islam allows more religious freedom than Christianity actually. Middle ages and the crusades - 1100 AD: Christianity is shit compared to Islam. There's crusades and stuff, while in Islam there are a lot of advancements and religious freedom and generally, it's easier being a Christian in a Muslim country, than a Muslim in a Christian country. Beginning of the enlightenment age - 1600 AD: Christianity is changing, with Protestantism and all that stuff. People are thinking less about the Church and more about humanity, they are turning less religious and more secular. Islam is still the same as it was, with relatively nice religious freedom, but it's still fixated at its old values and morals. Beginning of the Industrial Era - 1870 AD: Christianity is a non-factor in Europe, the people are a lot more secular and humanists, they don't act for religious values but for themselves or for their state. Islam is still stuck in its old beliefs, not too bad but it seems like in Europe or America are a lot free-er than in Islamic lands. Modern times - 2000 AD: Islam is shit when compared to "Christianity", you can't even call it that because we're comparing Islamic countries with secular countries. The difference is almost the same as it was in 1100 AD, although the sides have changed. *note - By "Islam is shit" I am referring to the amount of freedoms and rights that are available to people in Islamic lands. [editline]02:35PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Mingebox;22897662]Not saying it is, I'm just saying you can't pretend Islam is inherently bad to validate your own.[/QUOTE] All religions are inherently bad.