• David Gregory waves Hi-Cap Mag on Meet the Press in DC while asking the NRA About a Ban so People Ca
    112 replies, posted
[QUOTE=NoDachi;38960850]no no make all guns black powder. At least bank robbers would have some class about them now.[/QUOTE]Maybe we'd see a return to classical duels. Have at you, good sir.
I like using specific examples so let me show you. Here we have a Vz.58 [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/gSVKE.jpg[/IMG] Canadian legal, but the mags are capped at 5 rounds by a tiny brass rivet. ( you can see it on the mag there the circle) By taking a drill and just drilling into it and destroying the pin and shaking it out it is now a functional 30 round mag. What the fuck is the point of that rivet other than to piss off legal gun owners who generally aren't comfortable with breaking the law? Also I really want a Vz.58 they are sexy as fuck and I plan on buying one
[QUOTE=wickedplayer494;38960852]Not to mention the fact that in the long run, 5-8 seconds doesn't really buy more than 1 or 2 lives saved. Sure, the more, the better, but once a shooter reloads, he'll keep on firing.[/QUOTE] I'm sure a shooter doesn't care to pick the magazine up, so it would be no where near 5-8 seconds. Would be at best 3-4.
[QUOTE=Paul McCartney;38960876]I'm sure a shooter doesn't care to pick the magazine up, so it would be no where near 5-8 seconds. Would be at best 3-4.[/QUOTE] Yeah, 5-8 seconds is a bit too generous.
This isn't Mass Debate, if you want to piss all over each other, go there. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Backseat moderation" - Starpluck))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=Red scout?;38960689]Well, I dont think the shooter stopping to reload will make him kill MORE people.[/QUOTE] This is only going to help in the super rare chance that we get a heroic person at the scene AND near the shooter who also NOTICES he's reloading (while hiding for his own life, unless he doesn't give a shit and is practically observing the guy) and is close enough to run and tackle him and is also able to overpower him.
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[QUOTE=Red scout?;38960869]Well, from what I see it's mostly us foreigners who have grown up in a society where firearms havent been in widespread use by civillians tend to be on the against side on the argument. Whilst we cant do much inflict on the political choices in america, we can still voice our opinion. No, I have never fired a real gun. So I cant really see what is so awesome about it. I would consider myself however intrested in weapons and semi-gun nut. But I still stand on the side speaking against civillian ownership of firearms.[/QUOTE] Well I personally used to shoot regularly, sometimes at competition level many years ago. It really isn't anything special, everything so [I]awesome[/I] about it is some metaphysical construct invented by middle-aged bold guys suffering from impotency.
[QUOTE=NoDachi;38960915]Well I personally used to shoot regularly, sometimes at competition level many years ago. It really isn't anything special, everything so [I]awesome[/I] about it is some metaphysical construct invented by middle-aged bold guys suffering from impotency.[/QUOTE] "I dont really like it, how could anyone else?"
High Cap Bans are retarded It takes no time at all to reload if you've used your gun a few times, or practiced doing so, which anyone with CCW should. I can reload my Glock 27 in 2 seconds if the next mag is in my hand or on the table in front of me. What about holders for rifle magazines where you have two or three side by side, all you have to do is release, put the next one in, and hit the bolt release and you're ready to go again. I could really only see High Capacity magazines being banned in the case of actual Beta C or Drum mags, and even then for Fully Automatic weapons only. As if it'll stop someone wanting to use them from using them, so even this is pointless
[QUOTE=Timebomb575;38960941]"I dont really like it, how could anyone else?"[/QUOTE] I never said that. I did like it. I just said it wasn't anything special. Like any hobby.
[QUOTE=bisousbisous;38960889]This isn't Mass Debate, if you want to piss all over each other, go there.[/QUOTE] SH is like a street fight while Mass Debates has too many rules. Besides, why else would anyone post such threads here anyway?
How about instead of spending so much money and time regulating the industry with things that restrict our second amendment, and instead look at the root problem? School shooting happen often because of bullying and such, and generally shooting happen due to simply deranged people. Now, mental disorders that have had no previous sign from a subject are unfortunately not possible to stop, but bullying in schools and generally in our society is fixable, we're just doing it fucking wrong. Extensive gun regulation in the US is the by-product of our legislature finding no other way to take action that doesn't require any real work to get done, and therefore because everyone's too busy dismissing even a remote possibility of solving the things that actually get these people going to get guns and take so many peoples' lives, you're only hampering the rights that honest people have been endowed, promised, and ones we definitely deserve. No matter how you put it, whether the commonly spoken anti-gun argument that "oh, they could've hit another bystander had they been armed in the situation" is quite unfortunate, but it seems pretty obvious that the injuring of a possible bystander, catering to the specific morality of legally having a gun and accidentally shooting someone so that instead of just them gets injured or killed, the killer massacres everyone. This not only is some really backwards ass excuse, but essentially sets up these mass killings to be an eternal loop of tragedies for anti-gun lobbyists to feed their point off of. Yes, while the unfortunate killing of a bystander to take out a mass murderer that is about to methodically execute a large number of people really does suck, the successful execution of subduing the killer would be far better news, and show that guns in the hands of citizens who believe they need them really can turn the tides. Give me all the boxes you want, but really the second amendment is our right to bear arms in the United States. The very fact of hampering our ability to use more effective weapons and accessories to these weapons to defend ourselves & our families, hunt, and shoot for sport, no matter how many or how little people do any of these is a blatant raping of the 2nd amendment. [I][B]tl;dr[/B][/I] gun control is a treadmill of bullshit, 2nd amendment is about the right to own firearms and have them where you can actually use them to defend yourself where it really counts :suicide:
To add on to the anti-gun control fire, have this Penn and Teller: Bullshit video about it: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhXOuuHcjbs[/media]
[QUOTE=Craig Willmore;38960739][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1u0Byq5Qis[/media] Skip to 1:29 if you want to hear someone's testimony who was actually in [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luby%27s_massacre]a mass shooting.[/url][/QUOTE] Hupp based her entire radical pro-gun platform on her experiences with very very strong "what ifs". Tragic as her story is, it's not in any way good evidence against gun control. [editline]24th December 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=wickedplayer494;38961184]To add on to the anti-gun control fire, have this Penn and Teller: Bullshit video about it: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhXOuuHcjbs[/media][/QUOTE] Penn and teller also defends wallmart practices and is against NASA because of the free market, I wouldn't really expect them to be the leaders in making good points. [editline]24th December 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Milkdairy;38961121]How about instead of spending so much money and time regulating the industry with things that restrict our second amendment, and instead look at the root problem? School shooting happen often because of bullying and such, and generally shooting happen due to simply deranged people. Now, mental disorders that have had no previous sign from a subject are unfortunately not possible to stop, but bullying in schools and generally in our society is fixable, we're just doing it fucking wrong. Extensive gun regulation in the US is the by-product of our legislature finding no other way to take action that doesn't require any real work to get done, and therefore because everyone's too busy dismissing even a remote possibility of solving the things that actually get these people going to get guns and take so many peoples' lives, you're only hampering the rights that honest people have been endowed, promised, and ones we definitely deserve. No matter how you put it, whether the commonly spoken anti-gun argument that "oh, they could've hit another bystander had they been armed in the situation" is quite unfortunate, but it seems pretty obvious that the injuring of a possible bystander, catering to the specific morality of legally having a gun and accidentally shooting someone so that instead of just them gets injured or killed, the killer massacres everyone. This not only is some really backwards ass excuse, but essentially sets up these mass killings to be an eternal loop of tragedies for anti-gun lobbyists to feed their point off of. Yes, while the unfortunate killing of a bystander to take out a mass murderer that is about to methodically execute a large number of people really does suck, the successful execution of subduing the killer would be far better news, and show that guns in the hands of citizens who believe they need them really can turn the tides. Give me all the boxes you want, but really the second amendment is our right to bear arms in the United States. The very fact of hampering our ability to use more effective weapons and accessories to these weapons to defend ourselves & our families, hunt, and shoot for sport, no matter how many or how little people do any of these is a blatant raping of the 2nd amendment. [I][B]tl;dr[/B][/I] gun control is a treadmill of bullshit, 2nd amendment is about the right to own firearms and have them where you can actually use them to defend yourself where it really counts :suicide:[/QUOTE] How to blame everything EXCEPT guns, by milkdairy.
[QUOTE=Red scout?;38960644]reloading takes a few seconds even for someone who is trained. It could save at least a few lives in a shooting if he has to stop and reload.[/QUOTE] The higher the mag cap is, the more likely your gun is to jam. It takes a lot longer to unjam a rifle than it does to reload.
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;38960664]"could" Works both ways. It could [I]not[/I] as well.[/QUOTE] Jared Loughner (The guy who shot Gabby Giffords and 12 or so other people) was taken down while he was reloading.
Honestly how difficult is it to cobble together hi-cap mags when you can make entire AKs out of shovels?
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;38961232] [editline]24th December 2012[/editline] How to blame everything EXCEPT guns, by milkdairy.[/QUOTE] You can blame two inanimate objects for killing a human if you wish, but Milk isn't very far off. Mental healthcare, unemployment/job standards being constantly raised, the failing education system, and how people always want to be remembered for something is always going to feed into violence/aggression. The later point is also reinforced with how the media keeps constantly making anti-heroes out of murderers/psychopaths.
Despite our nerd argument I'd just like to wish everyone a merry christmas and despite our difference i bet 90% of you are cool dudes, im drunk
[QUOTE=Aman VII;38961386]Despite our nerd argument I'd just like to wish everyone a merry christmas and despite our difference i bet 90% of you are cool dudes, im drunk[/QUOTE] I am also a little bit drunk. Tis the season of port.
[QUOTE=Aman VII;38961386]Despite our nerd argument I'd just like to wish everyone a merry christmas and despite our difference i bet 90% of you are cool dudes, im drunk[/QUOTE] Merry Christmas, comrade.
[QUOTE=NoDachi;38960850]no no make all guns black powder. At least bank robbers would have some class about them now.[/QUOTE] I can see it now, a bank robber wearing an Adam Ant costume shouting stand and deliver to a bank clerk.
[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;38961377]You can blame two inanimate objects for killing a human if you wish, but Milk isn't very far off. Mental healthcare, unemployment/job standards being constantly raised, the failing education system, and how people always want to be remembered for something is always going to feed into violence/aggression. The later point is also reinforced with how the media keeps constantly making anti-heroes out of murderers/psychopaths.[/QUOTE] These things factor in. You know what else factors in? Accessibility to guns. Why are you people CONSTANTLY harping on about other issues with the idea that guns aren't the issue. It CAN be and is both.
[QUOTE=Red scout?;38960644]reloading takes a few seconds even for someone who is trained. It could save at least a few lives in a shooting if he has to stop and reload.[/QUOTE] A few seconds? Try two seconds. That's how fast I could reload my M16 assuming my magazines are in an open top pouch. I'm even faster with a pistol.
[QUOTE=catbarf;38960625]'Surely if people can't buy 75-round drums, they won't be able to kill as many people!' I'm just imagining some nutjob with a rifle, who shoots ten times, then looks quizzically at his rifle, and says 'Welp, that's it, I'm out' and lays down for the police. The worst school shooting in history was done with only ten-round magazines. It doesn't matter how many rounds your mag holds when you have [i]fifteen[/i] of them and know how to reload.[/QUOTE] The entire reason that Jared Loughner wasn't able to kill more people than he did is because when he was attempting to reload, a woman came up behind him and knocked the reload out of his hands, and she said "it was the only chance I had to prevent him from killing more people". So yes, it does give people the chance to react. Same thing happened with the guy with the AK outside of the White House. He was reloading and got tackled.
[QUOTE=ewitwins;38961514]The entire reason that Jared Loughner wasn't able to kill more people than he did is because when he was attempting to reload, a woman came up behind him and knocked the reload out of his hands, and she said "it was the only chance I had to prevent him from killing more people". So yes, it does give people the chance to react. Same thing happened with the guy with the AK outside of the White House. He was reloading and got tackled.[/quote] Jared Loughner also managed to kill so many because of his extended magazine.
[QUOTE=Governor Goblin;38961464]These things factor in. You know what else factors in? Accessibility to guns. Why are you people CONSTANTLY harping on about other issues with the idea that guns aren't the issue. It CAN be and is both.[/QUOTE] don't states with concealed carry permits have less crime that those without?
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;38960620]But by what Aman VII says, they're not even trying.[/QUOTE] Aman doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about. The entire point is to ban mags like that and build them so physically they can only hold less rounds. He's saying others don't have knowledge of the subject while he completely ignores the proposed legislation. [editline]24th December 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=The Baconator;38961566]don't states with concealed carry permits have less crime that those without?[/QUOTE] Correlation does not imply causation Lets say it is. There are plenty of places with low crime with strict gun laws.
[QUOTE=Red scout?;38960644]reloading takes a few seconds even for someone who is trained. It could save at least a few lives in a shooting if he has to stop and reload.[/QUOTE] You can reload in half a second with practice, and with training even less
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