Idaho teen shoots burglar during home invasion, gunfight
370 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310141]That's a nice hypothetical you pulled directly out of your ass.
Read the article again, that isn't how things went down whatsoever.[/QUOTE]
[quote]“As soon as he saw us step into the room, that’s when he started shooting at us,” Bob said. “And the bullets were flying past us. I can’t believe we didn’t get hit.”
Bullets went through a chair, a closet and a door jamb. One pierced a framed baby picture of Brian — the first photograph taken after he was born.
The man shot five or six times, Brian and Bob said. There was a pause, as the man crouched down in a corner of the bedroom.
As his father stepped back, Brian moved forward into the room and took a single shot, hitting the man in the lower abdomen.
The intruder dropped the handgun.[/quote]
[editline]5th November 2016[/editline]
also regardless of what you know-it-alls seem to say, some states legally allow you to fire at someone as soon as they force entry
[QUOTE=EcksDee;51309934]well if he/she has already shot me then the situation has already escalated and everyone is fucked either way. If I had a gun at that point I'd shoot, though my gun would probably be somewhere else in the house anyway.[/QUOTE]
Oh? So like it happened in this case? You are saying that hurting the home invader should be avoided because he might rehabilitate but as soon as YOU put yourself in that situation, you decided to do EXACTLY THE SAME as that family.
Because guess what, the situation scalated AS SOON AS THE BURGLAR SHOT AT THE FAMILY, and then YOU say you would have shot JUST LIKE THE FAMILY DID.
But hey when it´s not your skin on the line and you don´t think about this happening to you (which is what you have been doing up until this point) it´s so much easier to try and make yourself appear as the guy who is morally above everyone uh? When in actuality you don´t even believe the bullshit you are spouting.
And hey, if the gun had been somewhere else in the house like you said and the owners had not taken it, they would be DEAD right now because the invader would have had the opportunity to shoot at them all he wanted since they would have been defenseless against him.
[QUOTE=EcksDee;51309934]
The point is that if that kind of situation can be avoided in the first place, then that should be the way to go. Take this exact news story for example. Family saw a burglar, they don't know if he is armed, trying to escape out a window. For whatever reason the guy is unable to escape, so [I]they follow him[/I] through the house, and [I]decide to enter a room where the burglar was cornered, not knowing what weapons he had[/I] instead of waiting for the cops.
[/QUOTE]
Oh so then they should have just waited around in their bedrooms after hearing the noises just happily waiting while everything of value they had is being taken away by that poor poor victim of society waiting for rehabilitation.
And God forbid they were such fools to go check out what the noises in their own home were, because then they might find an uninvited guess and we all know that their only choice would be to wait for the police to arrive while A PERSON WHO IS COMPLETELY UNPREDICTABLE DECIDES WHAT THE BEST OPTION WOULD BE, WHICH IN THAT SITUATION WOULD BE TO TRY TO DISPOSE OF AS MANY WITNESSES AS NECESSARY SINCE THOSE KIND OF PEOPLE ARE SCARED SHITLESS OF BEING BUSTED AND WOULD DO [B]ANYTHING [/B]TO AVOID IT.
So what you are actually suggesting, is for these people to wait around for the police while there is a person which would not hesitate to murder them within the same house.
And sorry for the caps, but since a lot of rational arguments have been posted while trying to disarm your bullshit and you ignored them, maybe the caps will be more of a visual aid for you, uh?
But just in case seeing as maybe you suffer from a severely reduced attention span ill try to summarize: Would you be stupid enough to hear sounds in your own house and not going to check out what they were?
Just wanna throw out there, also, that Idaho residents don't have a duty to retreat in their own home
[QUOTE=Jouska;51310143]I even said "or get him to surrender" but yeah I would totally kill some dude breaking in my house if my love ones are home. Thats not sarcasm either because I would not risk them getting harmed because i was too dumb to prevent the robber from getting the upperhand.
I swear you guys must have lived in a bubble-wrapped room all your lives to think this way[/QUOTE]
You would probably get charged with homicide for that over here and I think that's great. I don't think the paranoid gun fantasy view is acceptable.
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310191]Good news, I dont even have to use paint at all.
This stuff just writes itself. Similar sentimentals are paraded around in this thread and all other threads related to US home intrusion - the home intruder is almost ALWAYS deemed worthy of death for breaking into a home, as if his crime is a vicious, horrendous one with the intent of murder/rape. Even if no[B] murder or rape ever took place[/B], people resort to the WELL BUT HE COULDA which literally just serves as more fuel for the paranoia and aggression when it comes to home intrusions.
This is what Im referring to, home intrusions are almost always about thievery, RARELY are they ever about serial-killers or rapists trying to harm your family. Try to finally wrap your head around this fact.[/QUOTE]
Correct me if you're excluding this case but is shooting at an adult and a minor in their own home not attempted murder? Like, if they had been standing in a slightly different spot it very well would have been murder
[QUOTE=EcksDee;51309851]
china has 1200x the population and it has less gun deaths, less incarceration and better educational standards than the US (forgetting for the moment that their system is incredibly extreme when it comes to schooling)[/QUOTE]
China has nothing to do with the US and Estonian education system. Dunno where you're going with this.
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310191]Good news, I dont even have to use paint at all.
This stuff just writes itself. Similar sentimentals are paraded around in this thread and all other threads related to US home intrusion - the home intruder is almost ALWAYS deemed worthy of death for breaking into a home, as if his crime is a vicious, horrendous one with the intent of murder/rape. Even if no murder or rape ever took place, people resort to the WELL BUT HE COULDA which literally just serves as more fuel for the paranoia and aggression when it comes to home intrusions.
This is what Im referring to, home intrusions are almost always about thievery, RARELY are they ever about serial-killers or rapists trying to harm your family. Try to finally wrap your head around this fact.[/QUOTE]
So... What I understand here is that if that someone breaks into your home, the place where you live and sleep at your most vulnerable, they are "probably" not going to kill or hurt you? If you truly assume that, wonderful. I and most of everyone else I know don't.
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310191]Good news, I dont even have to use paint at all.[/QUOTE]
Good news, you're just as delusional as ecksdee, enjoy trying to hide how much of a dick you are, I'm done with you too.
Why are people trying to paint the intruder as the victim again?
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310221]It can be argued that they had forced the intruder into a corner. Exactly why they had to step into the room, assuming they probably knew it was an intruder, is unknown. They could have just as easily fled to a different room and dialed 911.
The intruder seems like a panicked, desperate person who would like nothing else than to just take off with the valuables as quickly as possible. He doesnt exactly read out like vicious serial killer bent on wrecking havoc in some random household which drives home my bigger point on the subject of guns and home-intrusion in general.[/QUOTE]
So why is the home owner the gun-toting hick when there's another American using his gun to invade homes? Especially when the criminal fired first? You're literally victim blaming homeowners for getting shot at.
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310221]It can be argued that they had forced the intruder into a corner. Exactly why they had to step into the room, assuming they probably knew it was an intruder, is unknown. They could have just as easily fled to a different room and dialed 911.
The intruder seems like a panicked, desperate person who would like nothing else than to just take off with the valuables as quickly as possible. He doesnt exactly read out like vicious serial killer bent on wrecking havoc in some random household which drives home my bigger point on the subject of guns and home-intrusion in general.[/QUOTE]
The felon wanted to play dumb games and he won dumb prizes. Pretending you don't know this can happen in the US is like trying to convince everyone the sky is actually green. They could have easily fled to a different room and dialed 911 just like the robber could have dropped his weapon and surrendered, but that's not how it worked out and the dude got blown the fuck away. I don't feel bad
Notice how everyone defending the POOR SCARED FELON :( is not from the US
[QUOTE=RB33;51310188]You would probably get charged with homicide for that over here and I think that's great. I don't think the paranoid gun fantasy view is acceptable.[/QUOTE]
A guy breaks into my house with a gun and I am just being paranoid about him harming my family.
Are you guys used to random armed people breaking into your crib all time?
I mean are you really calling me paranoid because I think this ARMED house invader might harm me or my family? Like really?
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310264]If they did force the intruder to a corner and confronted him there, can you explain the rationale of such an action other than to murder the intruder
If I am correct they explicitly seeked a gunfight with the intruder, its not like they were having a peaceful dinner and suddenly bullets started flying out of nowhere[/QUOTE]
They think there is someone in their house, they check their house to see if there's actually a person, while searching they bump into the intruder who immediately started firing at them, therefore the homeowners shot back in self defense, yet the home owners are the bad guy here? I'm not quite following
[QUOTE=Marbalo;51310191]
home intrusions are almost always about thievery, RARELY are they ever about serial-killers or rapists trying to harm your family.[/QUOTE]
But some [I]ARE[/I]. The quote "Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it" applies to the gun here pretty well. For example, is a fire in your house likely? Probably not. Do you keep a fire extinguisher handy just in case it happens? Hopefully. Look, if you don't want robbers getting shot, then maybe you should tell them to not break into people's houses. That oughtta stop them, as they're clearly reasonable people, right? Definitely someone you could trust to not harm your family or yourself, right? I can't believe there are actually people who will defend a robber who broke into a house and started shooting at the residents after being surrounded. Even [I]if[/I] you called the police and they showed up in time to confront the guy, do you think they'll act any differently than the homeowners? I think being too light on people breaking into your house just encourages the action of doing so.
Look, I wish I lived in a world where people didn't have to get hurt too, but the reality is that people [I]do[/I] get hurt because there's bad people out there, whether it's the good guy or the bad guy doing the hurting. That's just the world we live in. Some people [I]do[/I] want to harm your family. Denying that there's bad people out there is just wishful thinking.
Don't assume I'm itching to shoot someone, though. I personally hope I never have to use my guns against an intruder, but the reality is that I may have to one day to protect myself or my family. When it comes to my life versus a robber's life, I know which side I'm taking.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310251]I dont get it. Why would someone who breaks in to steal stuf go out of his way to murder the residents unless it goes "wrong" -ie he is confronted
Does USA have an epidemic of serial killers who break into houses, steal the TV and oh by the way lets kill the fucking residents because lol why not[/QUOTE]
I don't get it either. Why would someone break into a house to steal something, then shoot the place up after being witnessed by the owner? Why did some old lady five miles down from my childhood home get the shit beaten out of her when the dude broke into her home to steal some jewelry? Why was some rich guy a few towns over murdered during a botched burglary? Most sobering to me, why was my friend jumped for his phone and then stabbed after giving it over?
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310280]It can happen in the US all right and that is the problem. A home burglary is such a benign crime,[b] it is surprising and concerning to see how often it escalates to a gunfight and how all residents are convinced the burglar would kill them at the chance and vice versa. [/b]
This level of dangerous shouldnt be happening in a first world country.[/QUOTE]
Except the burglar was the one who opened fire first..?
I seriously don't understand why there are people defending the burglar. He chose to break into their home and take things that weren't his, then he CHOSE to shoot at the owners of that home. He wasn't forced into anything.
Why are you guys defending the burglar and not the homeowners who defended themselves from an intruder that tried to kill them? The homeowners didn't choose to get their home invaded and they didn't choose to get shot at.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310280]It can happen in the US all right and that is the problem. A home burglary is such a benign crime, it is surprising and concerning to see how often it escalates to a gunfight and how all residents are convinced the burglar would kill them at the chance and vice versa.
This level of dangerous shouldnt be happening in a first world country.[/QUOTE]
So I should just sit there and hope the guy doesnt rape and kill my loved ones?
How about this:
[B]DONT BREAK INTO PEOPLES HOMES WITH WEAPONS[/B]
"But poor little burgular, dont hurt his feelings he does have that gun as a joke. He isnt going to hurt you i swear"
We might as well ban the police from using guns with the logic Ive been reading in this thread.
[QUOTE=hippowombat;51310242]Good news, you're just as delusional as ecksdee, enjoy trying to hide how much of a dick you are, I'm done with you too.[/QUOTE]
I'm sorry, but pointing out posters who enjoy the idea of the dude's guts being shredded is being a dick? I don't follow.
[QUOTE=PaChIrA;51310303]I seriously don't understand why there are people defending the burglar. He chose to break into their home and take things that weren't his, then he CHOSE to shoot at the owners of that home. He wasn't forced into anything.
Why are you guys defending the burglar and not the homeowners who defended themselves from an intruder that tried to kill them? The homeowners didn't choose to get their home invaded and they didn't choose to get shot at.[/QUOTE]
Because that would be thinking like a logically sane person.
[QUOTE=Jouska;51310325]Because that would be thinking like a logically sane person.[/QUOTE]
Because they've never bought a house before, then proceeded to spend $13,000 on furniture and appliances, put all of their lives belongings inside of it, and parked their $20,000 car and $10,000 motorcycle in the garage. [I]Or dealt with insurance companies[/I].
[QUOTE=Kylel999;51310273]Notice how everyone defending the POOR SCARED FELON :( is not from the US[/QUOTE]
The real question, you should ask yourself is why it is mostly just Americans who tries to justify all these break in scenarios.
[QUOTE=Jouska;51310277]A guy breaks into my house with a gun and I am just being paranoid about him harming my family.
Are you guys used to random armed people breaking into your crib all time?
I mean are you really calling me paranoid because I think this ARMED house invader might harm me or my family? Like really?[/QUOTE]
You're paranoid for thinking that he IS going to harm you, not that he might harm you. Everyone would admit that harm is a possibilty but how likely it would be is another thing. But mostly, I said that because of trying to kill the intruder, instead of trying to deescalate the situation.
You don't just bring a gun when you're intruding into other people's properties if you have no intention to use it, and he obviously was since the moment the homeowners bumped into him he started opening fire at them
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310320]Just because they got their home invaded doesnt mean all they did was right.
If they explicitly seeked the gunfight like Marbalo mentioned, that is wrong. If they knew for certain there was an intruder in the house, and they were outside, they shouldve called the police and waited. They shouldve had insurance to cover, instead of guns and their lives.[/QUOTE]
Yeah those guys saw their place being invaded and thought "wow awesome lets go start a shootout" no they were scared and afraid and went to investigate their OWN GOD DAMN HOUSE. They were gone for a hour and not know what couldve been going on.
The victim blaming in this thread is insane.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310320]Just because they got their home invaded doesnt mean all they did was right.
If they explicitly seeked the gunfight like Marbalo mentioned, that is wrong. If they knew for certain there was an intruder in the house, and they were outside, they shouldve called the police and waited. They shouldve had insurance to cover, instead of guns and their lives.[/QUOTE]
It's their home and they have a right to defend their home. They shouldn't have to let someone just have free reign within their home. Why does a criminal get to do what they wish, but not a law abiding person?
Why is it okay for someone to rob someone, but not okay for someone to prevent robbery?
[QUOTE=RB33;51310338]The real question, you should ask yourself is why it is mostly just Americans who tries to justifies all these break in scenarios.
You're paranoid for thinking that he IS going to harm you, not that he might harm you. Everyone would admit that harm is a possibilty but how likely it would be is another thing. But mostly, I said that because of try to kill the intruder, instead of trying to deescalate the situation.[/QUOTE]
Here's the thing dude
Someone who has broken into my domicile has forfeited his life. Sorry. I'm not going to take the chance. It's not worth it. Whichever gun is nearest to me when I hear that window break is going to be put to work that night, be it the vintage Mauser I was talking about earlier, my WW1 Model 10, the AR-15 or even if the 1851 Navy if that's what it takes.
It's not really hard to work out. If you don't wanna get shot for breaking into peoples' homes, don't break into peoples' homes.
If you see the gun and surrender, great, I'll call the cops, nobody has to get shot. If I hit you once and you go down, I'll call 911 and get you an ambulance. Hell, I'll probably administer first aid on the scene if you let me get close to you. But I'm not going to take the risk of allowing a total wildcard to creep around my home.
[QUOTE=Trebgarta;51310349]Knowing USA it is really likely he himself thought the homeowner would shoot him on sight.
Paranoia probably goes both ways.[/QUOTE]
Don't rob someone then?
Are we all forgetting that robbery is a criminal act? If you don't want to be caught committing a criminal act, then don't do a criminal act.
[QUOTE=Tetsmega;51309196]But I thought home invasions statistically don't end violently and that you should submit yourself to their demands.[/QUOTE]
Like a coward? Hell no, I'd rather defend myself than let some criminal come into my home.
[QUOTE=EcksDee;51309395]
But hey, all those deaths are worth it if you get to keep your boom stick for whatever reason and for the one family a month that shoots and permanently disfigures an intruder who could be rehabilitated and become a functional member of society.[/QUOTE]
Don't commit criminal acts then sucka.
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