Blizzard is Suing Valve - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630946]but it had even less to do with Valve[/QUOTE] Except the creator collaborating with them and Valve's expertise and tools going towards the game. If I was Icefrog I would tell Blizzard to go fuck themselves.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630946]but it had even less to do with Valve[/QUOTE] Look at Alien Swarm and Team Fortress, those had nothing to do with Valve, but that doesn't mean anything. Valve saw they were good mods on different engines and got them

I'm torn between both sides here. Both companies have made great games and both are quite good at listening to customers.

I really don't know where I'm standing on this. DotA never would have existed if not for Blizzard. DotA never would have existed if not for Icefrog, who's taken their talents to Valve. The fuck do I think here?

[QUOTE=Eluveitie;34630977]I'm torn between both sides here. Both companies have made great games and both are quite good at listening to customers.[/QUOTE] Blizzard didn't make DOTA so why are you torn? Because their engine was used? They kinda advertised off WC3s modding capabilities.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630884]the more I think about this the more I want Blizzard to win[/QUOTE] Blizzard had their chance to make something of DOTA but they were ignorant of it's potential success. Valve saw that Blizzard wasn't doing shit about it even though people wanted more of DOTA, so they took it into their own hands especially when they saw that Blizzard really wanted nothing to do with DOTA that they didn't even bother trademarking the damn name. So now that Blizzard actually sees how much potential money DOTA 2 can make, they start their bitching because they want back what was never even theirs. It's fucking too late for them. I hope Valve doesn't lose this because of Blizzard's bullshit.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630951]that's also a valid argument and what the court will need to decide[/QUOTE] Yep. I kind of hope that this'll turn into a settlement of some kind. I'd rather not have game developers that are semi-decent fighting over spilled milk.

[QUOTE=HawkeyeTy;34630984]I really don't know where I'm standing on this. DotA never would have existed if not for Blizzard. DotA never would have existed if not for Icefrog, who's taken his talents to Valve. The fuck do I think here?[/QUOTE] Holy shit, this isn't just at you either, theres a few other people thinking he created DOTA. Icefrog didn't create DOTA, he's just the current developer after a long line of former ones.

[QUOTE=Eluveitie;34630977]I'm torn between both sides here. Both companies have made great games and both are quite good at listening to customers.[/QUOTE] Why are you deciding who you're going to side with by which is the better company?

I'm trying to think up a bad car analogy to explain my view on this but it just isn't coming to me

[QUOTE=Banhfunbags;34631011]Why are you deciding who you're going to side with by which is the better company?[/QUOTE] Because I respect both companies a great deal. [editline]10th February 2012[/editline] A good idea would be if both companies worked on dota 2 together, that would be dreamy.

Icefrog owns it, Icefrog works at Valve, and is making the game under valve, so, Valve has it.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630946]but it had even less to do with Valve[/QUOTE] yeah but valve is now developing a commercial product titled as "dota 2", and when you do that you generally need to secure your title/series as a trademark its a touchy subject because dota has always been associated with blizzard's warcraft title but in the end, the title is property of IceFrog for one, and now that he's working at valve and valve is making "DOTA 2" commercially, i don't think there's any questioning who deserves the trademark here

Valve>Blizzard

Icefrog owned the name, Valve bought them, they are now part of Valve. Blizzard has nothing to do with Dota, but Valve is now technically the original creator or Dota if the team and their assets are now Valve's.

Well fuck me, I thought Blizzard already sued Valve for this.

[QUOTE=HawkeyeTy;34630984]I really don't know where I'm standing on this. DotA never would have existed if not for Blizzard. DotA never would have existed if not for Icefrog, who's taken his talents to Valve. The fuck do I think here?[/QUOTE] Blizzard did not create DOTA, however, and they have no claim to the name any more than Valve has a claim to the countless Half-Life and Half-Life 2 mods. DOTA was the result of the work of a third-party group, and they would be the only ones with such a claim. But, because they have partnered up with Valve, then Valve would inherit that claim so long as Icefrog works with them.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630860]I understand where Blizzard is coming from, it's kind of a dick move on Valve's part to go and trademark the name of a mod from someone else's game[/QUOTE] Effectively, what blizzard made was the Engine. It was a mod, made in another game, an all too common occurrence. The mod became so popular that the creator of the mod was hired by another company to make a sequel, in their own engine, and that company registers a trademark of the name of the mod the person they just hired made. It may have been a dick move for Valve to make, without talking to Blizzard first, but looking at it from the above perspective, they were completely within their right to do so. The only part Blizzard had in the creation of the mod, was the game it was made in, the engine itself. They had no hand in any actual development of the mod, and aren't entitled to claim it's theirs.

[QUOTE=Eluveitie;34630999]Holy shit, this isn't just at you either, theres a few other people thinking he created DOTA. Icefrog didn't create DOTA, he's just the current developer after a long line of former ones.[/QUOTE] Well the man who created DotA works for Valve and on the project anyways.

By Blizzard's logic, ID owns Team Fortress and Epic owns Alien Swarm. And Epic also would then own Killing Floor.

If, for some reason, Icefrog were to separate from Valve, then there could be a legal fight there over who owns the rights to DOTA 2, since it was developed during their time with Valve. Unless Icefrog signed the rights over to Valve however, they'd still retain the rights to the original DOTA, which would give them a pretty strong case if they tried to claim ownership of DOTA 2.

[QUOTE=Banhfunbags;34631049]Well the man who created DotA works for Valve and on the project anyways.[/QUOTE] I really don't care who has the rights to the game tbh, I just want it to be made and I'm torn between both companies because BOTH are great developers.

[QUOTE=Eluveitie;34631070]I really don't care who has the rights to the game tbh, I just want it to be made and I'm torn between both companies because BOTH are great developers.[/QUOTE] Why are you torn? Is there a gun pressed on the back of your neck or do you hate mod-makers?

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630946]but it had even less to do with Valve[/QUOTE] It has the exact same to do with both companies actually. DOTA 1 : Engine provided by Blizzard, modder Icefrog makes a mod out of it. DOTA 2 : Engine provided by Valve, modder Icefrog makes a game out of it. Valve just took a good decision by hiring the guys who made the first mod and taking the copyright for the game, while Blizzard did nothing and just waited until someone took a decision they should have taken a while ago to complain about it.

[QUOTE=Chicken_Chaser;34631075]Why are you torn? Is there a gun pressed on the back of your neck or do you hate mod-makers?[/QUOTE] Where did I say I hated mod-makers?

What I don't understand is why blizzard would wait this long to start disputing copyright over it. I mean it's kind of a dick move to say nothing for, how long has it been since DOTA2 has been announced? More than a year? You'd think that this is the kind of shit that should be gotten out of the way before the other company is nearly finished spending valuable time and resources to create the new game.

[QUOTE=Eluveitie;34630977]I'm torn between both sides here. Both companies have made great games and both are quite good at listening to customers.[/QUOTE] What does the company's relationship and image have to do with who is right or wrong in this case? [editline]10th February 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=froztshock;34631092]What I don't understand is why blizzard would wait this long to start disputing copyright over it. I mean it's kind of a dick move to say nothing for, how long has it been since DOTA2 has been announced? More than a year? You'd think that this is the kind of shit that should be gotten out of the way before the other company is nearly finished spending valuable time and resources to create the new game.[/QUOTE] For starters they did say it before that they don't like Valve using the name DOTA, and they may have sent more messages to Valve that didn't make it to the press

[QUOTE=STeel;34631097]What does the company's relationship and image have to do with who is right or wrong in this case?[/QUOTE] Nothing at all. I said I'm a fan of the game and both companies and that post signifies that I don't really care who wins, I just want the game to made.

Blizzard might as well go sue the developers of HoN and LoL because they're based off DoTA.

[QUOTE=Zeke129;34630860]I understand where Blizzard is coming from, it's kind of a dick move on Valve's part to go and trademark the name of a mod from someone else's game[/QUOTE] You need the trademark to be able to sell the game, it's not a dick move, it's just how you have to do business.