DEVELOPING: Shooting reported at Connecticut elementary school; 27 killed - Polidicks

[QUOTE=SPESSMEHREN;38832823]That doesn't really make me feel any better about this. I can see from the debates going on right now in this thread alone no one really cares. They're more interested in putting the blame on guns, and gun advocates are more interested in defending their guns to even care. And as usual this debate gets buried in endless rhetoric.[/QUOTE] I actually really want to blame the NRA, the Media, and Ronald Reagan but blaming guns is an important step in that direction. Baby steps.

[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38832654] The only purpose a handgun serves is to end human lives. That is it's sole function as a tool.[/QUOTE] uhhhh no [t]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8c/Walther_P22_Corrected.jpg/300px-Walther_P22_Corrected.jpg[/t] [t]http://www.travel-golf.org/images/pistol_target_expensive_walther_gsp.jpg[/t] [t]http://www.pagunblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/target-model.jpg[/t]

Just waiting until someone says "it must be dem videogames".

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;38832840]People can actually get addicted to alcohol.[/QUOTE] But you can't get addicted to guns, so I don't know what your point is.

It's my Mom's birthday today...

I would like to make a peaceful request... If you guys are going to fight each other in some shitty-debate, the least you could is not use the death of children to veil your attacks of calling each other sociopaths, cowards, and all that. Thanks.

[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38832610]They protect themselves by killing people.[/QUOTE] That's one broad statement, isn't it? Yes, if one gets a CC permit he might end up killing some wannabe thug/mugger/rapist/whatever. Well, sorry if I won't mourn the death of those kinds of people. Plus, another thing a lot of people don't seem to understand is, a permit to carry a gun is [B]not[/B] some magical get-out-of-jail ticket. Killed a guy? You're obliged to call the cops, and there will be investigations to determine whether it was really self-defense or not. Turns out it wasn't? Meet Bubba, your cellmate. Kill a guy AND don't call the cops? I do believe that counts as 1st degree murder. [QUOTE=Fort83;38832852]And some people are so against potential gun laws.[/QUOTE] Just my two cents, I think the reason most (if not all) gun enthusiasts are so vehemently against gun control is that all of the proposals so far were made by people who had no idea what they're talking about (eg. Brady Campaign), trying to push retarded laws out of ideology rather than rationality, that would have done little to nothing to actually prevent gun crimes, while at the same time becoming a HUGE problem for law-abiding gun owners (see the 1994 AWB, or NY's gun laws in general) and ignoring most facts and counter-arguments dismissing them as "NRA propaganda" or something. Think if Mitt Romney was the only one proposing laws regarding gay marriage.

[QUOTE=FreakyMe;38832704]Fine - If you are going to be pedantic, then 'the entire spectrum of psychotic disorders which impair the patient's judgement in a way which causes them to lose track of right and wrong'. This includes - Clinical depression with presenting psychosis. Schizophrenia. Bipolarity. Antisocial Personality Disorder. Dissasociative Identity Disorder. Borderline personality disorder, etc. If it is detectable and it makes you a psychotic, then you shouldn't be allowed to own a firearm.[/QUOTE] It takes more than reading Wikipedia to be a Mental Health expert friend. While I will agree with you that those with Psychotic disorders should not own firearms, I invite you to learn more about personality disorders which are Axis II conditions. These disorders do not "make you a psychotic", unless we're talking about disordes that put you at risk of / make you more predisposed to psychosis as a feature (axis II personality disorders do not do this, or else they would be Axis I psychotic disorders).

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;38832716]He's not even arguing in favour of gun control, he's arguing that people who use school shootings to propagate their bullshit gun ideology are sociopaths. I can criticise gun owners for being sociopathic if I please, especially when they have sociopathic traits. Yes it can. Too much liquor makes somebody an alcoholic, especially if they grow a dependence on it and see it as a solution to all of lifes problems. Half the country owns a gun? Source? Do they all use guns for a hobby?[/QUOTE] Apparently, it's 32% of households owning approximately 310 million guns, making the US rate of gun ownership at about 88/100. I stand corrected, it's a third of the country, not half, but that's still nearly 100 million people he generalized in one sweeping, slanderous insult. [url]http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/31/politics/gun-ownership-declining/index.html[/url] And no, you can't call someone who owns guns a sociopath, there are limits to "free speech" and such an assertion is slander, and slander is not covered within the scope of free speech, it's actually something you can get sued for. Of course, I've told you this before and you ignored me then too, I don't expect you to suddenly have a revelation that you're saying something slanderous with absolutely no data or facts to back it up, and that you need to either find facts or stop talking.

[QUOTE=RichyZ;38832849]and the ones who don't? i.e. people who have wine collections and the like?[/QUOTE] Except people get addicted to alcohol.

[QUOTE=Zuimzado;38832882]Just waiting until someone says "it must be dem videogames".[/QUOTE] You're late, Mass effects FB page is BOMBARDED by people claiming it to be the sole reason for the killing.

I'm sorry I may be late to the thread/or being dumb, but was there any confirmation as to whether that 4chan post was legitimately connected to this tragedy, or if it was false like that Mass Effect link.

[QUOTE=Protocol7;38832884]But you can't get addicted to guns, so I don't know what your point is.[/QUOTE] Yes you can. It's possible to get addicted to a whole range of activities.

[QUOTE=Starship;38832906]You're late, Mass effects FB page is BOMBARDED by people claiming it to be the sole reason for the killing.[/QUOTE] Because blaming video games is more logical than blaming, I dunno, a fucked up childhood.

[QUOTE=Starship;38832906]You're late, Mass effects FB page is BOMBARDED by people claiming it to be the sole reason for the killing.[/QUOTE] Wow. Link? Can't find that.

[img]https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/222339_176779289134879_1363867000_n.jpg[/img]

[QUOTE=Hullu V3;38832920]Because blaming video games is more logical than blaming, I dunno, a fucked up childhood.[/QUOTE] Welcome to society of today: rather than take the blame, most people search for other things to demonize and to use as a scapegoat.

[QUOTE=Zuimzado;38832921]Wow. Link? Can't find that.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.facebook.com/masseffect?fref=ts[/url] [t]http://puu.sh/1AWfJ[/t] And it continues for thousands of posts.

yo this whole gun argument thing is redundant and retarded can you guys just stop Can someone clear up who the shooter was? A bunch of outlets report differently but most of them are reporting that Adam Lanza (Ryan's brother) was the shooter instead of Ryan, and that Ryan is being questioned. Is this correct?

Totally unrelated.

All you gun-ban crazies should know is that if someone has money, guns will never stop spreading, they're cheap to buy if you have a good paying job. Even goddamn police officers can steal guns from anywhere. You can even make your own with the correct tools.

[QUOTE=DaCommie1;38832895][url]http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/31/politics/gun-ownership-declining/index.html[/url][/QUOTE] Gun ownership on the decline? Wonderful news then. [QUOTE=DaCommie1;38832895]And no, you can't call someone who owns guns a sociopath, there are limits to "free speech" and such an assertion is slander, and slander is not covered within the scope of free speech, it's actually something you can get sued for.[/QUOTE] "This person disagrees with me, we need to curtail their freedom of speech".

[QUOTE=lolo;38832945]All you gun-ban crazies should know is that if someone has money, guns will never stop spreading, they're cheap to buy if you have a good paying job. Even goddamn police officers can steal guns from anywhere. You can even make your own with the correct tools.[/QUOTE] For fucks sake, the gun lobby are the crazy fucks. They jump on every fucking opportunity to peddle their bullshit ideology with tired and worn out arguments about how guns would fix this problem. Any counter-argument is generalized as the "anti-gun people" who are out to destroy freedom and take away your privilege to own guns.

[QUOTE=Dark RaveN;38832932][img]https://fbcdn-sphotos-g-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/222339_176779289134879_1363867000_n.jpg[/img][/QUOTE] Ryan, Adam and now Brian? What is this shit

[QUOTE=Zuimzado;38832882]Just waiting until someone says "it must be dem videogames".[/QUOTE] Fox News.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;38832952] "This person disagrees with me, we need to curtail their freedom of speech".[/QUOTE] Saying "You're all sociopaths" is not a valid way to disagree with someone

[QUOTE=Hullu V3;38832970]Ryan, Adam and now Brian? What is this shit[/QUOTE] highly doubt that note is legit

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;38832847]Scared leads to stupid. I guess you've never been in a panic or seen anyone in a true panic before.[/QUOTE] Someone with the power to kill in their hands isn't going to be stupid with it. People act like they'll be firing their gun over chairs blindly, and they won't, because everything they've ever been taught about guns tells them they shouldn't. [QUOTE=HumanAbyss;38832809]Okay, so lets take a scenario then you're in a theatre, during the middle of a loud scene in the movie, a gunman walks in, and opens fire on the crowd, from the bottom of the stair case. After the initial gun fire is over and he goes to reload, a CC permitted crowd member stands up, and fires a shot off. The shot goes through the guys body because there's no way a civilian is using fucking hollowpoints, the bullet carries through his body, and say, hits an innocent bystander BEHIND the gunman cowering in the very front row and kills them outright Honestly, to think a NORMAL PERSON will have enough experience, knowledge, and luck to fire off a gun in a crowded place and ONLY, ONLY fucking hit the target and do nothing to anyone else is... I shouldn't even have to say.[/QUOTE] Actually, there's a very high likelihood a civilian is using hollowpoints, they're recommended for self defence because of their low chance of penetration and high shock damage to the victim. They're commonly available and legal for civilians to own literally everywhere that a gun is legal. And any NORMAL PERSON can spend hours on the range, including action ranges, to perfect their accuracy and train for uncertain scenarios. This again is acting like cops are on some sort of pedestal, a cop is a normal person whose job it is to protect people. He doesn't receive any kind of training that a "normal person" can't also go and get.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;38832952]"This person disagrees with me, we need to curtail their freedom of speech".[/QUOTE] "This category of people disagrees with me, I must be free to insult and slander them all"

[QUOTE=Timebomb575;38832975]Saying "You're all sociopaths" is not a valid way to disagree with someone[/QUOTE] I never said that.