[QUOTE=Ganerumo;49761347]Pretty sure they're split by sex to be honest.
Furthermore society doesn't make the difference when it comes to ejecting waste so it's irrelevant.[/QUOTE]
If they're split by sex we need to replace the stick lady and gent with stick genitals or something - just completely remove all references of man/woman/boy/girl whatsoever - to give a clear idea of who's meant to go where, and make it explicit and official that that's how were doing things.
[QUOTE=matt000024;49761356]they decrease the amount of people who piss on seats and in crowded places help bathroom lines move a lot quicker.[/QUOTE]
I can definitely assure you it does NOT decrease the amount of people who piss on the seats or at least not the occurrence of pissed on seats
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;49761331]Urinals are really just a completely arbitrary invention. There's no reason for them to exist in place of another row of stalls. You could just lift the toilet seat and take a piss, or sit down to piss, or whatever. Hell, most guys I see choose to take the stalls even when the urinals are an option because, I dunno, more privacy I guess. If they were really so important you would have one in your house.[/QUOTE]
They're cheaper to maintain, require less water to use, (automatic ones) are more hygienic, they take less long to use, you can cram more of them on a single wall making them more efficient for smaller restrooms, and you can't hoard them like sitting toilets.
People who go to to the sitting toilets just to take a piss when urinals are available are assholes anyway as they spray piss everywhere half the time.
Urinals might take up less space but the "no homo bro zone" around each one in use kind of negates that.
[QUOTE=Gurant;49760681]I don't get why not all bathrooms can be unisex.[/QUOTE]
Because boys and girls have different needs
also there's a point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins
[QUOTE=proch;49761399]Because boys and girls have different needs
also there's a point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins[/QUOTE]
Hoo boi. Do you mind clarifying what you mean by "perversion"?
[QUOTE=proch;49761399]Because boys and girls have different needs
also there's a point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins[/QUOTE]
Also a shitton of people are really uncomfortable near the opposite sex when they have to undress, like a fucking massive amount of people.
The point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins is the trans porn tabs on conservative lawmaker's browsers :v :v
The article is pretty vague about what the hell the bill actually includes to be honest, but at least from the article itself the only part I can really disagree with is the very first part, namely this
[quote]South Dakota would be the first state in the U.S. to approve a law requiring transgender students to use bathrooms and locker rooms that correspond to their sex at birth [/quote]
That's just asinine. It's only logical that people go to whatever bathroom fits their physical sex, and that means after a transition you go to the other gender's bathroom. At least until gender neutral bathroom become a thing.
[QUOTE=emly;49761387]Urinals might take up less space but the "no homo bro zone" around each one in use kind of negates that.[/QUOTE]
In what way? People piss and leave, its pretty simple.
[QUOTE=proch;49761399]Because boys and girls have different needs
also there's a point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins[/QUOTE]
Oh fucking boy here we go~
[QUOTE=Rangergxi;49761434]In what way? People piss and leave, its pretty simple.[/QUOTE]
Seen crowed places with dudes waiting impatiently and empty places they could go if the weird social rule wast a thing.
[QUOTE=emly;49761448]Seen crowed places with dudes waiting impatiently and empty places they could go if the weird social rule wast a thing.[/QUOTE]
What? If the bathroom is packed people will forgo the "no homo bro zone", as you put it, so they can piss. Its pretty simple.
[QUOTE=elowin;49761430]The article is pretty vague about what the hell the bill actually includes to be honest, but at least from the article itself the only part I can really disagree with is the very first part, namely this
That's just asinine. It's only logical that people go to whatever bathroom fits their physical sex, and that means after a transition you go to the other gender's bathroom. At least until gender neutral bathroom become a thing.[/QUOTE]
Gender neutral bathrooms are already a thing, they're just not included in most buildings and usually alongside normal bathrooms. Usually they're like a single person bathroom with a diaper changing station and space for a wheelchair.
Anyway the problem with that is that transition is a very slow process, you cannot get a sex change for several years in to your transition. Meaning within your first year you can look like this
[t]http://40.media.tumblr.com/b6faf04ce004dfab30c1ee3b63254693/tumblr_o0aruzW8jp1sidfiqo1_1280.jpg[/t]
And still have several years before you can get a sex change. That's, for the record, assuming you want one. A lot of trans people just don't want a sex change, they just want to live as their gender.
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;49761331]Urinals are really just a completely arbitrary invention. There's no reason for them to exist in place of another row of stalls. You could just lift the toilet seat and take a piss, or sit down to piss, or whatever. Hell, most guys I see choose to take the stalls even when the urinals are an option because, I dunno, more privacy I guess. If they were really so important you would have one in your house.[/QUOTE]
Urinals exist because apparently a large portion of guys can't fucking aim. It removes piss from stalls.
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;49761302]I really don't think requiring trans people who are just trying to like, exist, do shit that makes them a criminal is the right solution, at all, in any universe, that's a fucking stupid idea
also it doesn't take in to account students[/QUOTE]
it is not illegal to go to any bathroom if you are any gender. Please understand this.
[editline]17th February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=proch;49761399]Because boys and girls have different needs
also there's a point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins[/QUOTE]
... what?
[QUOTE=Radical_ed;49761469]
it is not illegal to go to any bathroom if you are any gender. Please understand this.[/QUOTE]
And there are people who want to change that. That's why this thread exists.
[QUOTE=Radical_ed;49761469]
it is not illegal to go to any bathroom if you are any gender. Please understand this.[/QUOTE]
[quote]PIERRE, S.D. - South Dakota would be the first state in the U.S. to approve a law requiring transgender students to use bathrooms and locker rooms that correspond to their sex at birth if the governor signs a bill passed Tuesday by the state Senate.[/quote]
we're literally talking about a law specifically for this
[QUOTE=Radical_ed;49761469]Urinals exist because apparently a large portion of guys can't fucking aim. It removes piss from stalls.
it is not illegal to go to any bathroom if you are any gender. Please understand this.[/QUOTE]
Mister Sandman is not a dense person, I don't think you mean explicitly to insult her (correct me if I should use another pronoun), but regardless the tone seems slightly condescending; it is clear that you mean there is no specific law barring anyone from going into a particular bathroom. But there are other charges that can be laid given whatever arbitrary circumstances, and in this specific situation, South Dakotan high school students can be suspended or expelled for not following the school's rules. So yeah, there is no specific legislation stating that men are to go to the men's washroom and women to the women's, we can all see that clearly; but people can still be netted for the situational circumstances of a bathroom visit, and it is unfair.
[QUOTE=Kyle902;49761297]Trans people are fucking killed all the time. Trans people experience violent crime far more then the baseline population. Being outed as trans in the bathroom can quite easily lead to a potentially dangerous situation. Furthermore even if it doesn't lead to violence it will still quite possible lead verbal abuse or other forms of harassment.[/QUOTE]
what kind of third world shithole are you getting your data from
i havent heard of widespread, methodical murder of trans people in any developed first world country. there's discrimination and ostracisation but it ends there, nobody goes out of their way to literally kill the dude after finding out he's a trans. at most there's some light offensive remarks made but nothing beyond that.
[QUOTE=Melnek;49761542]what kind of third world shithole are you getting your data from
i havent heard of widespread, methodical murder of trans people in any developed first world country. there's discrimination and ostracisation but it ends there, nobody goes out of their way to literally kill the dude after finding out he's a trans. at most there's some light offensive remarks made but nothing beyond that.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://tdor.info/[/url]
[QUOTE=Mister Sandman;49761463]Gender neutral bathrooms are already a thing, they're just not included in most buildings and usually alongside normal bathrooms. Usually they're like a single person bathroom with a diaper changing station and space for a wheelchair.
Anyway the problem with that is that transition is a very slow process, you cannot get a sex change for several years in to your transition. Meaning within your first year you can look like this
[t]http://40.media.tumblr.com/b6faf04ce004dfab30c1ee3b63254693/tumblr_o0aruzW8jp1sidfiqo1_1280.jpg[/t]
And still have several years before you can get a sex change. That's, for the record, assuming you want one. A lot of trans people just don't want a sex change, they just want to live as their gender.[/QUOTE]
Oh yeah, I guess those bathrooms are already gender neutral. Didn't even think of those, to be honest. What are they even called, disabled bathrooms?
Anyway, as for non-gender neutral bathrooms, how I see it you should to whichever one you seem like. If you clearly seem like a woman, you should go to the women's bathroom, if you clearly seem like a man, go to the men's bathroom, if you could pass for either, go where you want.
[QUOTE=Melnek;49761542]what kind of third world shithole are you getting your data from
i havent heard of widespread, methodical murder of trans people in any developed first world country. there's discrimination and ostracisation but it ends there, nobody goes out of their way to literally kill the dude after finding out he's a trans. at most there's some light offensive remarks made but nothing beyond that.[/QUOTE]
[url]http://www.avp.org/storage/documents/ncavp_transhvfactsheet.pdf[/url]
Also its clear from the wording of your post and your usage of pronouns that you know little about this topic.
literal objective fact: more us senators have been arrested for tomfoolery in public bathrooms than transgender people
these people make me fucking sick
[QUOTE=Melnek;49761542]what kind of third world shithole are you getting your data from
i havent heard of widespread, methodical murder of trans people in any developed first world country. there's discrimination and ostracisation but it ends there, nobody goes out of their way to literally kill the dude after finding out he's a trans. at most there's some light offensive remarks made but nothing beyond that.[/QUOTE]
[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unlawfully_killed_transgender_people[/url]
this is just counting the people who get killed, and not brutally assaulted
[QUOTE=Take_Opal;49760623]I'm for the integration of trans persons, but this issue I just don't know what the solution is to be honest. I haven't heard many arguments except for those who think trans people should be confined to their biological sex's designated restroom.[/QUOTE]
unisex toilets?
split bathrooms are so dumb and archaic i can't wrap my head around why they would ever need to exist in modern day
[editline]17th February 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=proch;49761399]Because boys and girls have different needs
also there's a point where accepting the human body ends and perversion begins[/QUOTE]
no? every kind of modern toilet is designed to work for both men and women perfectly fine.
Same sinks, same soap, same hand dryers. It's all the same. Only men have urinals, which can also go in cubicles, or just not exist in the first place.
[editline]17th February 2016[/editline]
If your reasoning against unisex bathrooms is 'ooga booga man like sex' then i worry for u
most if not all swimming pools have unisex changing rooms where people actually UNDRESS inside cubicles, and this doesn't cause problems. why do you think it would suddenly be a problem in unisex toilets? (which, by the way, are already very prevalent in many developed countries without problem)
Speaking from a practical standpoint, unisex toilets make more sense too. They are more space efficient as sinks and hand dryers can be shared, there is no divider wall taking up a lot of space, they require less cleaning staff (and the staff can be unisex too, where as with split bathrooms they often need to hire a divided force out of need).
tl;dr yea, fuck split bathrooms
[QUOTE=Melnek;49761542]what kind of third world shithole are you getting your data from
i havent heard of widespread, methodical murder of trans people in any developed first world country. there's discrimination and ostracisation but it ends there, nobody goes out of their way to literally kill the dude after finding out he's a trans. at most there's some light offensive remarks made but nothing beyond that.[/QUOTE]
[url]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transphobia[/url]
[quote]A U.S. survey of 402 older, employed, high-income transgender people found that 60% reported violence or harassment because of their gender identity. 56% had been harassed or verbally abused, 30% had been assaulted, 17% had had objects thrown at them, 14% had been robbed and 8% had experienced what they characterized as an unjustified arrest.[8]
A study of 81 transgender people in Philadelphia found 30% reported feeling unsafe in public because they were transgender, with 19% feeling uncomfortable for the same reason. When asked if they had ever been forced to have sex, experienced violence in their home, or been physically abused, the majority answered yes to each question.[17]
A review of American studies on sexual violence towards transgender people found that around 50% of transgender people have been sexually assaulted.[18][/quote]
[QUOTE=emly;49761550][url]http://tdor.info/[/url][/QUOTE]
some linked sources don't work and most people that were killed seem to be from really shitty corners of the world, which leads me to believe that it has less to do with them being trans and more to do with them just living in areas with a high as fuck murder/homicide rate
[QUOTE=Kyle902;49761579][url]http://www.avp.org/storage/documents/ncavp_transhvfactsheet.pdf[/url]
Also its clear from the wording of your post and your usage of pronouns that you know little about this topic.[/QUOTE]
wow a single page of .pdf that makes a lot of claims with no actual verifiable statistics, why didn't you just post an infographic .png while you were at it
also the wording is deliberate, because i do not believe linguistics should cater to the mental state of the individual. in a hospital for example, in a situation that requires gender identification of the patient they will label you a male even if you're wearing a wig or take hormone supplements or identify as a female. i feel more comfortable by using nouns that portray the individuals natural gender i.e the ones they were born with.
[QUOTE=Melnek;49761641] natural gender i.e the ones they were born with.[/QUOTE]
Someone doesn't know sex/gender buuuuut I bet you aren't even going to listen
[QUOTE=Melnek;49761641] in a hospital for example[/QUOTE]
This isn't a hospital, you're not on-duty in this thread, no one is being provided genetically-dependant medical services.
[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;49761671]Someone doesn't know sex/gender buuuuut I bet you aren't even going to listen[/QUOTE]
okay if you're cold set on the semantics of it then i believe ones biological sex should be directly translated into his gender as well, disregarding ones own opinion or identification. is that any better?
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