NRA Disagrees With Donald Trump with his suggestion that the Orlando Clubgoers shoud have been armed - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50555865][media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgDD0hzqugM[/media][/QUOTE] damn i completely forgot about that. also lets get medical cocaine while we're at it

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50555865][media]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgDD0hzqugM[/media][/QUOTE] I meant the statement of "more guns, less shootings", I don't doubt the satire. It's been great in GTA for a while.

[QUOTE=Revenge282;50557419]I meant the statement of "more guns, less shootings", I don't doubt the satire. It's been great in GTA for a while.[/QUOTE] Ah, so you agree with the point put forth by the satirists?

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557434]Ah, so you agree with the point put forth by the satirists?[/QUOTE] Nearly all mass shootings in the US so far happened in gun-free zones. And the cities with the highest amount of gun crime (NY, LA, you name them), usually have very tight gun control laws. So satire or not, the statement has a point. Just not the one you'd like.

[QUOTE=jimhowl33t;50557555]Nearly all mass shootings in the US so far happened in gun-free zones. And the cities with the highest amount of gun crime (NY, LA, you name them), usually have very tight gun control laws. So satire or not, the statement has a point. Just not the one you'd like.[/QUOTE] It seems rather amusing to cite a satire explicitly and viciously mocking the position you support.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557434]Ah, so you agree with the point put forth by the satirists?[/QUOTE] I mean you can put whatever inflection or twist on my words that you would like, but sure. I claim that more guns does not directly correlate to more shootings. Do I think we should do literally anything else in that GTA commercial? No. But it has been pretty clear statistically where your guns are used in crime.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557596]It seems rather amusing to cite a satire explicitly and viciously mocking the position you support.[/QUOTE] It's even more amusing when the satire tries to mock you and it backfires.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557596]It seems rather amusing to cite a satire explicitly and viciously mocking the position you support.[/QUOTE] No one is "citing" the commercial. I simply pointed out that it was not necessarily true, which you seem to have taken as fact because it mentioned something in a satirical manner.

[QUOTE=jimhowl33t;50557607]It's even more amusing when the satire tries to mock you and it backfires.[/QUOTE] I'm not sure how it backfires because it's criticising American gun culture as a phenomenon more than anything else. [QUOTE=Revenge282;50557611]No one is "citing" the commercial. I simply pointed out that it was not necessarily true, which you seem to have taken as fact because it mentioned something in a satirical manner.[/QUOTE] I just find it ironic that one would quote something that expressly disagreed with your point. When it says that "more guns = less shootings, that's just logic!", it is mocking people who use that train of thought.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557626]I'm not sure how it backfires because it's criticising American gun culture as a phenomenon more than anything else.[/QUOTE] [quote=satire]Haha if u had a gun u would be safer amirite lmao[/quote] [quote=facts and statistics]Being disarmed does not fucking help.[/quote] Dunno, you tell me.

'facts and statistics'

[QUOTE=jimhowl33t;50557655]Dunno, you tell me.[/QUOTE] I tried to click the "facts and statistics" but it didn't link anywhere.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557626]I'm not sure how it backfires because it's criticising American gun culture as a phenomenon more than anything else. I just find it ironic that one would quote something that expressly disagreed with your point. When it says that "more guns = less shootings, that's just logic!", it is mocking people who use that train of thought.[/QUOTE] I mean, it's not a difficult concept to grasp. 1. Someone quoted the GTA commercial, in what I understood to be a satire on the posters part. 2. I replied, stating that though he intended it to be satirical, that was more than likely a fact. 3. You entered using the commercial as further proof for your argument against guns. 4. You are now here...

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557665]I tried to click the "facts and statistics" but it didn't link anywhere.[/QUOTE] Try not to ignore the "most shootings happen in gun-free zones and cities where it's nearly impossible for a non-criminal to carry a gun" button for a change. Or are you seriously going to try and refute that?

[QUOTE=jimhowl33t;50557701]Try not to ignore the "most shootings happen in gun-free zones and cities where it's nearly impossible for a non-criminal to carry a gun" button for a change. Or are you seriously going to try and refute that?[/QUOTE] Well unfortunately when it comes to convincing somebody in an debate, having some of these "facts and statistics" available is often helpful. It's hard to convince people otherwise.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557730]Well unfortunately when it comes to convincing somebody in an debate, having some of these "facts and statistics" available is often helpful. It's hard to convince people otherwise.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]Overall number of gun murders: 1. Los Angeles.......................1,141 2. Chicago..............................1,139 3. New York.............................1,101[/QUOTE] [url]http://cnsnews.com/news/article/la-chicago-rank-1-and-2-gun-murders-no-has-highest-rate[/url] There's more on the page, but that would be the most relevant chunk for this thread.

I can already see it clearly... a typical gay bar, smoke machine and musky male dominated atmosphere... hunters lurk in the corner for cute twinks and people with low self esteem... the music glares loud enough to silence any moans and grunts. then suddenly, a gunshot from the fog... another one... Flashes illuminate but blind most, a cute twink in wife beater top with someones hands down their pants falls to the ground, shot in the chest... "Britain first" is heard by some, other seem to have heard "i am a person in need of mental help, and am in no way doing this for homophobic tendencies... in fact, i am a gay myself" People react, a partially drunk, partially high on coke snorted from a toilet seat bull grabs his piece and unloads at the gunman, his bullets mostly strike true, but also hit someone standing behind his target. Another couple flashes, people clearly scream as the music has stopped, the dj retreating to safer lands, a man seeing his boyfriend fall to the ground grabs his gun and retaliates, another retaliates in kind. The smoke gets thicker with each shot, There is no more sense or sanity, just confusion, screams, fear and terror... More and more with each shot the room atmosphere changes into a Stalingrad-esque scenery of picking up the guns of people that fell before you, only to be mowed down by mg42 fire... For the motherland... i mean fatherland since most of them are gay. As the body count rises, the meaningless of it all becomes more clear... What passing-bells for these who die as cattle? Only the monstrous anger of the guns. 1.7–2 million wounded, killed or captured that day, It was a turning point in the European theatre of World War II; German forces never regained the initiative in the East and withdrew a vast military force from the West to replace their losses.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557730]Well unfortunately when it comes to convincing somebody in an debate, having some of these "facts and statistics" available is often helpful. It's hard to convince people otherwise.[/QUOTE] Alright then, [url=http://www.legisworks.org/GPO/STATUTE-104-Pg4789.pdf]at around page 56 you should find the Gun Free School Zones act of 1990[/url], which prohibits anyone from carrying and/or discharging a firearm in a school perimeter. This means any shooting happening after that year (so, the most famous ones) happened in a gun-free zone. IIRC Aurora theater was one as well, there's some conflicting sources on that so feel free to take this with a grain of salt. Moving on to the cities bit, I'm just going to class New York and California' strict gun control as common knowledge at this point, considering I keep seeing this exact argument reposted every now and then in SH, usually by someone replying directly to you.

[QUOTE=Revenge282;50557670]I mean, it's not a difficult concept to grasp. 1. Someone quoted the GTA commercial, in what I understood to be a satire on the posters part.[/QUOTE] Apparently it is difficult to grasp because it's not a "satire on the posters part" it's blatantly satire from a group of UK developers that have consistently made fun of American conservative tropes like reducing gun violence by arming more people, which makes about as much sense as reducing car accidents by lowering the requirements to drive an automobile. [QUOTE=Revenge282;50557777][url]http://cnsnews.com/news/article/la-chicago-rank-1-and-2-gun-murders-no-has-highest-rate[/url] There's more on the page, but that would be the most relevant chunk for this thread.[/QUOTE] Using your own source, places with high levels of gun regulation see fewer deaths and death rates than places with low regulation. You can see the same sort of thing if you blow it out to a country by country comparison. You aren't going to reduce gun deaths by throwing more guns at the issue, you are going to reduce them by fighting crime, educating gun owners and prospective owners on gun safety, and preventing suicide.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50557596]It seems rather amusing to cite a satire explicitly and viciously mocking the position you support.[/QUOTE] You always do this. Someone points out how nonsensical/circular/made up your logic is, and you just jump around and switch to another argument. If this goes on long enough you revert back to the arguments you first brought up, despite them already being debunked. Eventually you just vanish and go have a sulk when someone calls you out on your rampant stupidity. How many times have you been called out on your flagrant disregard for reality when it doesn't suit your agenda again? I've honestly lost count at this point.