[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51344924]I know nothing's happening right now[/QUOTE]
the HB2. the impending change to passport policy. both of these are fairly immediate. to change your passport you need to pay both a fee and have a note from a doctor. I would also consider *lack* of employment protection an immediate issue. in the state where I live, if I were fired for my sexual orientation I would have no legal recourse at all. pardon my hysteria if this doesn't seem immediate to you.
(and if you aren't looking to organize now to help challenge the removal of protections for trans people, when are you looking to organize? once it's happened and actually affecting people?)
[quote]but point three? Really? More shit about Pence?[/quote]
yes. the simple fact of pence's status of vp-elect is enough to embolden bigots and reinforces the idea of conversion therapy, regardless of it's actual (non-)worth. symbolic defeats may be less important than pragmatic defeats, but to discount them outright is dangerous. [URL="https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/sep/28/hate-crime-horrible-spike-brexit-vote-metropolitan-police"]hate crimes spiked 16% after brexit[/URL]. trans lifelines are dealing with record numbers of callers.
lgbt folks are scared because we know what's coming.
[quote]What you're discussing is hearsay[/quote]
I mean, mostly interviews, but I guess you could call that hearsay.
[quote]and campaign promises, I do not trust Trump either way.[/quote]
so what I'd like to get down to is this: why exactly do you assume trump won't act (as he's said he will act, as the party expects him to act, as his vp will encourage, as his cabinet will encourage) in this way? i would understand if you looked backwards to his time before the campaign and dug up his earlier stances, but he's been remarkably consistent during the campaign season. and i guess as a last mode of argument i could gesture to the lgbt community, which is right now preparing for the same struggles that feminist activists are looking at w/r/t planned parenthood (these two groups form a venn diagram with a lot of overlap as well).
[QUOTE=FlandersNed;51344472]Given how volatile The_Donald is, I disagree.[/QUOTE]
The donald is a bunch of passive memers who most likely don't have the balls to do shit like this.
The internet empowers those sort of people to become absolute cancer, but in real life they tend to be wimps
this is not new.
[QUOTE=Oizen;51345184]The donald is a bunch of passive memers who most likely don't have the balls to do shit like this.
The internet empowers those sort of people to become absolute cancer, but in real life they tend to be wimps
this is not new.[/QUOTE]
I would think that they in combination with all other right wing online websites went a long way in making Trump's presidency a reality, you shouldn't kid yourself.
Besides, if Trump lost, that sub would implode on itself and you'd heard the aftershocks all around the internet, regardless of what they'd do in real life.
HOWEVER
Trump supporters, at least through the internet, were extremely vitriolic and also need to clam/calm down. I would think that what Trump said about Hillary in his victory speech (irrespective of whether he believes it or not) would not be found anywhere on popular Trump websites.
[QUOTE=AngryToad;51345105]so what I'd like to get down to is this: why exactly do you assume trump won't act (as he's said he will act, as the party expects him to act, as his vp will encourage, as his cabinet will encourage) in this way? i would understand if you looked backwards to his time before the campaign and dug up his earlier stances, but he's been remarkably consistent during the campaign season. and i guess as a last mode of argument i could gesture to the lgbt community, which is right now preparing for the same struggles that feminist activists are looking at w/r/t planned parenthood (these two groups form a venn diagram with a lot of overlap as well).[/QUOTE]I'll address this specifically.
I don't assume anything, I don't think he won't and I don't think he will, plus I'm not so much even concerned about Trump as I am about the other Republicans in our government who [I]can[/I] make change. Discussing "finally being able to defund planned parenthood" directly affects anyone with a vagina, partially affects anyone who associates with anyone with a vagina. HB2 affects, what, ten percent of the population? Actually no, I can't even imagine it's anywhere close to that. Above priorities were discussed, why should I be losing my head in hysterical sobbing over that? Really? You keep trying to pin me like I'm giving Trump a free pass post after post and I'm getting annoyed with your histrionic bullshit.
If your state allows an employer to fire you for your orientation I feel that's morally wrong but what do you want me to do? Do you want me to start blowing up post offices where you live or something, because I have [I]no idea[/I] what the hell you expect me to do here. Aside from a kooky libertarian, "the government can't or shouldn't legislate sexuality!" view I don't have any feelings, I think you're shooting yourself in the foot by presenting this like I have some obligation to post how I'm literally shaking right now on tumblr. I'm not, I'll respond to things as they happen just like I've done for decades.
[editline]9th November 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE]yes. the simple fact of pence's status of vp-elect is enough to embolden bigots and reinforces the idea of conversion therapy, regardless of it's actual (non-)worth. symbolic defeats may be less important than pragmatic defeats, but to discount them outright is dangerous. [URL="https://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/sep/28/hate-crime-horrible-spike-brexit-vote-metropolitan-police"]hate crimes spiked 16% after brexit[/URL]. trans lifelines are dealing with record numbers of callers.[/QUOTE]"Britain is full of snaggle-toothed assholes and they did bad stuff after Brexit, so there will LITERALLY be right-wing death squads here because reasons and also Pence!"
What the fuck am I supposed to do with this, exactly?
[QUOTE]lgbt folks are scared because we know what's coming.[/QUOTE]Then get a gun and join the [I]many[/I] LGBT firearm owners who refuse to be victims.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345346]
"Britain is full of snaggle-toothed assholes and they did bad stuff after Brexit, so there will LITERALLY be right-wing death squads here because reasons and also Pence!"
What the fuck am I supposed to do with this, exactly?
Then get a gun and join the [I]many[/I] LGBT firearm owners who refuse to be victims.[/QUOTE]
Imagine telling people that the only way they're going to feel safe is if they're ready to shoot another human being.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345346]
Then get a gun and join the [I]many[/I] LGBT firearm owners who refuse to be victims.[/QUOTE]
how is that going to stop the government from taking your rights away slowly? what are you going to do with that gun when you can no longer marry/have a good job/live in a good area?
[QUOTE=froztshock;51345369]Imagine telling people that the only way they're going to feel safe is if they're ready to shoot another human being.[/QUOTE]
^
[QUOTE=Da Big Man;51341590]Imagine loving inanimate objects more than human beings[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=TheFilmSlacker;51345365]And then what? Wait to go down in a blaze of glory?[/QUOTE][QUOTE=froztshock;51345369]Imagine telling people that the only way they're going to feel safe is if they're ready to shoot another human being.[/QUOTE][QUOTE=Da Big Man;51345395]^[/QUOTE][I]"Stop it you're making me feel stupid!"[/I] the posts. Did I tell you to shoot anyone? No. I said just get a gun and refuse to be a victim. I think that's perfectly clear, if somebody [I]does[/I] try to harm you then [U][B][I]defend[/I][/U] yourself.[/B] Are you honestly that fucking insane that you'd rather forfeit your life for an unlimited pass to whine about how your life sucks? I don't know why else would you respond to, "you should defend yourself," with, "IMAGINE TELLING SOMEBODY THEY NEED TO FIGHT THEIR MURDERER TO LIVE!!!!! SICK!!!!!"
Enjoy being a perpetual victim, but please, keep your dysfunction to yourself because some of us don't want to die for an opportunity to angrily blog about being assaulted.
[QUOTE=Naught;51345372]how is that going to stop the government from taking your rights away slowly? what are you going to do with that gun when you can no longer marry/have a good job/live in a good area?[/QUOTE]It's not? I never said it would, if you want that then you're [I]probably[/I] (making a prediction here, watch out!) going to have to move to a different state during the next four years. Sorry to be the one to tell you this, but reality is not your friend so before it kicks you in the teeth you [I]might[/I] want to do something about it. What, I don't know, but personally I'd be saving up in case I needed to fuck off to some place where I'd feel safe and my vote mattered more.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345427][I]"Stop it you're making me feel silly!"[/I] the posts. Did I tell you to shoot anyone? No. I said just get a gun and refuse to be a victim. I think that's perfectly clear, if somebody [I]does[/I] try to harm you then [U][B][I]defend[/I][/U] yourself.[/B] Are you honestly that fucking insane that you'd rather forfeit [I]your life[/I] for an unlimited pass to whine about how your life sucks? I don't know why else would you respond to, "you should defend yourself," with, "IMAGINE TELLING SOMEBODY THEY NEED TO FIGHT THEIR MURDERER TO LIVE!!!!! SICK!!!!!"
Enjoy being a perpetual victim, but please, keep your dysfunction to yourself because some of us don't want to die for an opportunity to angrily blog about it.
It's not? I never said it would, if you want that then you're [I]probably[/I] (making a prediction here, watch out!) going to have to move to a different state during the next four years. Sorry to be the one to tell you this, but reality is not your friend so before it kicks you in the teeth you [I]might[/I] want to do something about it. What, I don't know, but personally I'd be saving up in case I needed to fuck off to some place where I'd feel safe and my vote mattered more.[/QUOTE]
You don't need a gun to feel safe.
In fact, you [I]shouldn't[/I] need a gun to feel safe.
Cross posting:
[QUOTE=BlindSniper17;51345420]I was lurking on NeoGAF to see how they reacted (they were super pro-Hillary), and [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1311390"]I saw all this being posted:[/URL] :frown:
[B](Facebook video:)[/B] [I]"This happened today at Royal Oak Middle School in Royal Oak Michigan. It is so sad. Latino children were crying. The taunts, the "Build that Wall" with such bullying power and hate from children to children. Just Horrifying!"[/I]
[url]https://www.facebook.com/immigrationtalk.mexicanamerican/posts/1144505642253666[/url]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/0SBGRvu.jpg[/t][t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cw2OLfiWgAI6qEa.jpg[/t][t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cw3QxiqXEAEQQxG.jpg[/t][t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cw2iRoTXcAIlC85.jpg[/t]
[t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cw2bC1vUUAAWxyd.jpg[/t][t]http://i.imgur.com/LigzBWg.png[/t][t]http://i.imgur.com/MEvTOQ2.png[/t]
...I didn't think it would get [I]this bad, this fast[/I], but [I][B]holy shit.[/B][/I][/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345427][I]"Stop it you're making me feel stupid!"[/I] the posts. Did I tell you to shoot anyone? No. I said just get a gun and refuse to be a victim. I think that's perfectly clear, if somebody [I]does[/I] try to harm you then [U][B][I]defend[/I][/U] yourself.[/B] Are you honestly that fucking insane that you'd rather forfeit your life for an unlimited pass to whine about how your life sucks? I don't know why else would you respond to, "you should defend yourself," with, "IMAGINE TELLING SOMEBODY THEY NEED TO FIGHT THEIR MURDERER TO LIVE!!!!! SICK!!!!!"
Enjoy being a perpetual victim, but please, keep your dysfunction to yourself because some of us don't want to die for an opportunity to angrily blog about being assaulted.
It's not? I never said it would, if you want that then you're [I]probably[/I] (making a prediction here, watch out!) going to have to move to a different state during the next four years. Sorry to be the one to tell you this, but reality is not your friend so before it kicks you in the teeth you [I]might[/I] want to do something about it. What, I don't know, but personally I'd be saving up in case I needed to fuck off to some place where I'd feel safe and my vote mattered more.[/QUOTE]
You do realize that defending yourself with a gun means shooting people, correct? That's... The purpose of a gun. Every firearms safety course I've ever heard of comes with the moniker 'you do not aim a weapon at someone unless you intend to shoot and kill'. A firearm is not an 'intimidation device', if you are telling him that he has to have a gun to feel safe, you are telling him that he has to be prepared to kill to be safe. Don't you advocate for guns? Don't you realize this? I'm not anti-gun, but it's simply a reality of what it means to 'defend' yourself.
[editline]9th November 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=BlindSniper17;51345438]Cross posting:[/QUOTE]
Pictured: Shit that you'd have to be a 'Histrionic' to be worried about.
[QUOTE=FlandersNed;51345434]You don't need a gun to feel safe.[/QUOTE]"I want you to be as defenseless as me because I'm scared and want to keep pretending that everything is okay!" That's the subtext I'm reading.
[QUOTE]In fact, you [I]shouldn't[/I] need a gun to feel safe.[/QUOTE]... Have you been paying attention to the discussion? Open violence against LGBT people because Pence "emboldens" bigots? Yeah, that's a cute sentiment you have, but like many, many things that shouldn't be this one still exists. I'm not going to prescribe to your, "yeah but like you don't [I]need[/I] a gun..." drivel when the post at the top of this page demonstrates why minorities do need to protect themselves.
[QUOTE=froztshock;51345462]You do realize that defending yourself with a gun means shooting people, correct? That's... The purpose of a gun.[/QUOTE]Yes, I am well aware of that.
[QUOTE]A firearm is not an 'intimidation device', if you are telling him that he has to have a gun to feel safe, you are telling him that he has to be prepared to kill to be safe. Don't you advocate for guns? Don't you realize this? I'm not anti-gun, but it's simply a reality of what it means to 'defend' yourself.[/QUOTE]Oh you were merely being a pedant and splitting hairs, it was all a ruse!
No, you explicitly implied that advocating for self-defense of LGBT persons was [I]bad.[/I] As in, I'm a real dick for stating that position, despite the fact that the post I was replying to was describing a world where such a scenario is to be [I]expected.[/I] Either that or you're hilariously awful at conveying your point, which is a possibility, and if that's the case then why did you even comment anyway? To let everyone know that people die when they are killed? Thanks, we got it.
[QUOTE]Pictured: Shit that you'd have to be a 'Histrionic' to be worried about.[/QUOTE]Quoted: missing the point entirely. This is just rich, you imply I'm a real asshole for saying protect yourself and then misapply my words to make it seem like I've said there's nothing to worry about!
Did you forget that I can remember the last page or something? I actually laughed out loud, bravo.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345346]"Britain is full of snaggle-toothed assholes and they did bad stuff after Brexit, so there will LITERALLY be right-wing death squads here because reasons and also Pence!"
What the fuck am I supposed to do with this, exactly?
Then get a gun and join the [I]many[/I] LGBT firearm owners who refuse to be victims.[/QUOTE]
You shouldn't have a gun to feel safe.
[editline]4[/editline]
whoops this has already been said many times, thankfully.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345508]"I want you to be as defenseless as me because I'm scared and want to keep pretending that everything is okay!" That's the subtext I'm reading.[/QUOTE]
[url]https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman[/url]
you should keep this site open and do a quick check for each fallacy before you post
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345508]"I want you to be as defenseless as me because I'm scared and want to keep pretending that everything is okay!" That's the subtext I'm reading.
... Have you been paying attention to the discussion? Open violence against LGBT people because Pence "emboldens" bigots? Yeah, that's a cute sentiment you have, but like many, many things that shouldn't be this one still exists. I'm not going to prescribe to your, "yeah but like you don't [I]need[/I] a gun..." drivel when the post at the top of this page demonstrates why minorities do need to protect themselves.
Yes, I am well aware of that.
Oh you were merely being a pedant and splitting hairs, it was all a ruse!
No, you explicitly implied that advocating for self-defense of LGBT persons was [I]bad.[/I] As in, I'm a real dick for stating that position, despite the fact that the post I was replying to was describing a world where such a scenario is to be [I]expected.[/I] Either that or you're hilariously awful at conveying your point, which is a possibility, and if that's the case then why did you even comment anyway? To let everyone know that people die when they are killed? Thanks, we got it.
Quoted: missing the point entirely. This is just rich, you imply I'm a real asshole for saying protect yourself and then misapply my words to make it seem like I've said there's nothing to worry about!
Did you forget that I can remember the last page or something? I actually laughed out loud, bravo.[/QUOTE]
I mean, you called him histrionic about being worried, and then we have all this shit of people posting hate symbols and telling black people to go back to Africa.
I don't exactly think that his response was particularly overwrought or theatrical given the circumstances, so that would imply to me that you're heavily downplaying his concerns, of which we have ample evidence (including statistics from a similar event that happened in Britain!)
Then you shrug and say that eh, his country has failed him, might as well fend for himself.
Doesn't that come off as just a tad bit callous to you?
[QUOTE=froztshock;51345462]Pictured: Shit that you'd have to be a 'Histrionic' to be worried about.[/QUOTE]
[B]EDIT:[/B] frotzshock was making a sarcastic reference that flew over my head to a comment made in earnest by someone else.
(Original post below because why not:)
---
[QUOTE][B]his·tri·on·ic - "overly theatrical or melodramatic in character or style."[/B][/QUOTE]
[t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cw2iRoTXcAIlC85.jpg[/t]
[I]"you'd have to be a 'Histrionic' to be worried about."[/I]
[I]"overly theatrical or melodramatic"[/I]
Okay
[QUOTE=BlindSniper17;51345524][t]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cw2iRoTXcAIlC85.jpg[/t]
[I]"you'd have to be a 'Histrionic' to be worried about."[/I]
[I]"overly theatrical or melodramatic"[/I]
Okay[/QUOTE]
I think you've misunderstood, I was quoting JJF on the previous page who characterized another poster as histrionic for being worried about the validation of right wing elements following the election of Trump.
Those were sarcasm quotes on my end.
[QUOTE=froztshock;51345533]I think you've misunderstood, I was quoting JJF on the previous page who characterized another poster as histrionic for being worried about the validation of right wing elements following the election of Trump.
Those were sarcasm quotes on my end.[/QUOTE]
Oh, gotcha.
While we're on the subject of graffiti
[img] https://i.imgur.com/iKl54nM.png[/img]
this shit isnt acceptable either
[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;51345563]While we're on the subject of graffiti
[img] https://i.imgur.com/iKl54nM.png[/img]
this shit isnt acceptable either[/QUOTE]
Why can't people just contain their political disagreements to obscure video game forums?
[QUOTE=Raidyr;51345576]Why can't people just contain their political disagreements to obscure video game forums?[/QUOTE]
because they feel they're losing everything
[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51345512]You shouldn't have a gun to feel safe.[/QUOTE][QUOTE]you should keep this site open and do a quick check for each fallacy before you post[/QUOTE]No, that wasn't a strawman. You might want to reexamine the definition presented on the site, because I wasn't misrepresenting his argument at all to make it easier to attack. Actually I misrepresented it to give it far more substance, because "hurr you don't need a gun" is a stupid argument, and then I responded to it [I]anyway[/I] because I'm nice like that Since you said the same thing, I'll quote my response that you clearly didn't read:[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345508]"I want you to be as defenseless as me because I'm scared and want to keep pretending that everything is okay!" That's the subtext I'm reading.
... Have you been paying attention to the discussion? Open violence against LGBT people because Pence "emboldens" bigots? Yeah, that's a cute sentiment you have, but like many, many things that shouldn't be this one still exists. I'm not going to prescribe to your, "yeah but like you don't [I]need[/I] a gun..." drivel when the post at the top of this page demonstrates why minorities do need to protect themselves.[/QUOTE]
Or would you rather I have laughed and said, "enjoy Cletus beating your face in, won't happen to me!" instead? I'm sure that would have been easier for you to understand.
[QUOTE=froztshock;51345521]I mean, you called him histrionic about being worried, and then we have all this shit of people posting hate symbols and telling black people to go back to Africa.[/QUOTE]I called him histrionic because,[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345346]You keep trying to pin me like I'm giving Trump a free pass post after post and I'm getting annoyed with your histrionic bullshit.[/QUOTE]
Seems pretty cut and dry, if either of you need me to carefully walk you through my posts just say so.
[QUOTE]I don't exactly think that his response was particularly overwrought or theatrical given the circumstances, so that would imply to me that you're heavily downplaying his concerns, of which we have ample evidence (including statistics from a similar event that happened in Britain!)[/QUOTE]Hence this discussion about LGBT self-defense.
[QUOTE]Then you shrug and say that eh, his country has failed him, might as well fend for himself.
Doesn't that come off as just a tad bit callous to you?[/QUOTE]If ROFLBURGER was honest he'd post the link he sent to me to you, but he's demonstrated repeatedly that he evidently feels such trivialities are beneath him.
Running with it for a bit, so what if it's callous? Clearly the picture of Trump's presidency that AngryToad, yourself, ROFLBURGER, and plenty others have been painting is a repressive hellhole where all joy and progress have been dashed against the rocks of bigotry and meme magic. Again I ask [I]what[/I] do you want me to do about it? Cry? Star your posts? Write a protest song? [I]Something more drastic?[/I] I can't do anything about it at all, short of being slightly less of a saucy motherfucker I can't do anything for you or for anyone else. That's pretty much been my point for two threads, unless you're going to do something wildly over the top then you might as well settle down, collect your thoughts, and patiently wait to see what actually happens [I]when Donald Trump actually takes office![/I] Reminder here, he's not going to be in office for awhile! Losing your shit now is not only pointless it's counter-productive, people are threatening to end their own lives for fuck's sake.
I also never said he or anyone else is fucked and should fend for themselves, I actually didn't reply to AngryToad's comments about when or how to organize to tackle any upcoming issues. Do I know the answer to that? Nope. Not at all. I think Govna's posts in another thread about organizing [I]now[/I] for the upcoming shit is a good idea though, so if you want to get involved with lobbying or a grassroots campaign then go right ahead. I'll support you, I think LGBT rights fall under human rights [I]just like 2nd Amendment rights.[/I] Surprise, the libertarian in the thread thinks the government oppressing people is a bad thing. What a shocker.
[editline]9th November 2016[/editline]
Before it happens, I want everyone to know I don't expect very good responses to my post. Especially from ROFLBURGER, using a website to present an argument for you [I]and then using it incorrectly[/I] is just lazy. (I still laughed, even though I was disappointed)
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345610]No, that wasn't a strawman. You might want to reexamine the definition presented on the site, because I wasn't misrepresenting his argument at all to make it easier to attack. Actually I misrepresented it to give it far more substance because[/quote]
There really isn't an if and or but when it comes to strawmanning. You simplified his argument to make it easier to attack so don't give me that excuse.
[quote]"hurr you don't need a gun" is a stupid argument, and then I responded to it [I]anyway.[/I] Since you said the same thing, I'll quote my response that you clearly didn't read:
[quote]"I want you to be as defenseless as me because I'm scared and want to keep pretending that everything is okay!" That's the subtext I'm reading.
... Have you been paying attention to the discussion? Open violence against LGBT people because Pence "emboldens" bigots? Yeah, that's a cute sentiment you have, but like many, many things that shouldn't be this one still exists. I'm not going to prescribe to your, "yeah but like you don't need a gun..." drivel when the post at the top of this page demonstrates why minorities do need to protect themselves."[/quote]
Or would you rather I have laughed and said, "enjoy Cletus beating your face in, won't happen to me!" instead? I'm sure that would have been easier for you to understand.[/quote]
No, I rather you act like an adult and actually argue with people properly.
You shouldn't have to own a gun to feel safe. If kids in my backyard were trying to light my house on fire with gas and matches, the police shouldn't say "just use a fire extinguisher bro" and not do anything. You're prescribing the simplest, obviously biased, solution to a complex problem whilst putting a burden on the victim.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345610]If ROFLBURGER was honest he'd post the link he sent to me to you, but he's demonstrated repeatedly that he evidently feels such trivialities are beneath him.
Running with it for a bit, so what if it's callous? Clearly the picture of Trump's presidency that AngryToad, yourself, ROFLBURGER, and plenty others have been painting is a repressive hellhole where all joy and progress have been dashed against the rocks of bigotry and meme magic.[/quote]
I'm going to stop you right there. I don't think I've done any painting of that sort.. The most I've done was a fingerpainting of a post saying that 90% of Trump's promise policies (BUILD THAT WALL, MORE JOBS, DEFEAT ISIS) will not work and that's it.
I genuinely believe that a Trump presidency will be a failed presidency in the sense where all his promises will not be implemented.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345610]Before it happens, I want everyone to know I don't expect very good responses to my post. Especially from ROFLBURGER, using a website to present an argument for you [I]and then using it incorrectly[/I] is just lazy. (I still laughed, even though I was disappointed)[/QUOTE]
Is this really what we've come to? Come on, dude. You're better than that.
Another cross post:
[QUOTE=BlindSniper17;51345666]
Go to this Facebook page for more screencaps: [url]https://www.facebook.com/shaunking/[/url]
As people said earlier, some could be fake, but I strongly doubt that:
[t]http://i.imgur.com/2929on0.jpg[/t]
[QUOTE]She woke up and her SUV was tagged with "Trump Rules" and "Black Bitch"
Day 1 of Donald Trump[/QUOTE]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/coeFMFp.jpg[/t]
[QUOTE]A hate crime just happened at San Diego State University.[/QUOTE]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/4w9BZ8F.jpg[/t]
[QUOTE]At Walmart a woman pulled her Hijab off today and threatened her. [/QUOTE]
[t]http://i.imgur.com/bfsNfp9.jpg[/t]
(This last one is not from the FB page, but I'm showing it anyways)
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345427][I]"Stop it you're making me feel stupid!"[/I] the posts. Did I tell you to shoot anyone? No. I said just get a gun and refuse to be a victim. I think that's perfectly clear, if somebody [I]does[/I] try to harm you then [U][B][I]defend[/I][/U] yourself.[/B] Are you honestly that fucking insane that you'd rather forfeit your life for an unlimited pass to whine about how your life sucks? I don't know why else would you respond to, "you should defend yourself," with, "IMAGINE TELLING SOMEBODY THEY NEED TO FIGHT THEIR MURDERER TO LIVE!!!!! SICK!!!!!"[/QUOTE]
I'm not saying to [i]shoot[/i] someone, I'm just saying own a firearm and point it at a person and pull the trigger and a bullet will come out and if the bullet should just [i]magically[/i] hit someone and they [i]for some reason[/i] stop living it's a okay!
Stop fucking lying to yourself.
[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51345672]There really isn't an if and or but when it comes to strawmanning. You simplified his argument to make it easier to attack so don't give me that excuse.[/QUOTE]I specifically didn't simplify his argument, if there's a fallacy there it isn't a strawman. I actually didn't even address my [I]complication[/I] of his [I]simple[/I] argument but instead addressed [I]his original argument[/I] (pay attention here) so I didn't actually fulfill the latter requirement for it to be a strawman at all. You are objectively wrong.
[QUOTE]No, I rather you act like an adult and actually argue with people properly.[/QUOTE]I did, but as I said earlier you clearly don't give a shit about being honest because this shit:[QUOTE]You shouldn't have to own a gun to feel safe. If kids in my backyard were trying to light my house on fire with gas and matches, the police shouldn't say "just use a fire extinguisher bro" and not do anything. You're prescribing the simplest, obviously biased, solution to a complex problem whilst putting a burden on the victim.[/QUOTE]Is not arguing "properly." I'm not the police, I don't know if you were unaware of that, but surprise surprise I'm not that mystical force that can protect you 24/7 as you seem to be implying. If I say, "you should be able to defend yourself," or more simply, "defend yourself," it doesn't mean the police cannot and will not ever come swooping in to stop a crime on your person while it's in progress. Running with your analogy if those kids are setting your house on fire you seem to be wringing your fists and screaming at me to shut up when I say, "you should use your fire extinguisher," and bitching about how you shouldn't [I]need[/I] to do that.
Have fun with your charred remains of a house, I guess. Oh that's not all, while you're fuming in impotent rage at the situation a gaggle of burn victims comes along and starts bitching at me for telling you to use a fire extinguisher. Yeah, I don't think you need to tell me to be the adult here.
[QUOTE]I'm going to stop you right there. I don't think I've done any painting of that sort.. The most I've done was a fingerpainting of a post saying that 90% of Trump's promise policies (BUILD THAT WALL, MORE JOBS, DEFEAT ISIS) will not work and that's it.[/QUOTE]Sure, you're probably right an I concede that you've fingerpainted elsewhere. I have to ask though, why the fuck are you here talking to me? I never [I]once[/I] said any of his policies will or won't work in this thread and for several posts I'm pretty sure I made it quite clear that "wait and see" is the better position over blind hysteria. Yet you've but in and stuck yourself in this conversation, got your sticky goddamn fingers on everything, and you're telling me the same shit they're saying about how nobody "needs" a gun because [I]haha[/I] I guess the posts BlindSniper17 are just fabricated bullshit.
[QUOTE]Is this really what we've come to? Come on, dude. You're better than that.[/QUOTE]Maybe that was a little snarky, but I stand by what I said.
[QUOTE=Paramud;51345688]I'm not saying to [i]shoot[/i] someone, I'm just saying own a firearm and point it at a person and pull the trigger and a bullet will come out and if the bullet should just [i]magically[/i] hit someone and they [i]for some reason[/i] stop living it's a okay!
Stop fucking lying to yourself.[/QUOTE]Haha, wow buddy. I mean looking at the posts I quoted and then using [I]context clues[/I] to figure out I was explaining that no, you don't need to roam around killing people in a fit of LGBT terror, must be hard.
No, seriously though. I'm just wondering what your point is here. That I used a specific turn of phrase that bothered the shit out of you? I don't get it.
The point, JJF, is that if you need a gun in our society to assure that you are safe, then you are by default, NOT SAFE.
Instead of arming the populace that can be victimized, we should be stopping people who are doing the victimization. You should try to catch a pyromaniac, rather than sit back and laugh at people who didn't insure their homes from fire.
[QUOTE=gufu;51345931]The point, JJF, is that if you need a gun in our society to assure that you are safe, then you are by default, NOT SAFE.
Instead of arming the populace that can be victimized, we should be stopping people who are doing the victimization. [B]You should try to catch a pyromaniac, rather than sit back and laugh at people who didn't insure their homes from fire.[/B][/QUOTE]
Certianly, but catching that pyromaniac is going to be a lengthy process, and in the meantime, a fire extinguisher might be a prudent investment.
[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;51345874]I specifically didn't simplify his argument, if there's a fallacy there it isn't a strawman. I actually didn't even address my [I]complication[/I] of his [I]simple[/I] argument but instead addressed [I]his original argument[/I] (pay attention here) so I didn't actually fulfill the latter requirement for it to be a strawman at all. You are objectively wrong.[/quote]
His original argument? Can you point out his original argument because I looked at FlandersNed's post history and I can't find any argument of his relating to guns in this thread.
[quote]I did, but as I said earlier you clearly don't give a shit about being honest because this shit:Is not arguing "properly."[/quote]
How am I being dishonest right now?
[quote]I'm not the police, I don't know if you were unaware of that, but surprise surprise I'm not that mystical force that can protect you 24/7 as you seem to be implying. If I say, "you should be able to defend yourself," or more simply, "defend yourself," it doesn't mean the police cannot and will not ever come swooping in to stop a crime on your person while it's in progress. Running with your analogy if those kids are setting your house on fire you seem to be wringing your fists and screaming at me to shut up when I say, "you should use your fire extinguisher," and bitching about how you shouldn't [I]need[/I] to do that.[/quote]
You just butchered the analogy.
It would be more appropriate if it is known that kids are going around lighting fires everywhere, and the public doesn't feel safe so they outcry to the police, but then some folk who adore this one product tell the endangered citizens that "they should buy this product instead of complaining and being a victim".
If there is a problem that is caused by GROUP A that targets GROUP B, and can be solved by improving the behavior of GROUP A, then improving GROUP A's behavior should be that solution. It shouldn't be place burden on GROUP B so they can solve their own shit. GROUP B shouldn't suffer more.
[quote]Have fun with your charred remains of a house, I guess. Oh that's not all, while you're fuming in impotent rage at the situation a gaggle of burn victims comes along and starts bitching at me for telling you to use a fire extinguisher. Yeah, I don't think you need to tell me to be the adult here.[/quote]
This would only make sense in the context of us having a firearm and refusing to use it while their life is being threatened. This is my fault because I fucked up my analogy because I was talking in the context of it happening.
[quote]Sure, you're probably right an I concede that you've fingerpainted elsewhere. I have to ask though, why the fuck are you here talking to me? I never [I]once[/I] said any of his policies will or won't work in this thread and for several posts I'm pretty sure I made it quite clear that "wait and see" is the better position over blind hysteria. Yet you've but in and stuck yourself in this conversation, got your sticky goddamn fingers on everything, and you're telling me the same shit they're saying about how nobody "needs" a gun because [I]haha[/I] I guess the posts BlindSniper17 are just fabricated bullshit.
Maybe that was a little snarky, but I stand by what I said.[/QUOTE]
Because your arguments actually offend me to the point where I need to tell you how fucked up they are.
[QUOTE=gufu;51345931]The point, JJF, is that if you need a gun in our society to assure that you are safe, then you are by default, NOT SAFE.[/QUOTE][B]Safety is a fucking [I]illusion[/I] people cling to because the alternative is a perpetual state of self and situational awareness.[/B]
I could get in my car, drive to your house, drive [I]into[/I] your house, and then hop out to give you a wet willy just on a goddamn whim. Even if you had a gun it doesn't make you [I]safe[/I] it just gives you the ability to fend me off a bit easier, you're still not safe. You have the illusion of safety.
[QUOTE]Instead of arming the populace that can be victimized, we should be stopping people who are doing the victimization. You should try to catch a pyromaniac, rather than sit back and laugh at people who didn't insure their homes from fire.[/QUOTE][I]Good luck with that.[/I] I'm not laughing at people with burned houses, I'm laughing because the alternative is getting angry at people with naive, juvenile views of the world who think that if we had just elected Hillary the bigotry would have magically gone away. Or something. I have no idea why, with actual photographic evidence, people are still asserting that no, it's better to just [I]trust[/I] that the police force's crack team of telepaths and clairvoyants will keep them safe.
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