Australian solders left for dead in Afghanistan by Dutch Apache helicopters - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Chilean;25566100]I also read that they have uptight ROE. When ROE is broken a little bit, they shoot up civilian vans and you all get pissed. When they're trying too hard to enforce it, people die. This shit is delicate. And if you really think you're getting the whole story here you're an idiot.[/QUOTE] I'd gladly fuck up surrounding buildings which fire was coming from to save my allies.

[QUOTE=Dlaor-guy;25565899]I like how everyone attacks the country of origin of the pilots, if they were for example German, they'd say "oh those silly germans they lost 2 wars and still can't land a heli" etc. [editline]22nd October 2010[/editline] This.[/QUOTE] There's a distinction here. If the ROE causes them to be this useless that they can't even engage someone who is already shooting at your allies, it is the countries fault. If the pilots just didn't want to engage them out of cowardice, it is the pilots fault. Either the countries military is fucked up or the pilots are useless, it has to be one or both.

[QUOTE=rosar0980;25559983]Just realized it said one American dead. That pisses me off more than anything else. We spend so much money sending troops over there, maintaining bases in their country, and sending them their attack choppers. Then, they turn around and screw us when we need help from said helos.[/QUOTE] goddamn are you dense even im american and i'm more staggered at the idleness of these dutch pilots than just one soldier dead good grief

[img]http://filesmelt.com/dl/dutch1.gif[/img] Asshole should have helped them. I've lost all respect for my army.

[QUOTE=Leg of Doom;25565727]Wow I didn't know Denmark are such pussies no one s going to want to help them now[/QUOTE] That would be the Danish. The Dutch are from Holland.

What a bunch of pussies.

I don't think they would have had a chance at taking down Apaches with an RPG, low level strafing run with hellfires? Shit you hit a moving target with an RPG that isn't guided in anyway while it's raking your ass with rockets and machineguns. The helicopter pilots are fucking pussies.

Apaches are designed to take an awful beating before they're considered 'fucked'. It's the basic principle that this Apache did nothing to protect said troops on the ground. Regardless of what the pilots were thinking; these helicopters are designed to give covering fire so troops can either charge or retreat from any position (obviously that's not the ONLY reason they were designed, but you know what I'm saying.) Failure to do so defeats the purpose of even sending the Apache out there. It costs so much fucking money just to send these things out to theatre.

This is our answer to australian internet laws.

Fuck the pilots might not have even had to engage, if they just dropped down to near ground level and started circling the attackers and firing ahead of them they would probably have shat bricks and that could have gave the friendly troops time to get the fuck out of their. Fucking cowards, there are times when the ROE should be broken, and that was one of then.

I think we should stick whit trading, and let the real guys fight (and forget that they also fuck things up but thats not my problem). [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oUJTHApQfw[/media]

[QUOTE=bravehat;25567789] Fucking cowards, there are times when the ROE should be broken, and that was one of then.[/QUOTE] Won't you get court martialled for that or whatever the fuck it's called?

[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;25567845]Won't you get court martialled for that or whatever the fuck it's called?[/QUOTE] Anyone with half an ass would see it had to be done. Save men and risk getting kicked out of the army, or abide the bureaucratic bullshit and watch men die.

They should give their Apaches to the Germans, so we don't have to use those fucking Tigers.

[QUOTE=TH89;25559339]So, a retired soldier publishes a book, makes an inflammatory press release about how some Dutch helicopter pilots, in all probability, did what they were trained to do, and an Australian rag writes an even more inflammatory article about it. Despite what they'd have you believe Apache helicopters are not designed to withstand RPGs[/QUOTE] Like an RPG would have had more than a slim chance of hitting them, especially fired by an untrained insurgent? RPG warheads detonate after about 4 seconds of flight, as the fuse causes it to detonate at around 1000m. Apaches can engage targets from way beyond that distance, so they didn't even need to expose themselves to enemy fire to take out the insurgents.

[QUOTE=MuTAnT;25562403]All Australians are descendants of bloodthirsty criminals. This is why guns and knives are pretty much illegal in Australia. It'd be chaos.[/QUOTE] wow you're such a massive idiot it's not even funny

[QUOTE=JDER14;25559377]RPG-7s are SHITTY anti-air rockets. If anything the Apaches still could of taken some of the heat.[/QUOTE] Fuck I accidentally rated disagree. Those pilots were assholes so was the air support coordinator.

[QUOTE=Bird;25568127]Fucking cowards, would have jumped down like Rambo with a machine gun if I could.[/QUOTE] [img]http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/01/apachegunMOS2101_468x381.jpg[/img] 4 royal marines did that to recover the body of a comrade.

ITT Everyone is a trained soldier, was there when it happened and had a clear view of everything that happened.

[QUOTE=DarkWolf2;25568221]ITT Everyone is a trained soldier, was there when it happened and had a clear view of everything that happened.[/QUOTE] My cousin is a Tiger pilot, he said it's piss easy to evade RPG-7 shoots [editline]22nd October 2010[/editline] Well, he wasn't in a firefight yet, but, ya know, those things are fast 'n shit

[QUOTE=DarkWolf2;25568221]ITT Everyone is a trained soldier, was there when it happened and had a clear view of everything that happened.[/QUOTE] pretty much the entire thread

[QUOTE=DarkWolf2;25568221]ITT Everyone is a trained soldier, was there when it happened and had a clear view of everything that happened.[/QUOTE] By trying to counter anything that anyone said here, you're implying that you're the same. In other words your argument holds the idiot ball tightly

The mere presence of two Apache gunships would probably have detered the Taliban if they knew they were there. If the tabloid article and what the Australian soldier is saying is true, why are the Dutch even there? If they don't want to fight, and are willing to let their allies to die right in front of them without lifting a finger on the chance, no matter how small, that they are wounded or killed maybe they should just fuck off and clear the airspace so real soliders can get tasked to CAS.

[QUOTE=Victis;25560234]It's impossible to know the outcome of any similar battle, you people all state that 'they could easily have dodged the rocketfire' or 'they could easily have saved all of those people' or blame them for cowardice. But how do you know this? are you an apache-pilot? do you even serve in the military? You don't know what the situation at the time was, all you have to go on is a article.[/QUOTE] No and no, but my grandpa who served in Vietnam had a similar situation. The only difference being he and his wingman were in bombers. Guess what? They told command to blow it their ass and saved roughly 18 troops and two downed Huey's. They got a slap on the wrist and later congratulated for heroism.

Wow those Apache pilots are bitches. I remember watching a show yesterday about a medi-chopper that wasn't armoured at all and the pilots and medics were still willing to go into the line of fire to help people injured by a gunman.

I don't want to defend these 2 pilots but I do want to defend the other dutch soldiers out there. They actually do shit and most of the people in this thread are bashing the whole dutch army because of 2 damn pilots. Other dutch pilots actually have taken measures in the past. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z_jq9g5oBVo&feature=related[/media] (see 1.05) And not to forget the groundtroops. And is it just me or are the Australians always bashing the Dutch for being "cowards". You don't see me saying: "Wow! all those civilian killing Americunts" because some helicopter opened fire on camera people and a vehicle with kids inside of it. Don't judge a whole nation because of 2 pilots.

They weren't going to get closer at that moment, then they told them to fuck off. He got ordered to go away. I don't see why everyone is going batshit crazy. He got told to go away. He listened.

[QUOTE=joost1120;25570135]They weren't going to get closer at that moment, then they told them to fuck off. He got ordered to go away. I don't see why everyone is going batshit crazy. He got told to go away. He listened.[/QUOTE] Because he was told to go away after he refused to provide any support. He was told to clear the airspace so that air support that would actually shoot at enemy troops could come in.

[QUOTE=joost1120;25570135]They weren't going to get closer at that moment, then they told them to fuck off. He got ordered to go away. I don't see why everyone is going batshit crazy. He got told to go away. He listened.[/QUOTE] Let me run a scenario past you. You are walking down the street and you are attacked by someone. There is a policeman nearby. You call for his help but he says he has been instructed not to intervene. You aren't exactly going to say "fair enough". Your trying to make it sound like it wasn't the fault of the Apache crew, and it is a really, really bad attempt.

[QUOTE=MegaChalupa;25559383]RPG's aren't designed to take down helicopters either.[/QUOTE] Insurgent groups in afganistan use them for everything. *** that is all