Gay marriage legalized in Denmark - Polidicks

I really thought it was legal already.

You guys are not alone. I was really surprised to see this.

[QUOTE=sp00ks;36235502]By not letting them get married they are discriminating against them.[/QUOTE] I'd say that's up to the person you ask. I of course think that they should have the right, but by taking this into the legal system and then force some other qualities onto the church is actually what we're doing. We aren't only talking about laws here, we're talking about theology. Can we just impose the state's views upon the church that many people in Denmark is a attending? Of course the result would be the same, but it's the principle. About it being discrimination: Marriage isn't a human right, but of course everyone should be able to. But is it really discrimination if the church doesn't want to? The church follows (let's just say that to make things easier) the bible, and if they say that marriage is between a man and a woman, they should have their right to believe and exercise this. It's my opinion that the state should provide an alternative, which gives the same legal rights. If the legal rights are the same for a person, they are equal and not discriminated. That's my reasoning. But if the church can provide the whole thing, fantastic.

[QUOTE=Daniellynet;36236228]You guys are not alone. I was really surprised to see this.[/QUOTE] It's really just the formality of calling it a marriage that they can have now, this post explained it well: [QUOTE=Muggi;36233935]Gay people have up until now been able to enter "registered partnership" or whatever, which was, from a technical point of view, the same (as in, they get the same benefits as married couples would, and are considered married from a legal view point). But they have not been able to marry in the traditional sense, in a church that is, officially until today (well, there were some priests who married gay couples anyway, but that wasn't recognized or something).[/QUOTE]

Most privileges we have aren't human rights, but that doesn't mean it's not discrimination denying them to certain groups. Denmark is a country where it is illegal to discriminate against homosexuals. I don't care if you believe that the creator of the universe agrees with your position or not. When the church is basically a part of the state, it's a no-brainer.

[QUOTE=sp00ks;36236478]Most privileges we have aren't human rights, but that doesn't mean it's not discrimination denying them to certain groups. Denmark is a country where it is illegal to discriminate against homosexuals. I don't care if you believe that the creator of the universe agrees with your position or not. When the church is basically a part of the state, it's a no-brainer.[/QUOTE] I'm talking about also respecting the opinions of those within the church (and I actually think we're treading a fine line), and then that I personally don't see the difference between being married by the state, and married by the church, if they're legally exactly the same. I can understand that people would want to be married in a church, but I don't find it discrimination as long as there is an alternative. But as said, it isn't really relevant in this case, as the end result would probably be the same whether it was the congregation or the state that decided the matter. I applaud the decision, but I doubt the method.

The fact that there is an alternative doesn't mean it's not discrimination. Imagine one chain of supermarkets saying they won't sell anything to homosexuals. All the other chains still do it, but it's still discrimination.

[QUOTE=sp00ks;36237075]The fact that there is an alternative doesn't mean it's not discrimination. Imagine one chain of supermarkets saying they won't sell anything to homosexuals. All the other chains still do it, but it's still discrimination.[/QUOTE] I'd say this isn't quite as harsh, and we don't want to do away with people's voices because of the political climate. That's all I'm saying, I don't like the method, but the end result is great.

I really hate this whole discussion, because in my opinion, there shouldn't be one. I'm for gay marriage, but I'm not for gay marriage in the sense that they should be able to get married in a church, and it's not because I'm old fashion or overly christian. However, it just doesn't make any logical sense to me WHY gay people would want to get married in a church? It's a _CHRISTIAN_ institution who has an issue with man-on-man action. Why would you want to be married into a belief where you aren't welcome? And WHY is it their right to be so? They aren't welcomed by the faith itself. I don't care how many priests see it, because frankly, the bible literally state that being gay is, not a sin, but simply wrong and disgusting. It's not even something you can interpret as you want; look it up. It literally says so in the bible and seeing as the bible is basically the rulebook of christianity, it doesn't make any sense why they'd even want to get married. It's not a right they have, not when it comes to christianity.

The New Testament says nothing about homosexuality. Not allowing homosexuals to get married is discrimination, no matter what the church believes about homosexuality.

And lutherans have always been pretty bro about gay people from what I've seen, at least the danish ones.

Denmark? More like [i]Men[/i]mark.

[QUOTE=SaWAH;36256130]I really hate this whole discussion, because in my opinion, there shouldn't be one. I'm for gay marriage, but I'm not for gay marriage in the sense that they should be able to get married in a church, and it's not because I'm old fashion or overly christian. However, it just doesn't make any logical sense to me WHY gay people would want to get married in a church? It's a _CHRISTIAN_ institution who has an issue with man-on-man action. Why would you want to be married into a belief where you aren't welcome? And WHY is it their right to be so? They aren't welcomed by the faith itself. I don't care how many priests see it, because frankly, the bible literally state that being gay is, not a sin, but simply wrong and disgusting. It's not even something you can interpret as you want; look it up. It literally says so in the bible and seeing as the bible is basically the rulebook of christianity, it doesn't make any sense why they'd even want to get married. It's not a right they have, not when it comes to christianity.[/QUOTE] it's because weddings have lost most religious connotations - well, to most people, anyway. most kids are brought up with the idea that one day, they'll stand in a chapel during some grand ceremony with their soon-to-be spouse and become newlyweds, and that includes kids who end up becoming gay adults... that desire and mentality sticks, so it kinda sucks that they get denied the opportunity I mean, I get what you're saying, but compare it to something like Christmas. a lot of people celebrate it, but most people don't really celebrate it in a religious sense, even though it's supposed to be a celebration of Jesus Christ's birth.

[QUOTE=RearAdmiral;36256598]Denmark? More like [i]Men[/i]mark.[/QUOTE] That was horrible and you should feel horrible :v:

[QUOTE=Crimor;36256616]That was horrible and you should feel horrible :v:[/QUOTE] I do. It's not even a real joke. [img]http://sae.tweek.us/static/images/emoticons/emot-saddowns.gif[/img] Still, congrats Denmark. I should imagine there's a lot of gay honeymoons on the horizon.

gay marriage was legal in Maine until a referendum came about fuck :(

[QUOTE=Luafox;36257192]its not supposed to be to anyone who's not christian, its not even a christian holiday to begin with but anyway, i thought denmark had done this long ago seeing how its a scandinavian country, but good that they did it at last.[/QUOTE] We technically had, like we could get married, but not in a church.

[QUOTE=Luafox;36257192]its not supposed to be to anyone who's not christian, its not even a christian holiday to begin with but anyway, i thought denmark had done this long ago seeing how its a scandinavian country, but good that they did it at last.[/QUOTE] As far as I remember we were the first to make legal gay marriage possible, we were just a bit slow on this one.

[QUOTE=SaWAH;36256130]I really hate this whole discussion, because in my opinion, there shouldn't be one. I'm for gay marriage, but I'm not for gay marriage in the sense that they should be able to get married in a church, and it's not because I'm old fashion or overly christian. However, it just doesn't make any logical sense to me WHY gay people would want to get married in a church? It's a _CHRISTIAN_ institution who has an issue with man-on-man action. Why would you want to be married into a belief where you aren't welcome? And WHY is it their right to be so? They aren't welcomed by the faith itself. I don't care how many priests see it, because frankly, the bible literally state that being gay is, not a sin, but simply wrong and disgusting. It's not even something you can interpret as you want; look it up. It literally says so in the bible and seeing as the bible is basically the rulebook of christianity, it doesn't make any sense why they'd even want to get married. It's not a right they have, not when it comes to christianity.[/QUOTE] Gays started to spread the AIDS, so i somewhat understand on why some people hate them to death. (it was originally gay - disease, till it expanded to straight people.)

[QUOTE=killer89;36260791]Gays started to spread the AIDS, so i somewhat understand on why some people hate them to death. (it was originally gay - disease, till it expanded to straight people.)[/QUOTE] Umm no it wasn't. Gays were used as a scapegoat.

[QUOTE=killer89;36260791]Gays started to spread the AIDS, so i somewhat understand on why some people hate them to death. (it was originally gay - disease, till it expanded to straight people.)[/QUOTE] how can you be this uninformed It [I]was[/I] more rampant in the gay community than the straight, but it wasn't limited to gay people ever.

I wrote a long-ass post in Danish on facebook explaining why the current church-system we have is best for us. I'll just quote it, but for non-danes, all it amounts up to is that if it's changed, we risk going all badshit towards a muslim-like state, where church controls state OR we go the american way and everyone just gets seriously focused and sensationalistic about all of the things that matter shit-all. I also clarify that out national church isn't much more than a state-driven ceremonial institution and by virtue of being state-driven, can't discriminate people for things they can't help being. [quote][sp] Person: "Så er det vidst tid at melde sig ud af kirken" Mig: Det er også fint at få gjort. Om man er for eller imod kan man ikke ændre på at Folkekirken er statsdrevet og at staten ikke må diskriminere på basis af køn. Folkekirken er ikke en kirke, men en ceremoniel service til folket i et land hvor kristendom ikke er meget mere end mærkedage for de fleste. Jeg er enig i deres beslutning på grund af dette og jeg er enig i at alle der er imod bør melde sig ud hvis de ønsker det og tilslutte sig en kirke der giver dem den service som de ønsker. Hvis den service er at diskriminere på basis af bibelske tekster, rettere end at være konstruktiv. så fred være med det. Så længe det ikke er obligatorisk fra statens side. Det er faktisk generelt træls at se hvor mange der gør indsigelser i hvordan andre folk lever deres liv. Man kan så sige at det er meget heldigt at disse indsigelser ikke rækker ind til hvad der foregår i hjemmet her til lands, men for vidt går de stadig når de skal styre andre folks gøren og laden i kirken. Hvis et træ vælter i skoven, får man så ondt af det? Njøh. Dine børn bliver jo ikke homoseksualiserede af at andre gør det og det er sådan set mere en sag imellem gud og individet end det er en sag imellem dig og individet eller kirken og individet. Min vinkel er egentlig bare at kirken har åbnet endnu en port for mennesker til at gå frem til deres endelige dom foran gud og det kan jeg ikke se er skadeligt medmindre ens frygt er mere jordisk... F.eks. bevarelse af traditioner eller kontrol over andres vilje. Min grundlæggende tanke er egentlig at en stats-drevet kirke er en elendig idé når det kommer til tro da det eneste den gør er at kvæle alle andre trosretninger en protestanter. Det negative ved at fjerne den er så at vi pludselig sidder med et system meget lig det amerikanske... Vi kommer til at have galskab på lige fod med WBC og Jehova på meget bredere plan. Jeg ved ikke helt hvad jeg helst vil have, for i sidste ende kan begge føre til at gamle hoveder kommer til at styre meget mere i mit liv end de burde, uafhængig af hvad din egen intention kunne være.[/sp] [/quote] Really. Religion really means near to nothing to us as a nation. The only reason there is so much animosity towards Muslims specifically is due to a narrowminded fear that they'll start infiltrating our government and start passing laws in accordance to Sharia or whatever. Just watch any real-film produced here since 1998 or any of the animated films of late and you should work out that we're far from squeamish and polite enough to have any kind of socially enforced religion.

[QUOTE=Lazore;36234029]Christian longballs[/QUOTE] In Danish it's longass.. "Christian longass"

It's been an over-blown public discussion and we're not used to having irrelevant religious discussions on a national level. Never had one before. We're more concerned with important subjects, like social prosperity, educational issues, health concerns, free speech (big thing since the Muhammed shitstorm). With all of those subjects comes responsibility to keep the discussion within sensibility, so they take a wildly different direction than in Britain or America where one descends into fist fighting and the other into an incoherrent screaming competition. [editline]9th June 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=DDmaster;36261115]In Danish it's longass.. "Christian longass"[/QUOTE] Aldrig hørt om Lange Løg?

[QUOTE=killer89;36260791]Gays started to spread the AIDS, so i somewhat understand on why some people hate them to death. (it was originally gay - disease, till it expanded to straight people.)[/QUOTE] straight people started every other disease... [editline]9th June 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Bomimo;36261087]Hvis den service er at diskriminere på basis af bibelske tekster, rettere end at være konstruktiv. så fred være med det. Så længe det ikke er obligatorisk fra statens side.[/QUOTE] High school education is obligatory either, but imagine if they discriminated against homosexuals.

[QUOTE=sp00ks;36262009]straight people started every other disease... [editline]9th June 2012[/editline] High school education is obligatory either, but imagine if they discriminated against homosexuals.[/QUOTE] AIDS being one of the few, which still doesnt have a cure.

[QUOTE=sp00ks;36262009] High school education is obligatory either, but imagine if they discriminated against homosexuals.[/QUOTE] Isn't* and who discriminated against Homosexuals? Education is to be legally available to all who qualify, since it's managed by state. The minimal requirement for High-School/College is 9th Grade exams passed. Minimal requirements for University is Passed College. The reason for these requirements are more about qualification than discrimination. If they banned Homosexuals, Denmark would implode. It's not in our DNA to restrict anyone by law. We just cuss them out and abuse them verbally in a jokey manner. Leave it to Republicans and the Middle-East to talk about legal preferences to a certain social group. We were the first country with Legalized porn. We don't give a shit about restricting much of anything ever. Except for a few minor hickups possibly. Point still stands. services provided by the state has to treat each national equally to the others or at least with a common minimum denominator that is acceptable. [editline]9th June 2012[/editline] Hvorfor føler jeg for at finde nogle gamle Mogens Glistrup klip frem? Når ja, det er fordi han er så skudt i hovedet som denne debat har været.

Not allowing homosexuals to get married in a state run church is discrimination.

It would appear that gonedead0 is a butthurt homophobe. Mind posting so that we may laugh at your expense?

[QUOTE=SaWAH;36256130]I really hate this whole discussion, because in my opinion, there shouldn't be one. I'm for gay marriage, but I'm not for gay marriage in the sense that they should be able to get married in a church, and it's not because I'm old fashion or overly christian. However, it just doesn't make any logical sense to me WHY gay people would want to get married in a church? It's a _CHRISTIAN_ institution who has an issue with man-on-man action. Why would you want to be married into a belief where you aren't welcome? And WHY is it their right to be so? They aren't welcomed by the faith itself. I don't care how many priests see it, because frankly, the bible literally state that being gay is, not a sin, but simply wrong and disgusting. It's not even something you can interpret as you want; look it up. It literally says so in the bible and seeing as the bible is basically the rulebook of christianity, it doesn't make any sense why they'd even want to get married. It's not a right they have, not when it comes to christianity.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Furioso;36256613]it's because weddings have lost most religious connotations - well, to most people, anyway. most kids are brought up with the idea that one day, they'll stand in a chapel during some grand ceremony with their soon-to-be spouse and become newlyweds, and that includes kids who end up becoming gay adults... that desire and mentality sticks, so it kinda sucks that they get denied the opportunity.[/QUOTE] Exactly, you're saying to a whole bunch of people (some of which are steady churchgoers) "why would you want to be a part of something that hates you so much?" (which is an incredibly un-Christian message from the church by the way). The idea that Gays should just be like "yeah, screw Christianity, we don't even want to get married anymore" is absurd, because guess what, Christians aren't the only ones who get married...EVERYBODY grows up expecting to get married and you're just shoving Gays into the corner and saying "hey guys, you're not allowed to do this one thing that everyone else does, but you'll get over it." And anybody who acts like gay marriage infringes their religious rights can go fuck themselves with a tire iron. The same exact shit was used to try and block interracial marriage, but you don't see social conservatives talking about that anymore, do you?