Obama wants to bust your balls, and heads for renewing the assault weapons ban - Polidicks

[QUOTE=LunchboxOfDoom;37120226][url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Washington,_D.C.]Washington, D.C. has not have the distinction of having the highest homicide rate in the United States since the mid 1990s[/url].[/QUOTE] Alright, so now the real question is, which area does?

[QUOTE=LunchboxOfDoom;37120226][url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Washington,_D.C.]Washington, D.C. has not have the distinction of having the highest homicide rate in the United States since the mid 1990s[/url].[/QUOTE] If that's true then the FBI is lying to me. I looked through the FBI UCR and no other area comes close to DC's 21.9 homicides per 100,000 in 2010.

[QUOTE=Bobie;37120086]this is very true to an extent. while drugs are illegal, people still make millions off of them and are in constant circulation in most first world and third world countries alike. the same principle can be applied for guns; it's about creating a society where it's people are happy enough and have a high enough standard of living to not have to resort to any gun violence whatsoever.[/QUOTE] There is a difference between guns and drugs though, drug cartels and dealers can grow their own weed and cook their own meth but it is harder to manufacture your own guns, most illegal guns are manufactured legally and then shipped to dealers legally but then sold illegally either by asshole gun dealers who "lose" a shipment or by criminals who use someone without a record to buy the guns for them.

[QUOTE=squids_eye;37120281]There is a difference between guns and drugs though, drug cartels and dealers can grow their own weed and cook their own meth but it is harder to manufacture your own guns, most illegal guns are manufactured legally and then shipped to dealers legally but then sold illegally either by asshole gun dealers who "lose" a shipment or by criminals who use someone without a record to buy the guns for them.[/QUOTE] There are people who build them from scratch. In fact, there are very good examples where people have built a working handgun from pipes, and used them to try an escape from jail. Page-king, have a cookie.

[QUOTE=Kartoffel;37120240]Alright, so now the real question is, which area does?[/QUOTE] [url=http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2012/06/flint_police_department_staffi.html]Flint, Michigan[/url]. My local area of St. Louis is doing pretty good. I think we're third, or we may have even surpassed Detroit for second.

[QUOTE=squids_eye;37120281]There is a difference between guns and drugs though, drug cartels and dealers can grow their own weed and cook their own meth but it is harder to manufacture your own guns, most illegal guns are manufactured legally and then shipped to dealers legally but then sold illegally either by asshole gun dealers who "lose" a shipment or by criminals who use someone without a record to buy the guns for them.[/QUOTE] the same principle of illegality surrounds it. the idea is that laws can still be broken even if they are enforced to the fullest extent; education and life standards should always come before enforcing on your population. people don't fire guns off and kill people because of their own 'selfishness' or 'greed' - they do it because they are forced to by the environment. hardly any gun crimes are committed by rich people- why do you think that is?

[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;37120005]I am not trying to utilize your emotions, I am trying to make a point. he had weapons, I dunno if they were legal or not, but that's besides the point I am making. Guns didn't stop him. That's the point I am making here. I bet at least 10 people in that theatre were armed (i have no actual numbers, but it would seem plausible) and yet, I cant recall him being shot back at[/QUOTE] You're kidding, right? "Ten people in the theater where the shooting occurred had guns and did [I]nothing[/I] to stop the shooter! No I don't have any evidence whatsoever to support that, but probably! Suck on that gun owners!"

[QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;37120005]I am not trying to utilize your emotions, I am trying to make a point. he had weapons, I dunno if they were legal or not, but that's besides the point I am making. Guns didn't stop him. That's the point I am making here. I bet at least 10 people in that theatre were armed (i have no actual numbers, but it would seem plausible) and yet, I cant recall him being shot back at[/QUOTE] I didn't see any report of people having guns there.

[QUOTE=Kartoffel;37120301]There are people who build them from scratch. In fact, there are very good examples where people have built a working handgun from pipes, and used them to try an escape from jail. Page-king, have a cookie.[/QUOTE] Compared to how many illegal guns are made legally, home made firearms being used for crime is basically a none issue.

[QUOTE=LunchboxOfDoom;37120312][url=http://www.mlive.com/news/flint/index.ssf/2012/06/flint_police_department_staffi.html]Flint, Michigan[/url]. My local area of St. Louis is doing pretty good. I think we're third, or we may have even surpassed Detroit for second.[/QUOTE] Ah well I was looking at homicides rate per state as opposed to city. [QUOTE=Fatfatfatty;37120005]I am not trying to utilize your emotions, I am trying to make a point. he had weapons, I dunno if they were legal or not, but that's besides the point I am making. Guns didn't stop him. That's the point I am making here. I bet at least 10 people in that theatre were armed (i have no actual numbers, but it would seem plausible) and yet, I cant recall him being shot back at[/QUOTE] From what I've seen reported, the theater was a gun-free zone. There's a very good chance that not a single person in the theater was armed. Your figure of 10 is absolutely implausible even taking into account the fact that Colorado issues concealed carry permits.

[QUOTE=squids_eye;37120441]Compared to how many illegal guns are made legally, home made firearms being used for crime is basically a none issue.[/QUOTE] Yes, but the point is, if someone really wanted a gun, they could just illegally make one from pipes and various bits here and there.

[QUOTE=Bobie;37120314]the same principle of illegality surrounds it. the idea is that laws can still be broken even if they are enforced to the fullest extent; education and life standards should always come before enforcing on your population. people don't fire guns off and kill people because of their own 'selfishness' or 'greed' - they do it because they are forced to by the environment. hardly any gun crimes are committed by rich people- why do you think that is?[/QUOTE] You are right but I still don't think drugs are a good comparison. A hell of a lot of rich people use illegal drugs, probably not a majority and no where near as many as worse off people but it is still fairly common.

[QUOTE=squids_eye;37120457]You are right but I still don't think drugs are a good comparison. A hell of a lot of rich people use illegal drugs, probably not a majority and no where near as many as worse off people but it is still fairly common.[/QUOTE] i wasn't necessarily referring to marijuana, more the harder stuff like crack and heroin. but it's irrelevant now you know my point

[QUOTE=Kartoffel;37120451]Yes, but the point is, if someone really wanted a gun, they could just illegally make one from pipes and various bits here and there.[/QUOTE] Do you have any idea what it takes to make a gun? It took the master blacksmiths of Europe centuries to reduce a crude metal barrel down into a modern rifle that won't kill the user when fired. You need to be a trained specialist to make a gun that will actually fire.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;37120499]Do you have any idea what it takes to make a gun? It took the master blacksmiths of Europe centuries to reduce a crude metal barrel down into a modern rifle that won't kill the user when fired. You need to be a trained specialist to make a gun that will actually fire.[/QUOTE] Or you could just be a Chechen.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;37120499]Do you have any idea what it takes to make a gun? It took the master blacksmiths of Europe centuries to reduce a crude metal barrel down into a modern rifle that won't kill the user when fired. You need to be a trained specialist to make a gun that will actually fire.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/oct2009/barl-shotgun.html[/url] Relatively simple contraptions. All you need is to be able to propel a projectile at lethal velocity.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;37120499]Do you have any idea what it takes to make a gun? It took the master blacksmiths of Europe centuries to reduce a crude metal barrel down into a modern rifle that won't kill the user when fired. You need to be a trained specialist to make a gun that will actually fire.[/QUOTE] [img]http://englishrussia.com/images/chechen_weapons/7.jpg[/img] The Chechen rebels beg to differ

[QUOTE=Kartoffel;37120540][url]http://www.martinfrost.ws/htmlfiles/oct2009/barl-shotgun.html[/url] Relatively simple contraptions. All you need is to be able to propel a projectile at lethal velocity.[/QUOTE] And you are assuming every single inmate knows how to build one, has access to the materials, and most importantly, will be able to fire it without killing themselves in the process? Making a gun is VERY difficult. If the barrel is too thin, it will burst. If the barrel is not rifled, then the gun will be horrifically inaccurate. If the bullet doesn't even fit correctly, then the gun is useless. [QUOTE=Zillamaster55;37120541][img]http://englishrussia.com/images/chechen_weapons/7.jpg[/img] The Chechen rebels beg to differ[/QUOTE] The difference is that they ARE trained specialists who spent a good deal of time making and perfecting their art. Plus their access to weapons parts is easier.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;37120579]If the barrel is too thin, it will burst. If the barrel is not rifled, then the gun will be horrifically inaccurate. If the bullet doesn't even fit correctly, then the gun is useless.[/QUOTE] I know this, and you know this, but it won't stop someone from trying, I guarantee you. The point I was trying to make is that guns can be successfully made from rather simple components, from scratch, by inmates.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;37120579]If the bullet doesn't even fit correctly, then the gun is useless.[/QUOTE] [img]http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRsfJPFPpWcSVZ651WUEs7Ej-FF2PVYDYG-VDNxdQmVZExkmZzNguIDGkO7[/img] This is another Chechen gun, modified to take a completely different caliber. There are a ton of these.

What's the obsession with banning the AR-15? It is the firearm symbol of 'Murrika, an national icon. It is a .22 for crying out loud. Those who say only a few guns were designed for sport, the others were only designed for inflicting as much damage as possible make me sick. All ammunition these days are designed to give a clean kill with maybe a little tumbling to make it more effective. The AR-15 is can be used as a hunting rifle, practically any military firearm and civilian firearm over the caliber of .22 works great for hunting, with the exception of the .50 BMG, a cartridge designed for use on vehicles, not human flesh.

The most hilariously hypocritical thing about this, is that in both shootings, they didn't use an assault rifle.

[QUOTE=cpt.armadillo;37120591]What's the obsession with banning the AR-15? It is the firearm symbol of 'Murrika, an national icon. It is a .22 for crying out loud. Those who say only a few guns were designed for sport, the others were only designed for inflicting as much damage as possible make me sick. All ammunition these days are designed to give a clean kill with maybe a little tumbling to make it more effective. The AR-15 is can be used as a hunting rifle, practically any military firearm and civilian firearm over the caliber of .22 works great for hunting, with the exception of the .50 BMG, a cartridge designed for use on vehicles, not human flesh.[/QUOTE] No no no, a .50 BMG [i]will[/i] work on a deer. It'll just work too well.

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;37120590][img]http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRsfJPFPpWcSVZ651WUEs7Ej-FF2PVYDYG-VDNxdQmVZExkmZzNguIDGkO7[/img] This is another Chechen gun, modified to take a completely different caliber. There are a ton of these.[/QUOTE] Yes, but can it take bullets bigger or smaller than the calibre is?

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;37120599]The most hilariously hypocritical thing about this, is that in both shootings, they didn't use an assault rifle.[/QUOTE] Actually, I remember hearing that the guy at the Aurora shooting had an AR-15.

[QUOTE=Kartoffel;37120601]No no no, a .50 BMG [i]will[/i] work on a deer. It'll just work too well.[/QUOTE] .408 CheyTac would probably get the job done better, of course, with a hefty price-tag to boot.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;37120603]Yes, but can it take bullets bigger or smaller than the calibre is?[/QUOTE] ...Once...

[QUOTE=cpt.armadillo;37120591]What's the obsession with banning the AR-15? It is the firearm symbol of 'Murrika, an national icon. It is a .22 for crying out loud. Those who say only a few guns were designed for sport, the others were only designed for inflicting as much damage as possible make me sick. All ammunition these days are designed to give a clean kill with maybe a little tumbling to make it more effective. The AR-15 is can be used as a hunting rifle, practically any military firearm and civilian firearm over the caliber of .22 works great for hunting, with the exception of the .50 BMG, a cartridge designed for use on vehicles, not human flesh.[/QUOTE] The straight up answer is that assault rifles look scary. In reality, weapons that classify as assault weapons are very rarely used in crimes. Banning assault weapons really just targets law-abiding legal gun-owners and does very little to reduce crime.

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;37120609].408 CheyTac would probably get the job done better, of course, with a hefty price-tag to boot.[/QUOTE] Quite possibly.

Banning guns just makes criminals laugh, alot of the gangmembers already can't get guns legally but they still seem to find new guns after the police take them away. Also life is probably scarier for a criminal knowing the house you're about to rob MIGHT have a gun, or, hell they may have a couple. Store owners sometimes keep one behind their desk aswell.