• Naked young man on acid murdered by police officer, officer cleared of wrongdoing.
    143 replies, posted
And he didn't have a tazer. He had pepper spray and a baton, and maybe not even on him at the time of the shooting. And you are all aware that the protocol for using tazers (In the US, it should be stated) involve two people, right? One on overwatch with a gun, just in case.
[QUOTE=Snowmew;39854459]There have been a few rare cases where tasers hit, discharge properly, and people can still keep moving around (albeit slowly and more limited). Usually not exclusively the result of drug use, but it has happened before, much like how dumping a handful of hollow points into a guy might not stop him either. As much as I like tasers, they are surprisingly simple devices ("let's just shoot a few thousand volts through these probes and see what happens") and it's possible to override them internally, but it's still more likely to miss or malfunction anyway.[/QUOTE] I know there have been cases where only one of the barbs penetrates/discharges and that caused something like you described. Don't know anything else like that.
Wow talk about a Fair and Balanced™ headline
[QUOTE=scout1;39854493]I know there have been cases where only one of the barbs penetrates/discharges and that caused something like you described. Don't know anything else like that.[/QUOTE] Not everyone reacts the same to a taser, I don't know why people here think they're 100% effective at bringing down someone.
[QUOTE=scout1;39854493]I know there have been cases where only one of the barbs penetrates/discharges and that caused something like you described. Don't know anything else like that.[/QUOTE] To my knowledge, if only one of the barbs hit, the only thing that stops you is the sting of that little needle in your chest.
this does seem crazy but what about, if you really want to trip alone, locking yourself in something that [I]only [/I]sober you can (easily) get out of? I would NOT fucking do that however.
[QUOTE=Valdor;39854505]Not everyone reacts the same to a taser, I don't know why people here think they're 100% effective at bringing down someone.[/QUOTE] Because we all carry the same nervous system. It ain't like having a burrito to eat where some people get diarrhea and others don't. This is how the human body works.
[QUOTE=Craigewan;39853596]You're right, it was avoidable. The kid could have not taken a designer drug with strong hallucinogenic effects without a bunch of people there to make sure he didn't do something dumb. It's been covered over and over that the cop did nothing wrong, in as much as defending yourself from a drugged out, naked man charging you is "nothing wrong"[/QUOTE] Or the cop could have done anything other than murder him
[QUOTE=scout1;39854531]Because we all carry the same nervous system. It ain't like having a burrito to eat where some people get diarrhea and others don't. This is how the human body works.[/QUOTE] You can go look at the police training videos where they get tased, they don't all react the exact same. Yeah most of the buckle up and yell out but not all of them. Hell in most of the videos there's usually one or two guys that's able to keep standing (or rather they don't slump over at the end)
[QUOTE=scout1;39854531]Because we all carry the same nervous system. It ain't like having a burrito to eat where some people get diarrhea and others don't. This is how the human body works.[/QUOTE] but some people legitamately can keep going after being hit with a taser, ive seen quite a few videos of it happening on cop shows
[QUOTE=Snowmew;39851742]Never confront an unidentified threat with a less-lethal weapon unless you have someone providing you with lethal backup. Police weapons training 101.[/QUOTE] Late as fuck but, just pointing this out: Every country that has police/security not carrying firearms seems to do pretty well. Sure, there's the occasional fuck up, but we don't see anywhere as many incidents like this, or police knocking on a guys door in the middle of the night and shooting him when eh answers holding a gun. A naked guy going batshit doesn't warrant shooting the guy. A guy with a knife, a gun, a weapon etc? Sure. A naked guy not in your face? Not so much. I guess it just comes down to America.
[QUOTE=DeeCeeTeeBee;39854684]Late as fuck but, just pointing this out: Every country that has police/security not carrying firearms seems to do pretty well. Sure, there's the occasional fuck up, but we don't see anywhere as many incidents like this, or police knocking on a guys door in the middle of the night and shooting him when eh answers holding a gun. A naked guy going batshit doesn't warrant shooting the guy. A guy with a knife, a gun, a weapon etc? Sure. A naked guy not in your face? Not so much. I guess it just comes down to America.[/QUOTE] The rampant gun proliferation kind of makes firearms for officers a necessity which makes guns to protect from the officers a necessity which makes...
....America a shitty country?
[QUOTE=Ericson666;39854031]Why would he shoot for the leg? There's a good chance he would miss, and it might not even put him down[/QUOTE] You try lunging at someone at full speed without any trouble after being gelded in the leg. And as I stated earlier, it is true the gun might miss which makes it that much less useful.
Yeah this is definite brutality. No reason he should have been shot at all
[QUOTE=Trogdon;39854930]Yeah this is definite brutality. No reason he should have been shot at all[/QUOTE] Thank you, your honor, for your relevant and well-informed opinion.
[QUOTE=Nitro836;39854919]You try lunging at someone at full speed without any trouble after being gelded in the leg. And as I stated earlier, it is true the gun might miss which makes it that much less useful.[/QUOTE] And if he hit a artery the dude could just straight up bleed out.
Facepunch: "Pepper spray and tazers didn't on this one guy before so it won't ever work on anyone else, so immediately shoot him/her instead"
[QUOTE=Mr. Someguy;39852056]Pepper Spray and Tasers don't guarantee a take-down, depending on the person. Pepper spray is strong, but some people can just shrug it off and attack, especially when enraged. A Taser is more likely to bring them down, but it only has one shot and there are several ways it can fail. Again, some people may shrug off a Taser. A modern Pistol has 10+ shots, and reletively high stopping power. Yeah, some people can still shrug off a shot, or two, but what about 3 or 4 or 5? A Pistol used properly will guarantee your safety against 99.9+% of the people you come up against. There are only a small handfull of incidents where people have struggled with police [I]after[/I] being shot. I can only think of one off-hand, and it was an enraged [I]wrestler[/I].[/QUOTE] Ok, it doesn't guarantee a takedown but that doesn't justify killing the person sigh
These articles are filled with so much bias and sensationalism it is hilarious. The best part is everyone here is eating it up. Gonna quote the segments of the article and respond. [quote] A University of South Alabama campus police officer who fatally shot a naked student was carrying pepper spray and a baton at the time, the school said Friday. [/quote] So? Every police officer carries that equipment. Every officer involved in a shooting has had that equipment. Your point? Besides trying to say "he should have used another option" [quote]University spokesman Keith Ayers said Officer Trevis Austin, a four-year employee in his first police job, was armed with all three weapons when he walked outside the police station with his gun drawn to confront Gil Collar. The 18-year-old college freshman was naked when he banged on police department windows in the pre-dawn hours last Saturday.[/quote] Now you're trying to make him look incompetent? He been on the job 4 years, that is enough experience to be a decent cop. And of course it is going to be his first cop job, most people join the department that co-relates to the community they grew up in or lived in the longest. Most 20 year cops belonged to only one department so you can get technical and say they've only had one cop job. [quote]It's unclear why Austin went for his gun first, but the sheriff has said the decision was proper.[/quote] Umm, gee you think? You don't go in to a unknown situation with just less-lethal weapons. Its like trying to clear a house with fucking pepper spray. Get real people, if he had a partner with him maybe he could have provided cover while the partner switched over to taser to give that ago. But no, it was only him. [quote]Authorities said Collar, a 5-foot-7, 140-pound high school wrestler in his first semester of college, was on LSD when he moved aggressively toward the officer in an athletic stance, prompting the shooting. But surveillance video shows the student never tried to grab the officer's weapon or got within 4 or 5 feet of Austin.[/quote] Well, he was high. The officer isn't a medical expert he does not know the dosage, he does not know what he is on. All he knows is something is acting erratically and just went in to a aggressive/combative posture. The kids weight has nothing to do with situation, just because someone is 140 pounds does not mean they're a non-threat. When fight or flight kicks in, specially with drugs in someones system they can be really difficult to control. Try restraining someone who is high, combative and just overall a complete mess. It isn't fucking easy, last time I did it it took 6 people...six people for one high-ass dude. [quote]An attorney for Collar's family, former Alabama Lt. Gov. Jere Beasley, said the university's policy "totally gives support to our position" that the shooting wasn't justified. "There is no question the required force here was much less than shooting somebody," he said. "He could not say his life was in jeopardy or he was in fear of bodily harm."[/quote] Of course it is hard to lose a loved one, specially over something really stupid. But you can't fault anyone but their own child. You also can't say his life was not in jeopardy, you're not that person. There are a lot of other variables and factors. I bet if the situations was flipped, the family being encountered by a person who was high they would be fearing for their lives. [quote]Authorities haven't said why Austin drew his gun first rather than opting for a less-lethal weapon. Collar managed to get up even after being shot once in the chest, and backup officers arrived seconds after the shooting.[/quote] What? You just suggested in the article earlier he was a 140 pound light weight kid who couldn't have had hurt anyone, but yet after being hit in the chest he managed to get up and continue functioning for a brief period of time..That pretty well just shows he had the ability and strength to really hurt someone. [quote]Beasley said there was nothing to justify the shooting on the surveillance video, which was shown to both the media and representatives of Beasley's law firm but has not been released publicly.[/quote] Video is great for evidence and can really help paint a picture, but is very easy to misconstrue what happens or even make rash assumptions. Just because something looks like that, does not necessarily mean that is what happened. I've worked with evidence such as video without audio before and you can very easily mix up the facts without a proper understanding of the events. Youtube is a great example of what I'm saying too, someone records an entire event with a use of force. The use of force is legitimate and nothing was done wrong on the officers part, a person can cut that footage to just make it look like the suspect did nothing wrong and he was being beaten by cops. Well everyone jumps on that video and is asking for the cops head on a silver platter. Then the person decides to release the whole video and people realize that it was legitimate after seeing the whole picture. [quote]The university police department has 33 sworn officers, Ayers said. Members are required to meet the same type of minimum training standards as officers in a typical municipal or county department, but the school hasn't released details on Austin's training.[/quote]Again trying to go after him and his training to make it seem as if he was incompetent. What happened was sad, really was. No officer or person goes on duty wanting to shoot or kill someone. Most people would consider that a really, really, really bad day/week/month/year. The point is, you can't just blame one person. The person that died - made the choice to get high. Unfortunately he wasn't in a safe environment when he did it and got himself in bad situation, which was only made worse when he became aggressive.
it's these kinds of threads that make me detest the general populace of this section. It's either a bunch of "POLICE ARE NOTHING BUT MURDERERS!!!!" or "MAN IF I WAS THERE I WOULD OF DONE X, X, AND Y I WOULD OF DONE X TIMES BETTER!!!!". Point is, no they aren't and no you wouldn't.
[QUOTE=Starpluck;39854309]Only if you take a large dose. What a lot of these articles neglect is that all these are the result of massive, unusual doze-sizes so instead it paints the impression that these are potential side-effects (disassociation-frenzy) .[/QUOTE] If you take a large dose of a psychedelic drug, you are more likely going to be in fear of other people than wanting to approach them, especially a police officer. There is no way in hell a psychedelic drug is going to make you want to hurt other people, or eat people's faces. It's bullshit. The cop was just as misinformed about recreational drug use as any other kid, but there is zero need to kill the fucking kid.
The amount of negative turns someone's trip needs to take to end up in this sort of situation is mindboggling. The kid really needed someone there with him. Also he took way too much. I've dosed around 1000ug 15-20 times. I can tell ya this kid took at least 4 times that. These RC's are extremely available with very little information known about them. This wouldn't be happening if LSD was legal.
[QUOTE=pvt.jenkins;39854982]And if he hit a artery the dude could just straight up bleed out.[/QUOTE] Also one of the general rules of firearms is you never point at what you don't intend to kill.
[QUOTE=JayFeather1337;39856004]Also one of the general rules of firearms is you never point at what you don't intend to kill.[/QUOTE] So you think they have no purpose in subduing someone but you'd rather just kill them?
[QUOTE=leet;39856015]So you think they have no purpose in subduing someone but you'd rather just kill them?[/QUOTE] guns should only be used in lethal situations, If a person doesn't feel that their life is in danger then he/she wouldn't use a gun that's why people usually don't shoot to warn / maim / slow down / whatever
[QUOTE=scout1;39854776]The rampant gun proliferation kind of makes firearms for officers a necessity which makes guns to protect from the officers a necessity which makes...[/QUOTE] Even with a ban on all firearms, American police would still have to be armed. I point it out again and again, but we do not have a sufficient population density to support specialized police units. The iconic Crown Victoria police interceptor exists because American police had particular needs for a vehicle that could do almost everything. It had to be capable of vehicle interception, high risk warrant service, long periods of idling, and the ability to haul prisoners and significant amounts of equipment. It, like American law enforcement, needed to be flexible. Most of the country is sparsely covered by a few sheriff's deputies. Two guys with blunt objects and suddenly that police officer is in mortal danger with few options for defending themselves and backup is many miles away.
[QUOTE=scout1;39854531]Because we all carry the same nervous system. It ain't like having a burrito to eat where some people get diarrhea and others don't. This is how the human body works.[/QUOTE] Tasers can affect different people in different ways, many police officers actually develop a resistance or even immunity to it because being tased is sometimes a part of police training, and I'm not sure if anyone else recalls there was a recent incident where an officer attempted to tase, I believe it was an unstable and violent student, and she shrugged it off, saying it "tickled". People need to stop treating tasers like some all purpose nonlethal wonderweapon, the fact is they're short range, inaccurate, and unreliable.
[QUOTE=asteroidrules;39857575]Tasers can affect different people in different ways, many police officers actually develop a resistance or even immunity to it because being tased is sometimes a part of police training, and I'm not sure if anyone else recalls there was a recent incident where an officer attempted to tase, I believe it was an unstable and violent student, and she shrugged it off, saying it "tickled". People need to stop treating tasers like some all purpose nonlethal wonderweapon, the fact is they're short range, inaccurate, and unreliable.[/QUOTE] Yeah, IIRC there have been numerous occasions where people who get tasered are almost unaffected. Like this fine gentleman: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWAEfvleLtw[/media]
I wonder how much 25i he had on him... And why he was alone.
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