BREAKING NEWS: Large Scale Terrorist Attack in France -- Multiple Explosions, Gunfire! Death toll at - Polidicks

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;49113293]I'd like to apologize for miswording things that badly and try to make my initial point a bit clearer: As of yet it seems quite a lot more people are trying to blame Islam and Muslims in general for the attacks. It does seem likely that an Islamist group was responsible. The problem that has arisen is quite a lot of the people rushing to blame are using it as an excuse to make it out like Islam is some sort of global conspiracy against Europeans. To do this however they have to ignore almost a third of the people killed today because almost a third of the targets were Muslims in Middle Eastern nations. My intent was not to belittle the people killed in France, rather to point out that people are clearly belittling the people killed elsewhere because they're not as politically useful as the ones killed in France. Also as of yet the majority of outrage and conspiracy theories being built around this seem to be coming from non-French users, Mr. American.[/QUOTE] Taking Islam into consideration as one of many factors != blaming Muslims for the attacks

[QUOTE=Canuhearme?;49113255]Why are so many fighters coming from Denmark, Sweden and Belgium?[/QUOTE]Who knows? Sweden makes special effort to accommodate Muslim immigrants, a much larger effort than both Belgium and Denmark yet all three have comparable levels of fighters that join Daesh. Meanwhile Tunisia has largely kept it's political stability by silently allowing the radicalized elements within Tunisia to leave, and Jordan has [I]always[/I] been a hotbed of radical Islamic extremism. Meanwhile the United States has a lot of homegrown terrorists who try (and fail) to carry out domestic attacks, it's really impossible to say why these things work out the way they do aside from some vague speculation about cultural factors that ultimately have no factual basis.

Just make refugees disown their religion if they want to come into Europe.That way you can still help the people that are in need and stop the crazies that cause these acts of violence.

[QUOTE=DMGaina;49113314]But the majority refugees are fleeing from the ISIS aswell and we had a terror attack in Lebanon aswell today.[/QUOTE] Fuck, really? ISIS and refugees are truly fucked now. This is both 7/7 and 9/11 combined.

[QUOTE=0x0000000C;49113289]Europe should just stop fucking accepting refugees, send them to Lebanon or Egypt. This fucking shit is surreal.[/QUOTE] If you spent the egregious effort to look online for more than 15 seconds, you'd find that nations like Lebanon and Jordan are currently buckling under the stress of so many refugees, and Beirut was also just struck by an attack like this earlier today.

[QUOTE=Crazy Ivan;49113300]This graph is [B]such[/B] a skewed presentation of information that it's outright propoganda when it comes to arguing over why "certain countries are making so many fighters."[/QUOTE]That aside what about Belgium and Denmark who have comparable numbers? How about Sweden with a comparable amount of population? These are different societies that have different cultures, they approach "the problem" entirely in their own way which was the point of the graph and statement.

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;49113334]If you spent the egregious effort to look online for more than 15 seconds, you'd find that nations like Lebanon and Jordan are currently buckling under the stress of so many refugees, and Beirut was also just struck by an attack like this earlier today.[/QUOTE] This is on the main page anyways, how the fuck would I have known? Fuck refugees, let them stay in their warzone.

[QUOTE=dark soul;49113331]Just make refugees disown their religion if they want to come into Europe.That way you can still help the people that are in need and stop the crazies that cause these acts of violence.[/QUOTE] why yes, let's just put them in a faith removal machine that removes their religion from their brains, excellent idea

[QUOTE=dark soul;49113331]Just make refugees disown their religion if they want to come into Europe.That way you can still help the people that are in need and stop the crazies that cause these acts of violence.[/QUOTE] Nice sarcasm.

[QUOTE=0x0000000C;49113339] Fuck refugees, let them stay in their warzone.[/QUOTE] [B]Wow[/B]

the first thing my mom said when i said Paris was attacked, I didn't say anything else, she just blurts out, "FUCKING MUSLIMS ALL OF THEM NEED TO DIE, MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN IF NEED BE, JUST NUKE THE MIDDLE EAST" I have never been more disgusted with my mother in my entire life

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;49113137]Attacking innocent civilians is a horrible thing to do. I just find it noteworthy and sad that so many people are willing to overlook a large portion of the victims of today's attacks because they want to push their xenophobic agenda.[/QUOTE] Just as sad as you using tragedy to spring board your own agenda. How about you at least wait a day before throwing around your usual garbage? People just aren't in the mood.

[QUOTE=JumpinJackFlash;49113337]That aside what about Belgium and Denmark who have comparable numbers? How about Sweden with a comparable amount of population? These are different societies that have different cultures, they approach "the problem" entirely in their own way which was the point of the graph and statement.[/QUOTE] Belgium has almost twice the population of Denmark, at 11 million to 5.6. Since the graph doesn't present any 'hard' numbers, but vague infometrics, one would have to double the other to have 'comparable' outputs of fighters. In actuality, Belgium looks like it's got maybe 30% more per million persons. By the metrics this graph presents, there is no comparable nature. Furthermore, it's nearly impossible to determine what the "cause" of the the radical fighter's recruitment is from this graph, let alone from what we presently know. Do you know what efforts are being made to recruit? How deeply embedded the infrastructure of those recruitment are? Are people dissatisfied with their standard of living, or are they being lead to dissatisfaction by demagogues? France, weighing in at 66 million souls almost certainly outnumbers both Denmark and Belgium combined for [I]pure[/I] numbers of ISIS fighters produced. Trying to dodge around the ridiculous form of this information's presentation is irrational argument building. Particularly, since in context with the statement, "Why are so many fighters coming from Denmark, Sweden and Belgium?" The [I]point [/I] is that there [I]aren't[/I] so many fighters coming from those nations. We don't know why these people defect. It's almost certain though that alienating them, abusing them, and heaping collective guilt on them will only fuel conflict. Destructive, vengeful and short-sighted solutions will only foster further conflict. They may [I]feel[/I] good, but so does an overdose of morphine. [B] A little addition: [/B]If, say, a group of people left together, it would disastrously skew that graph as well. We know from easily observed social phenomena that people more willingly act as groups than as lone wolves. If, however, one nation was making more single agent actors than co-conspirators, that would say something interesting about what's producing the fighters. But no known information is saying that. Instead we just have lots of handwaving and gesticulating. Graphs like this just promote infographic thinking that creates easily falsified beliefs.

[QUOTE=WitheredGryphon;49113311]Then you're right back at square one, even if the refugees somehow amassed enough firepower to take on the IS: how do you kill an ideology without turning them into martyrs?[/QUOTE] There is only one solution, it's to wipe as more terrorist as possible from the face of the Earth. And help with rebuilding the Middle-East [B](and not just leaving it in ruined state as we always do)[/B]. We can rebuild and fix it, but only together. That may "kill an ideology". Waiting won't fix it. Only action will.

[QUOTE=0x0000000C;49113289]Europe should just stop fucking accepting refugees, send them to Lebanon or Egypt. This fucking shit is surreal.[/QUOTE] 1 in 4 people in Lebanon is a refugee, ask me how well Panama would be doing if they had to accept a 25% percent increase to their population.

[QUOTE=asteroidrules;49113293]I'd like to apologize for miswording things that badly and try to make my initial point a bit clearer: As of yet it seems quite a lot more people are trying to blame Islam and Muslims in general for the attacks. It does seem likely that an Islamist group was responsible. The problem that has arisen is quite a lot of the people rushing to blame are using it as an excuse to make it out like Islam is some sort of global conspiracy against Europeans. To do this however they have to ignore almost a third of the people killed today because almost a third of the targets were Muslims in Middle Eastern nations. My intent was not to belittle the people killed in France, rather to point out that people are clearly belittling the people killed elsewhere because they're not as politically useful as the ones killed in France. Also as of yet the majority of outrage and conspiracy theories being built around this seem to be coming from non-French users, Mr. American.[/QUOTE]Don't pull that crap, it won't convince anyone. You just wanted to shitpost and feel good about it. Go ahead, jerk off your ego to a tragedy because you think it will let you lord some superiority over others.

[QUOTE=Warriorx4;49113164]But how man? The U.S. has enough of its own problems to deal with.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Warriorx4;49113213]Not to mention how would you go about actually implementing such a plan. It's a nice sentiment what gman said, but the actual steps to do so have yet to be decided, and as Scorpio said, who is to say they will ever be decided?[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Duck M.;49113221]This is absolutely the correct way of thinking and I appreciate the positivty and constructive thinking. The only thing that sucks I'd that this is a very very long term solution, especially with our current political climate. Much less in the information age of the 21st century, but like I said earlier, I can almost guarantee we will still see terrorist attacks on this scale for decades still.[/QUOTE] Dammit, I had a really long post typed up, laying out an actual plan for fixing the Middle East, but Firefox spontaneously decided to restart for an update and I lost it. I might write it up and make a separate thread for it in the morning. This thread is moving rather too quickly to have any meaningful discussion.

[QUOTE=DMGaina;49113314]But the majority refugees are fleeing from the ISIS aswell and we had a terror attack in Lebanon aswell today.[/QUOTE] Here's the problem though. It's like trying to control an outbreak of a virus that you can't easily test for (you have to look at behavior and actions). Every sane person wants to get away from the infected area of the world, but in letting them in you also allow those carrying the virus (or, in this case, the extremists/terrorists) through as well because, on the surface, you can't distinguish between the two. Further, because a not significant portion of the people are sympathetic to those with the virus, they may be less likely to report those they suspect have the virus, or even assist them. These countries need to decide is it better to help those people in need and end up with more infected people as a result (and those who would help those infected), or shut out (and expel the refugees already in) those in need to protect their country (and the EU as a whole given the open borders) from the virus.

god FUCKING damnit terrorists ruin everything

[QUOTE=Flicky;49110732]Someone [url=https://vine.co/v/iBb2x00UVlv]posted a recording[/url] of the France-Germany game on Vine, where you can very clearly hear an explosion and crowd reaction. EDIT: [url=http://bigstory.ap.org/article/8319c7634b884a578cddb98ee08c13f0/french-police-report-shootout-and-explosion-paris]AP now reporting 26 dead,[/url] 11 killed in a restaurant and 15 at the Bataclan.[/QUOTE] So they played for a whole 2 game points before they decided to do anything about it?

[QUOTE=0x0000000C;49113339]This is on the main page anyways, how the fuck would I have known?[/QUOTE] Also, a thread about Beirut is also on the main page

[QUOTE=0x0000000C;49113289]Europe should just stop fucking accepting refugees[/quote] What do refugees have to do with this? Unless you have some information that the people who did this were refugees (as in, people running from ISIS) and not ISIS, which the rest of us have not. [quote]send them to Lebanon or Egypt.[/QUOTE] Piling up small (or big) countries with millions of refugees without sharing the burden is not sustainable, and it's part of the reason Turkey hasn't been regulating the migrant inflow properly. Also why first entry countries are overwhelmed and just let them pass through to the next country. Humanitarianism doesn't even have to enter the equation, this kind of crap are just populistic, supposedly easy solutions.

[QUOTE=0x0000000C;49113339]This is on the main page anyways, how the fuck would I have known? Fuck refugees, let them stay in their warzone.[/QUOTE] It seems like you completely ignored what I wrote, even tough you quoted it. [url]http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3123031/ISIS-intercepts-thousands-Syrian-refugees-fleeing-Turkish-border.html[/url] The refugees tried to get as far away as possible from the ISIS. They do not want to be involved in all this. Refugees have nothing to do with what happened. The problem is that Europe accepts absolutely everyone with open arms and this includes possible ISIS sleepers cells and troublemaker between people who really need help... they use the situation to seek for recruits and deploy in europe.

Just curious has it been confirmed the terrorists were actually ISIS?

[QUOTE=DMGaina;49113414] The problem is that Europe accepts absolutely everyone with open arms and this includes possible ISIS sleepers cells and troublemaker between people who really need help... they use the situation to seek for recruits and deploy in europe.[/QUOTE] When 65% of the 'refugees' are men... something has gone wrong. Unless of course 2/3 of their population are men.

[QUOTE=gman003-main;49113378]Dammit, I had a really long post typed up, laying out an actual plan for fixing the Middle East, but Firefox spontaneously decided to restart for an update and I lost it. I might write it up and make a separate thread for it in the morning. This thread is moving rather too quickly to have any meaningful discussion.[/QUOTE] Looking forward to it, always appreciate attempts at meaningful discussion where it's sparse.

[QUOTE=DMGaina;49113414]It seems like you completely ignored what I wrote, even tough you quoted it. The problem is that Europe accepts absolutely everyone with open arms and this includes possible ISIS sleepers cells and troublemaker between people who really need help... [/QUOTE] The Charlie Hebdo gunmen were French citizens, not asylum seekers. There's no reason to jump to the conclusion that the latest attack was from ISIS members infiltrating a group of refugees.

[img]http://i.imgur.com/hBMdovV.png[/img] Well now. How crude.

[QUOTE=Slim Charles;49113422]Just curious has it been confirmed the terrorists were actually ISIS?[/QUOTE] [img]http://img.pr0gramm.com/2015/11/14/fbb398277b4d3eaf.jpg[/img] The terrorists arrested by the police have claimed that they do belong to the Islamic State and ISIS has taken the responsibilty for the attacks in Paris and Lebanon. [url]http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/619363/Islamic-State-ISIS-Twitter-Paris-attacks[/url] [QUOTE=phaedon;49113437]The Charlie Hebdo gunmen were French citizens, not asylum seekers. There's no reason to jump to the conclusion that the latest attack was from ISIS members infiltrating a group of refugees.[/QUOTE] That's more or less what I tried to say. I said that that the attacks have nothing to do with refugees in general.

Google has made Hangouts-to-France phones calls free: [url]https://twitter.com/google/status/665370181745577984[/url]