Mass. Attorney General to Further Restrict Assault Weapon Sales in Response to Recent Shootings - Polidicks

[QUOTE=GordonZombie;50748647]Just wait until the next big shooting/murder where the weapon was illegally obtained. All you're doing is pissing people off.[/QUOTE] Between the time of your post and this one, it probably already has. The public (and therefore legislators) don't give a fuck if it's a million instances of gun homicide producing a single casualty, it's only when it's a single instance produces many casualties when "something has to be done" [editline]21st July 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Shirt.;50748325]when people say black market, they mean people building guns with scrap metal with machining equipment and then selling them.[/QUOTE] How full of shit do you have to be? Illegal imports and modifications, legally bought weapons that were stolen and/or had serial numbers filed, or simply firearms with no paper trail behind them end up on the black market. Nobody would buy a pipe gun when you can illicitly get the same thing, or something more effective than what you can legally purchase.

I've been looking into buying a WASR-10 for months now, local gunstore has had them listed at 549.99 for as long as I can remember. For some reason, now they're 999.99. Bummer.

This just in - Mass. AG closes loophole in speeding law whereby drivers drive the speed limit to evade enforcement. Drivers are now no longer allowed to buy new cars if any of the parts in them are compatible with cars which are designed to break the speed limit, but may continue drive ones they already have.

[QUOTE=Psychokitten;50746280]Want to kill 80+ people in the streets? Go rent a U-Haul.[/QUOTE] We need to put a ban on high capacity truck engines, nobody needs 400 horsepower in a semi anyway. [editline]21st July 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=GordonZombie;50748647]Just wait until the next big shooting/murder where the weapon was illegally obtained. All you're doing is pissing people off.[/QUOTE] Guarantee you they dont give a shit about the people anyway, they make these laws to circumvent the second amendment and ensure the authorities always have superior firepower available to them vs the citizens.

[quote]These are not weapons of self-defense. They are weapons used to commit mass murder. And they have no business being in civilian hands.[/quote] It blows my mind that I regularly hear this from government officials who simultaneously write exceptions into their proposed laws for police, because they can simultaneously believe that an AR-15 is suitable for police use and that it's a weapon of mass murder unsuitable for defense with no business being in civilian hands. What the hell?

[QUOTE=catbarf;50750578]It blows my mind that I regularly hear this from government officials who simultaneously write exceptions into their proposed laws for police, because they can simultaneously believe that an AR-15 is suitable for police use and that it's a weapon of mass murder unsuitable for defense with no business being in civilian hands. What the hell?[/QUOTE] The point of gun control is not to protect the public. Its simply to empower government. Because if government has a monopoly on violence then the citizens have little recourse. These people know that, but will still lie to the public.

[QUOTE=catbarf;50750578]It blows my mind that I regularly hear this from government officials who simultaneously write exceptions into their proposed laws for police, because they can simultaneously believe that an AR-15 is suitable for police use and that it's a weapon of mass murder unsuitable for defense with no business being in civilian hands. What the hell?[/QUOTE] Shit, they don't even use regular AR-15s most of them are military surplus M-16/M-4s

[QUOTE=Kigen;50750631]The point of gun control is not to protect the public. Its simply to empower government. Because if government has a monopoly on violence then the citizens have little recourse. These people know that, but will still lie to the public.[/QUOTE] no it isn't? saying gun control is to empower the government is a discredited conspiracy theory that largely finds support amongst cranks and other weirdoes. gun controls measures are wide-ranging and typically tend to be something that either politicians or pressure groups demand to see done for reasons just as varied. even soccer moms who support it for the shallowest and stupidest of reasons (wanting to see folding stocks banned or some shit) still aren't doing it for the purpose of empowering the government.

[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;50748376]fully automatic guns are pretty heavily regulated. unless you're a gun dealer with the proper licensing any full auto gun or transferable parts have to have been produced before 1986 and are rare enough they'll cost you over $10k at a minimum plus a $200 tax stamp. you can't just walk to your local gun shop and pick up a full auto.[/QUOTE] didn't say they werent, just said that i think thats how it should be

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;50751554]no it isn't? saying gun control is to empower the government is a discredited conspiracy theory that largely finds support amongst cranks and other weirdoes. gun controls measures are wide-ranging and typically tend to be something that either politicians or pressure groups demand to see done for reasons just as varied. even soccer moms who support it for the shallowest and stupidest of reasons (wanting to see folding stocks banned or some shit) still aren't doing it for the purpose of empowering the government.[/QUOTE] We're talking about government employees and politicians. They well know that gun control does not "fundamentally alter" the chances of shootings. They literally say those "weapons of war have no place on the streets" but want the police to have them. Which means they'll be on the street, but in the hands of people they control. There are plenty of idiots that will believe whatever the government or media tells them to believe. Gun control has no demonstrable effect on violence or suicide rates in any country.

[QUOTE=Kigen;50751882]We're talking about government employees and politicians. They well know that gun control does not "fundamentally alter" the chances of shootings. They literally say those "weapons of war have no place on the streets" but want the police to have them. Which means they'll be on the street, but in the hands of people they control. There are plenty of idiots that will believe whatever the government or media tells them to believe.[/QUOTE] which employees and politicians are you talking about? why do they hold this opinion? how do you know they know that gun control doesnt work? what do you mean they control them? who by? the police is handled differently at different levels of government, while the arms, methods, etc they utilize wary widely over the 50 prefectures of america. do they all want the police to have them? do they explain their reasons why? you can argue about whenever or not gun control works, but even if there was a clearcut academic and empirical consensus that gun control doesnt work (a consensus which does not exist), then it doesn't exclude the fact there are people who would support it on the basis of false information not because they want more control for the government, but because they genuinely believe that this false information supports their flawed and inane arguments that literally nobody else in the world treats seriously. if the US government really wanted to become tyrannical for whatever reason (i don't see why it would go to the bother of doing it), then to go to the bother of actually becoming evil it's usually a good idea to mooch off of other peoples work. it's a time honoured american tradition to get other people to do work you don't want to do before taking credit for it, since there's much easier and more effective ways of taking control (even getting the consent of people in the process) than to take everybodies guns. an orange goblin is attempting it right now and he doesn't even need to take peoples guns because the same demographics most opposed to gun control are the very ones supporting him. guns protecting freedom are worthless when the people holding them are willingly creating the conditions for a tyranny of their own design

Yes Sobotnik, politicians never lie, never misdirect the public, never want more control for themselves. Government is god. All hail government. They shall protect us, and save us. But if you stray from government then government shall condemn you, leave you to the mercy of those who wish to do you harm. It shall protect those who wish to do you harm. For government is merciful to those that depend on it. Look, Sobotnik. Government does not exist to promote the safety of citizens. The police have no duty to save you. Literally, a cop could watch you slowly being executed and still have a job the next day. Sure, there are people within the government that do try to do the best for citizens. But there are those who crave it for power. Which is why the United States of America was founded on the principle that NO ONE, absolutely no one, can be trusted with power. Its why there is an ton of checks and balances throughout the government. It is why the culture of the US is to distrust the government. A person who wants to become tyrannical over their fellow citizens does not need to do it illegally. What they will do is amass power and then direct government forces that would be so loyal to them to do their bidding. Its what is evident all over the globe. DPRK, Turkey is going down this road, and plenty of other examples throughout history that I don't need to list. Gun control does not work because it functions on the premise of control. The only people so inclined to be law-abiding are the only people it will effect. Criminals will care not what government says they can or cannot do. If someone tomorrow decided to get a U-Haul truck, and drive it into crowd, the government will do absolutely nothing. If someone decided to buy a lot of fertilizer, and make another ammonia-nitrate bomb to blow up a building, the government will not be able to stop them. The only laws that truly apply are those of nature. Governments can write pretty words on little documents. They can say that every human must abide by those words. But at the end of the day if you were not inclined to abide by those words, then the words have no effect on your behavior. Murder is already illegal. So do we make murder more illegal? A felon in possession of a gun is already illegal. So do we just make it more illegal? The premise you work on is that if you make a law, then people will abide by them. And while those who want to be good citizens will. Those who want to cause harm will not care. Because if they are going to commit murder, why the hell do you think a gun crime charge would enter into their thought process? [quote]"The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man." - Thomas Jefferson, Commonplace Book (quoting 18th century criminologist Cesare Beccaria), 1774-1776[/quote] [quote]"If the representatives of the people betray their constituents, there is then no resource left but in the exertion of that original right of self-defense which is paramount to all positive forms of government, and which against the usurpations of the national rulers, may be exerted with infinitely better prospect of success than against those of the rulers of an individual state. In a single state, if the persons intrusted with supreme power become usurpers, the different parcels, subdivisions, or districts of which it consists, having no distinct government in each, can take no regular measures for defense. The citizens must rush tumultuously to arms, without concert, without system, without resource; except in their courage and despair." - Alexander Hamilton, Federalist No. 28[/quote] Guns are tools, they provide options. Removing them removes options off the table. Which just makes us more susceptible to tyranny. Because then the tyrant wouldn't have to convince the people to follow along. The tyrant could just then order the police and military that are loyal to him to enforce his will. Its a whole lot harder to convince everyone in the country than it is to get the police and military to ram it down their throat.

[QUOTE=Kigen;50753027]Which is why the United States of America was founded on the principle that NO ONE, absolutely no one, can be trusted with power. [/QUOTE] Pretty much. Every government in history has abused their authority. The United States has done it to an extent in many cases. Albeit for a perceived "greater good", though perception of what is and is not good varies from culture to culture. As did the Soviet Union, and now we have Turkey fucking around.

[QUOTE=Kigen;50753027]Yes Sobotnik, politicians never lie, never misdirect the public, never want more control for themselves..... Its a whole lot harder to convince everyone in the country than it is to get the police and military to ram it down their throat.[/QUOTE] you didn't talk about any of the questions i made [quote]which employees and politicians are you talking about? why do they hold this opinion? how do you know they know that gun control doesnt work? what do you mean they control them? who by? the police is handled differently at different levels of government, while the arms, methods, etc they utilize wary widely over the 50 prefectures of america. do they all want the police to have them? do they explain their reasons why? [/quote] generally when people say things about other things they kinda have to back up their assertions. you didn't say anything about which people supported gun control on the basis that it gave them more power, along with the reasons as to why they actually thought that way instead of ascribing some kind of ulterior and malicious motives to millions of people who disagree with you (that people who support gun control want to remove your basic human rights and to dismantle everything the USA Stands for), perhaps its more likely they're just not very competent people or simply mistaken instead? if somebody disagrees with you on gun control it's generally for reasons more complex than that the entire movement is driven by a desire to systematically weaken the masses and make them susceptible to tyranny [editline]22nd July 2016[/editline] [quote]Gun control does not work because it functions on the premise of control.[/quote] presumably this also means pretty much every piece of legislation ever made also doesn't work? this implies regulating environmental emissions doesn't work because it functions on the premise of control (controlling companies and forcing them to adhere to regulations). [quote]Governments can write pretty words on little documents. They can say that every human must abide by those words. But at the end of the day if you were not inclined to abide by those words, then the words have no effect on your behavior.[/quote] so essentially you're an anarchist? if laws have no effect on behaviour and are just "pretty words" it would seem like thousands of years of the basic operating principles of human civilization should be called into question

[QUOTE=ZakkShock;50749295]I've been looking into buying a WASR-10 for months now, local gunstore has had them listed at 549.99 for as long as I can remember. For some reason, now they're 999.99. Bummer.[/QUOTE] Gun industry loves fear mongering, it boosts sales considerably. Same thing happens with ammo sales - there appears to be a perpetual dread of a shortage, which leads to prices shooting up and people buying all that juicy .22 as soon as it's in the store.

[QUOTE=Terminutter;50753827]Gun industry loves fear mongering, it boosts sales considerably. Same thing happens with ammo sales - there appears to be a perpetual dread of a shortage, which leads to prices shooting up and people buying all that juicy .22 as soon as it's in the store.[/QUOTE] It's no longer fear mongering when the stuff they say is going to happen happens. It's a simple case of supply and demand, and nobody sells guns better than the federal government.