Developing: reddit 0-day unfolding with CSS changes to /r/LeagueofLegends, /r/Android, /r/dota2, and
65 replies, posted
[QUOTE=snapshot32;44197942]I'm sure that you can block all those folks that disagree with you on some topics, and I'm not saying Facepunch lacks the occasional circle-jerk; but with reddit it grows to an absurd scale of uninformed opinion and rather stagnate, non-stimulating argument.[/QUOTE]
Sure, I'll agree with that. Especially in the defaults, because the system's not built to scale.
But, honestly, have you ever been to Sensationalist Headlines?
[QUOTE=woolio1;44197955]Sure, I'll agree with that. Especially in the defaults, because the system's not built to scale.
But, honestly, have you ever been to Sensationalist Headlines?[/QUOTE]
Yes I have; and let me tell you, even on facepunch, I've seen some p. stupid shit.
[QUOTE=Banned?;44197954]There is a difference between not going near the day care and not watching other news channels.
I think people have some pretty varying opinions on here, the obvious ones being guns, drugs and sex(uality). You've been here long enough so I'm sure you know some of the stink any of those three topics can cause here. It's not all fun and games.[/QUOTE]
That's true. We don't really have the ability to hide posts we disagree with, we just sort of shower them in cardboard. Although opinions trend toward homogeneity here too, if you've been in any of the threads on guns. Anyone who suggests any sort of regulation, for instance, is ridiculed for it.
[QUOTE=snapshot32;44197904]I personally despise reddit because it's a means for intellectual stagnation. If you hate certain topics or political opinions you have the ability to block subreddits and threads relating to them, and some subreddits expressly bar the opinions of the vocal minority; wherein essentially you either take part in the circlejerk or get banned.
How exactly a website in which you have no stimulation other than talking about only the things you like or the things you agree with, offering almost no clause for separate opinions most of the time could be viewed as anything other than despicable and a quagmire is beyond me. What I'm trying to say is on reddit, you don't have to be confronted with differing views, this can lead to a very close-minded and one-sided way of viewing things and that's hella bad.[/QUOTE]
That sounds like a very subreddit specific problem. So again it sounds like you don't despise reddit, you despise certain subreddits and you are clumping them together as "reddit".
Why would you hide posts that you disagree with.
That literally shelters you and makes you extremely naive. Imo it's healthy to see posts that you disagree with, it's a reminder that there's other people out there with differing opinions.
[QUOTE=Laferio;44197988]Why would you hide posts that you disagree with.
That literally shelters you and makes you extremely naive.[/QUOTE]
Yep. It's why Reddit's known for being a hivemind, even though there are plenty of conflicting opinions. You just can't really see them, because they're at the bottom of the comment section.
What's interesting about the voting system is that it wasn't made to be used against opinions. It was used to sort of separate quality comments from the crap that drifts to the bottom. However, since it's entirely anonymous, there's no system in place to prevent the groupthink from silencing any opposition. Considering Reddit's made up primarily of liberal college students 18-24, it's that sort of mentality that prevails through the voting system. Disagree with something? Send it to hell. Find something masturbatory, that aligns perfectly with your opinions? To the top it goes!
That's really only a problem in the larger subs, where too much content comes in to regulate effectively. After the self-hiding mechanism kicks in, the whole thing falls apart. Now you're not just sending something to the bottom of 20-30 comments, you're sending it into a subfolder of comments that nobody ever goes to. That's not an issue in the smaller subreddits, because there's never enough content to activate the system. You go to somewhere like /r/woodworking, or /r/diy, and people are having civil conversations. Then, you go to someplace like /r/worldnews, and you're faced with a steaming pile of horse crap. Scale really is the most important factor in subreddit quality.
[QUOTE=Laferio;44197988]Why would you hide posts that you disagree with.
That literally shelters you and makes you extremely naive. Imo it's healthy to see posts that you disagree with, it's a reminder that there's other people out there with differing opinions.[/QUOTE]
Because the average joe is afraid of being wrong.
[QUOTE=snapshot32;44197904][B]wherein essentially you either take part in the circlejerk or get banned. [/B]
[/QUOTE]
That's something that is very much present here too though :v:
I mean if you look at our rating system, a lot of the time people just look at the dominating ratings on a certain post or OP and then form an opinion based on that, furthering perpetuating that view.
The rating system is basically a circlejerk, people call out other people when they have differing ratings from the dominating ones, going as far as posting on peoples visitor pages or pm'ing them when you get rated something negative.
If theres a differing opinion and it's been covered in dumbs already, it's much easier for people to attack that post because they know it's already been deemed unacceptable to think that way by the majority, or the current bandwagon of ratings at least.
It's part of the reason why some people consider facepunch to be a hivemind a lot of the time.
[QUOTE=woolio1;44197702]They've gone over the password thing before, back when the Sony hacks happened.
If I recall correctly, [B]they use 256-bit AES encryption[/B], hashed and salted, with user data stored separately from the login servers. If anyone did get access to account data, I'm not sure any of it would be useful.[/QUOTE]
Why are they storing passwords with reversible encryption, that's a terrible idea.
(Less terrible if its hashed and stuff, but still pretty useless)
[QUOTE=woolio1;44197881]Depends entirely on the subreddit. I subscribe to a lot of smaller ones, like /r/mid_century, and you can actually carry on a decent conversation there because the posts aren't being spammed with lolmemes and that sort of crap.
So... I guess the best subreddits for discussion are those where the votes don't really apply, or matter.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I use reddit pretty much just for /r/3dprinting, and the only meme related thing to come through there since I joined is a contest that has $3,000 3d printer as the top prize for meme related 3d printables.
[QUOTE=Quark:;44197745]is there some specific reason why you seem to clump all of reddit together and refer to it as one of the dumber subreddits like adviceanimals or whatever
like seriously there's this huge anti-reddit stigma on facepunch and every time someone asks about it the only fallback is either "uh, MEMES!!" or "LE REDDIT!!"
sure there are some dumb, really dumb, and pointlessly dumb subreddits on reddit. but that's just the small minority.
i really don't understand this pointless bandwagon. it's like saying all of facepunch is exactly like the rust subforums or fast threads. care to explain?[/QUOTE]
Any site that encourages rulelessness in the name of "free speech" is going to be objectively worse than one that actually bothers to clean house now and then. There are tons of great subreddits but they're exceptions. At least on Facepunch the rules are the same everywhere - we don't have one forum with moderation next to one where people can freely post pictures of women being beaten or upskirts or child porn and get kudos from your peers for it
[QUOTE=Zeke129;44199480]Any site that encourages rulelessness in the name of "free speech" is going to be objectively worse than one that actually bothers to clean house now and then. There are tons of great subreddits but they're exceptions. At least on Facepunch the rules are the same everywhere - we don't have one forum with moderation next to one where people can freely post pictures of women being beaten or upskirts or child porn and get kudos from your peers for it[/QUOTE]
Freedom of Speech on the internet is fine in theory, but what happens is that sites that promote it tend to attract freaks like pedos and those that post images of "sexy" women that were taken without her consent because there's nobody clamping down on unacceptable shit like that.
[QUOTE=Quark:;44197745]is there some specific reason why you seem to clump all of reddit together and refer to it as one of the dumber subreddits like adviceanimals or whatever
like seriously there's this huge anti-reddit stigma on facepunch and every time someone asks about it the only fallback is either "uh, MEMES!!" or "LE REDDIT!!"
sure there are some dumb, really dumb, and pointlessly dumb subreddits on reddit. but that's just the small minority.
i really don't understand this pointless bandwagon. it's like saying all of facepunch is exactly like the rust subforums or fast threads. care to explain?[/QUOTE]
I'm pretty sure that was a jab at how the reddit admins go really over the top with the whole ~freedom of speech~ thing as an excuse for letting paedophile and other fucked up subreddits operate
[editline]11th March 2014[/editline]
oops zeke already replied :v:
[QUOTE=Profanwolf;44199453]That's something that is very much present here too though :v:
I mean if you look at our rating system, a lot of the time people just look at the dominating ratings on a certain post or OP and then form an opinion based on that, furthering perpetuating that view.
The rating system is basically a circlejerk, people call out other people when they have differing ratings from the dominating ones, going as far as posting on peoples visitor pages or pm'ing them when you get rated something negative.
If theres a differing opinion and it's been covered in dumbs already, it's much easier for people to attack that post because they know it's already been deemed unacceptable to think that way by the majority, or the current bandwagon of ratings at least.
It's part of the reason why some people consider facepunch to be a hivemind a lot of the time.[/QUOTE]
It's true, but at the same time at least the moderators don't ban you here for a differing opinion unless it's absolutely volatile.
ratings are ratings, they may have been important in 05-07 when they were stored on your profile, but now they're nothing
[QUOTE=Zeke129;44199480]Any site that encourages rulelessness in the name of "free speech" is going to be objectively worse than one that actually bothers to clean house now and then. There are tons of great subreddits but they're exceptions. At least on Facepunch the rules are the same everywhere - we don't have one forum with moderation next to one where people can freely post pictures of women being beaten or upskirts or child porn and get kudos from your peers for it[/QUOTE]
Both of those topics are to my knowledge banned site-wide.
[QUOTE=Profanwolf;44199453]That's something that is very much present here too though :v:
I mean if you look at our rating system, a lot of the time people just look at the dominating ratings on a certain post or OP and then form an opinion based on that, furthering perpetuating that view.
The rating system is basically a circlejerk, people call out other people when they have differing ratings from the dominating ones, going as far as posting on peoples visitor pages or pm'ing them when you get rated something negative.
[B]If theres a differing opinion and it's been covered in dumbs already, it's much easier for people to attack that post because they know it's already been deemed unacceptable to think that way by the majority, or the current bandwagon of ratings at least.
[/B]
It's part of the reason why some people consider facepunch to be a hivemind a lot of the time.[/QUOTE]
While you definitely have a point, particularly the bold part, Reddit is different in that the default setting and commonly accepted notion is upvotes bring you more publicity and downvotes means being silenced or ignored.
Imagine Sensationalist Headlines where genuinely good posts were at the bottom of page 8 because they received dumbs or even disagrees. It would be horrible.
[QUOTE=danharibo;44199762]Both of those topics are to my knowledge banned site-wide.[/QUOTE]
Only after there was backlash over the site admins defending the content.
And even then the "creepshots" just changed name, they're still allowed.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;44199777]While you definitely have a point, particularly the bold part, Reddit is different in that the default setting and commonly accepted notion is upvotes bring you more publicity and downvotes means being silenced or ignored.
Imagine Sensationalist Headlines where genuinely good posts were at the bottom of page 8 because they received dumbs or even disagrees. It would be horrible.[/QUOTE]
That's true, you wouldn't even see the posts to be able to agree/disagree with them :v:
I browse both reddit and facepunch often, the additional views/opinions on matters are nice.
But what do these CSS changes do out of curiosity? I'm subbed to r/dota2
[QUOTE=danharibo;44199762]Both of those topics are to my knowledge banned site-wide.[/QUOTE]
Only after their exposure to the world had occurred, setting the precedent that Reddit administration approves of "free speech" as long as it doesn't make their website look scummy.
I don't get the forum elitism; for as much as FPers in general seem to dislike Reddit, I see stupid shit and stupid people here too. Granted, I see a smaller sample of them here, but they're there nonetheless.
Hell, I don't get user elitism in general when it comes to users of one site or another. When people explain their prejudices, it seems like half the time they haven't even bothered spending any time exploring the place they're shitting on.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;44199879]Only after their exposure to the world had occurred, setting the precedent that Reddit administration approves of "free speech" as long as it doesn't make their website look scummy.[/QUOTE]
there's plenty of scummy shit on reddit. they approve on free speech as long as it's not fucking [I]illegal[/I]
[QUOTE=TheDecryptor;44199813]Only after there was backlash over the site admins defending the content.
And even then the "creepshots" just changed name, they're still allowed.[/QUOTE]
The creepshots changed name to like, candid fashion shots and the people who posted pretended that they were just commenting fashion even though every fucking post was a sneak photo of a girls ass in various tight clothing.
[QUOTE=G-Strogg;44200136]The creepshots changed name to like, candid fashion shots and the people who posted pretended that they were just commenting fashion even though every fucking post was a sneak photo of a girls ass in various tight clothing.[/QUOTE]
And they still dox those people inside those sections as well. Its fucking hilarious because if you dox Reddit users, they flip their shit but if you dox some woman after oogling at her ass, that's fine.
Reddit is a hive of stupidity, bigotry and hypocrites. Don't let anyone ever convince you otherwise.
[QUOTE=Swilly;44200684]And they still dox those people inside those sections as well. Its fucking hilarious because if you dox Reddit users, they flip their shit but if you dox some woman after oogling at her ass, that's fine.
Reddit is a hive of stupidity, bigotry and hypocrites. Don't let anyone ever convince you otherwise.[/QUOTE]
Emphasis on the stupidity. Not getting into the ethics, but doxing a lady which you founds shots online of and like is just plain stupid, as it basically amounts to killing the goose which lays golden eggs, because she'll stop uploading. (See the story of that Olympic organizer).
[QUOTE=Swilly;44200684]And they still dox those people inside those sections as well. Its fucking hilarious because if you dox Reddit users, they flip their shit but if you dox some woman after oogling at her ass, that's fine.
Reddit is a hive of stupidity, bigotry and hypocrites. Don't let anyone ever convince you otherwise.[/QUOTE]
Ur right. A forum about 4000 times bigger than fp, and all 10 million of their visitors are stupid kids right? Every single subreddit is the same and facepunch is better,
I see better quality posts in reddit almost always than here
This is why I like Facepunch, because the rules are global with individual rules to other forums to just accommodate for the reason the forum exist
There isn't like a difference you could say, it's just very laid out and pretty clear to what you can or can't do
[QUOTE=Swilly;44200684]And they still dox those people inside those sections as well. Its fucking hilarious because if you dox Reddit users, they flip their shit but if you dox some woman after oogling at her ass, that's fine.
Reddit is a hive of stupidity, bigotry and hypocrites. Don't let anyone ever convince you otherwise.[/QUOTE]
To be entirely fair, the /r/creepshots subreddit only consisted of some 4000 people, if the news reports are to be believed.
The community's much, much larger than that. Something in the millions.
So what happened?
Some subreddits just got defaced?
[QUOTE=Profanwolf;44199453]That's something that is very much present here too though :v:
[B]I mean if you look at our rating system, a lot of the time people just look at the dominating ratings on a certain post or OP and then form an opinion based on that, furthering perpetuating that view.[/B]
The rating system is basically a circlejerk, people call out other people when they have differing ratings from the dominating ones, going as far as posting on peoples visitor pages or pm'ing them when you get rated something negative.
If theres a differing opinion and it's been covered in dumbs already, it's much easier for people to attack that post because they know it's already been deemed unacceptable to think that way by the majority, or the current bandwagon of ratings at least.
It's part of the reason why some people consider facepunch to be a hivemind a lot of the time.[/QUOTE]
I take issue with the idea that people form an opinion based on the first thing a post is rated.
By and large, the first rating turns out to be the majority. That's totally true, and I won't argue with that. However, I think that's simply a reflection of the majority opinion on any given post.
If I make a post to the derision of gay marriage, I'll get a lot of dumbs. Why? Are people deciding that I'm dumb because they see that others think I'm dumb? No, they think I'm dumb because I said something that they think is dumb.
Chances are that the first person to see (and rate) a post has an opinion that lines up with the majority; that's simple maths. It ends up being the majority rating because it reflects the majority opinion.
Plus, there's a big difference between a circlejerk that takes different opinions and surrounds like with signs that say "THIS IS RETARDED LAUGH AT HIM" and a circlejerk that hides those same opinions and pretends they don't exist. Personally, I'll take the former.
Exposure to alternate opinions is really important, because it paves the way for the group's opinions to change. To use a self-centred example, the series of posts which earned me my title could easily be summed up with "Paedophiles aren't necessarily child abusers, and it isn't fair to assume so". At the time, that was a ridiculously unpopular opinion (after all, it got me my title). Now, however, it's pretty much the consensus in threads about paedophillia.
In a community like Reddit, the majority opinions would remain static, and no one would get anywhere.
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