• Atheists least charitable group in UK, Muslims and Jews among most charitable
    114 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Venezuelan;41853684]no one is doing that just atheists getting riled up over perceived (but in actuality non-existant) attacks[/QUOTE] yeah your arrogance and anyone elses in this thread that just wants to tell everyone here that "hey, atheists don't do as much charity, arguing with that is factually wrong" is only perceived and not part of your posting style here. I do work for a group called the Rotary Club. They do a lot of charity work. I'm an atheist. Wow, that's so difficult to wrap your head around. [QUOTE=Venezuelan;41853233]no I would not like to explain why everyone here is one. Because I [I]never fucking said that.[/I] and I've been doing that the entire time if you'd read but since I'm apparently responsible for recapping this every page for those who don't want to keep up: -study is posted! -the golden denounces study by attributing a reason to the figures. This [I]somehow [/I]completely invalidates the empirical data and therefore the study is deemed "horseshit". This coming from one who, I assume, is an atheist and should probably understand a little bit about empirical data. -pointing this out gets me called dumb. Such is life on Facepunch. -I attempt to address the claim that age has skewed the data, therefore making atheists as a whole poorer, by showing data that incomes of Atheists are above average in America. However I note it may be different in the UK, but for now, since American data was all I had, I figured it was a fair parallel. -the golden claims that my somewhat founded retort to his entirely unfounded claim doesn't count due the an assumption being made. this despite the fact that his entire argument is assumptions -I invite him to introduce competing data, since, after all, he's the one questioning a study and should be prepared to back it up, being a proponent of science and logic and all -he refuses -I get called dumb for doing the same thing to his unfounded claims as he did to the initial study that good enough for ya buddy boy[/QUOTE] you posted this and you're going to tell me everyone else is "riled up".
[QUOTE=Lachz0r;41853675]you bagging on a group for not charitizing as much as yours is just the same as bragging[/QUOTE] But, I am an atheist. You guys don't seem to be taking self-criticism too well.
i'm an atheist i don't give to charity because 1. all the charities in my town at least are religious ones and 2. i'm broke as fuck. and despite that i still don't have to really justify myself to anyone [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Lamar;41853712]But, I am an atheist. You guys don't seem to be taking self-criticism too well.[/QUOTE] yeah i just read that part, consider the 'you' more an open one rather than you yourself i guess
[QUOTE=Lamar;41853712]But, I am an atheist. You guys don't seem to be taking self-criticism too well.[/QUOTE] no, you seem to be implying that not giving to charity is a valid standard for atheists being "worse people". that's fallacious logic.
Cool? I'm Agnostic, which might as well mean I'm an Atheist, and the rest of my family are Atheists, even my grandparents, and we do regular charity events for the Juvenile Diabetes Research Foundation. So if you want to play like I'm anti-Atheist, you can't. If you want to play like I don't think Atheists do any charity work, you [I]really [/I]can't. But most of all, if you want to play like a study is not valid because you don't like it, you REALLY REALLY can't.
[QUOTE=Venezuelan;41853748]Cool? I'm Agnostic, which might as well mean I'm an Atheist, and the rest of my family are Atheists, even my grandparents, and we do regular charity events for the Juvenile Diabetes Research Foundation. So if you want to play like I'm anti-Atheist, you can't. If you want to play like I don't think Atheists do charity work, you [I]really [/I]can't. But most of all, if you want to play like a study is not valid but because you don't like it, you REALLY REALLY can't.[/QUOTE] Give me a reason why thinking that young atheists who are low income earners in the economy are most likely the vast majority of atheists/agnostics are misrepresented by your statements. I don't feel that your "empirical" data was perfect. I doubt that. You don't. This apparently is just straight up wrong to you but that's fine. I don't feel you saying "hey, you can't doubt studies I post" is a valid argument. Not everything has enough evidence and studys to just do a google and grab a study that has exactly what you need. Personally, I know most young people I know are atheists and are young, thus low income earners and not likely to give to charity in the form of monetary donations. Why is that not valid? because YOU say so? Because you say doubting it simply means you don't like it?
[QUOTE=Venezuelan;41853748]If you want to play like I don't think Atheists do any charity work, you [I]really [/I]can't.[/QUOTE] you said it yourself: you do charity work without actually donating to charity, and so the good work you do would not have been recorded in this study. they only look at direct injections of dosh, so the headline "atheists least charitable group in UK" is baiting rubbish until you take those things into account.
Even if this study isn't really rigorous, pretty much every other major peer reviewed paper out there says the same damn thing, and has said the same thing for a long period of time. They've also said that over half of the money the average person donates goes to religious organizations. Boston College put out a rather nice study in 2002 you should be able to access in full [URL]http://www.bc.edu/content/dam/files/research_sites/cwp/pdf/Charitable.pdf[/URL] Granted, this is only for the US, and the data is less recent, but they've compiled and analyzed data from several studies rather nicely. EDIT:
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;41853795]Give me a reason why thinking that young atheists who are low income earners in the economy are most likely the vast majority of atheists/agnostics are misrepresented by your statements. I don't feel that your "empirical" data was perfect. I doubt that. You don't. This apparently is just straight up wrong to you but that's fine. I don't feel you saying "hey, you can't doubt studies I post" is a valid argument. Not everything has enough evidence and studys to just do a google and grab a study that has exactly what you need. Personally, I know most young people I know are atheists and are young, thus low income earners and not likely to give to charity in the form of monetary donations. Why is that not valid? because YOU say so? Because you say doubting it simply means you don't like it?[/QUOTE] look, an empirical study was posted. if you want to make an argument you can't make me look all your data up for you. so I suggest you do the following to convince anyone: remove doubt that children would have been polled for this, prove that Atheists have a significantly larger youth population compared to other belief systems, prove that Atheists on average make less than other belief systems in the UK. Until then, that's baseless. That's not a high standard. That's logic. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Turnips5;41853878]you said it yourself: you do charity work without actually donating to charity, and so the good work you do would not have been recorded in this study. they only look at direct injections of dosh, so the headline "atheists least charitable group in UK" is baiting rubbish until you take those things into account.[/QUOTE] no, we fundraise and directly donate. And if I worked directly for the JDRF organization my work would no doubt be measured in the increased donations having charity workers brings. Plus the data would even out as religious organizations then also have unrecorded manpower behind the scenes.
[URL]http://mcb.org.uk/library/article_23-5-03.php[/URL] [quote=MCB 2003] In our experience, rates of blood donation among some black and other ethnic minority groups are currently very poor, increasing the difficulty of finding matched blood for people from these groups who need emergency transfusion. We have found that less than 2% of people attending blood donation sessions in the West Midlandsan area with a high proportion of people of Pakistani and Bangladeshi origin were from ethnic minority communities. [/quote] [URL]http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-22893714[/URL] [quote]According to NHS figures, British South Asians make up less than 2.5% of all blood donors across the UK.[/quote] "BRITISH SOUTH ASIANS LEAST CHARITABLE WITH THEIR PRECIOUS BLOOD" [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Venezuelan;41853899]no, we fundraise and directly donate.[/quote] okay, fair enough [quote]And if I worked directly for the JDRF organization my work would no doubt be measured in the increased donations having charity workers brings.[/quote] would it though? what does the study on this say (hey can anyone find the study because I can't, stupid huffpaint links to the times which is inexplicably behind a paywall)? [quote]Plus the data would even out as religious organizations then also have unrecorded manpower behind the scenes.[/QUOTE] I think the data actually would "even out", as in atheists would get closer to parity with religious groups, but I don't know that for sure. I know a bunch of people at university with a diverse array of beliefs and as far as I can tell, none of them donate much cash to charities (unless you count things like the humble bundle and stuff like that), but many of them do volunteering and give blood. [editline]16th August 2013[/editline] whatever. I totally accept that atheists in the UK appear to donate less, pound for pound, than other faiths. I'm just a bit miffed by the implications of the thread title. charity takes many forms.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.