• "The disruption is worth the fight" - Striking begins
    46 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Camundongo;30800569]The problem here is on both sides - if the government had actually gone to the negotiation table, instead of repeatably damning the unions in the press instead. Have the unions overreacted? Yes, probably, but the Government didn't seem to be particulary active in trying to stop the strike either.[/QUOTE] It would've been nice if the Government had've discussed it with the unions first, but really, I don't see why the Government should have to negotiate over every pay cut. It may seem harsh, but would the boss of a company you are working for in the private sector have a negotiation with you before he cuts your pay? No. He'd just cut your pay, and you can quit if you want.
[QUOTE=Caesar;30800680]It would've been nice if the Government had've discussed it with the unions first, but really, I don't see why the Government should have to negotiate over every pay cut. It may seem harsh, but would the boss of a company you are working for in the private sector have a negotiation with you before he cuts your pay? No. He'd just cut your pay, and you can quit if you want.[/QUOTE] Yes, by law he would have to, or he'd be in breach of employment law and would get taken to an Employment Tribunal. You can't force workers to take a lower wage in the UK. Maybe you can in Ireland, if so you have pretty crappy employment law.
I understand cuts and everything, but don't mess with people's pensions. That's like kicking a person in his balls during a boxing match.
[QUOTE=Camundongo;30800715]Yes, by law he would have to, or he'd be in breach of employment law and would get taken to an Employment Tribunal. You can't force workers to take a lower wage in the UK. Maybe you can in Ireland, if so you have pretty crappy employment law.[/QUOTE] An employer can cut your wage if he has to. If you don't want to accept it, you can leave. Nobody forces you to take it. I don't know the exact procedure of it, but obviously they can. Why would anybody ever take pay cuts then?
[QUOTE=Caesar;30800850]An employer can cut your wage if he has to. If you don't want to accept it, you can leave. Nobody forces you to take it. I don't know the exact procedure of it, but obviously they can. Why would anybody ever take pay cuts then?[/QUOTE] If the government cut anyones wages there would be more than just strikes
[QUOTE=Caesar;30800850]An employer can cut your wage if he has to. If you don't want to accept it, you can leave. Nobody forces you to take it. I don't know the exact procedure of it, but obviously they can. Why would anybody ever take pay cuts then?[/QUOTE] People generally will if they feel that company would need them to survive or would otherwise have to make people redundant. It's same with making people work short-time. You can, eventually, dismiss someone for refusing to take a paycut, but they can also then claim that it was unecessary, they weren't provided with enough information to make a correct decision, etc. Employment law generally comes down on the worker's side. Of course, some companies get away with it because the people who have their pay cut don't know their rights.
[QUOTE=Camundongo;30800991]People generally will if they feel that company would need them to survive or would otherwise have to make people redundant. It's same with making people work short-time. You can, eventually, dismiss someone for refusing to take a paycut, but they can also then claim that it was unecessary, they weren't provided with enough information to make a correct decision, etc. Employment law generally comes down on the worker's side. Of course, some companies get away with it because the people who have their pay cut don't know their rights.[/QUOTE] If the company needs to cut pay to survive efficiently, they can. I know employment law protects the worker, but it also protects the company. This is pretty much the same thing that is happening now. The Government needs to cut expenditure, but instead of just accepting that everybody has to cut back, the unions have decided to hold one of the largest strikes in recent years, which I think is just plain irresponsible.
[QUOTE=Caesar;30801251]If the company needs to cut pay to survive efficiently, they can. I know employment law protects the worker, but it also protects the company. This is pretty much the same thing that is happening now. The Government needs to cut expenditure, but instead of just accepting that everybody has to cut back, the unions have decided to hold one of the largest strikes in recent years, which I think is just plain irresponsible.[/QUOTE] But the company still has go through negotiation, by law, with the workers affected by the pay cuts, and it shouldn't be any different with Government.
I think the unions expected Labour to side with them as well, but were surprised when they didn't. David Cameron even made a joke to Ed Miliband saying he was in 'the pockets of the unions'
[QUOTE=AltFanatic;30788630]isnt this how the film adaptation of battle royale started [editline]29th June 2011[/editline] except in japan of course[/QUOTE]haha is it that movie where they shoot the fuck out of that dick coach at the end and he sits down, eats some cookies, talks on the phone and dies? (something like that)
[QUOTE=The mouse;30800417]They should just deal with it. They should understand that the government needs to make cuts so that they will have a pension in the future. The unions are a load of short sighted selfish cunts.[/QUOTE] It's NOT the teachers fault. It's Tony's governments fault, and all the ones previous for not doing something to fix this. This isn't a new issue, it's an old one, and now we've run out of money the government are just saying 'oh well, never mind' and cutting it. They're not being selfish, they're being angry. For fuck sake, its the government that has control over these things - they should have made it a priority years ago and did something then.
The Government has spoken about the strikes, saying they had a 'minimal impact' and that proposed plans are still going ahead..
[QUOTE=Caesar;30799433]Of course better paid jobs can be found, but do those jobs have all of the perks and benefits that teaching has? Long holidays, a five day working week and virtually no risk of being fired or laid off? I've never heard of there being major problems of finding teachers for science and/or technology, but if that is the case, then I would presume it is because the UK has a growing population, and there are less people graduating from courses like science and technology. Infact I'm pretty sure the situation is the exact opposite at the moment. Plenty of people graduating from teaching courses but not enough jobs to go around. Hence, the amount of substitutes.[/QUOTE] Sophmore year(year 10), my math teacher got laid off, along with a bunch of other teachers and for Science I couldn't take Biology because all the classes were over flowing so I had to take fucking Horticulture. :geno: [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] 'Merica, by the way.
[QUOTE=Del91;30817356]Sophmore year(year 10), my math teacher got laid off, along with a bunch of other teachers and for Science I couldn't take Biology because all the classes were over flowing so I had to take fucking Horticulture. :geno: [editline]30th June 2011[/editline] 'Merica, by the way.[/QUOTE] That sucks, was s/he a fully trained teacher or a temporary substitute? I'm not sure how it works in the USA, but over here and in the UK, once you're hired as a full teacher, you have virtually no chance of being laid off. The problem is though that it can be difficult to be hired as a full teacher.
[QUOTE=Zero Ziat;30802176]haha is it that movie where they shoot the fuck out of that dick coach at the end and he sits down, eats some cookies, talks on the phone and dies? (something like that)[/QUOTE] yeah except that he was their 7th grade teacher who wanted revenge for the humiliation they caused him, and he was talking with his bitch of a daughter then shoots the phone funny scene
[QUOTE=Zeke129;30784096]How DARE someone want their pension[/QUOTE] People are living longer. They can choose to either pay more into their pension pot or get less out of it. Tough shit.
[QUOTE=Capitulazyguy;30827234]People are living longer. They can choose to either pay more into their pension pot or get less out of it. Tough shit.[/QUOTE] Don't let them fool you that this was 'part of something that had to happen'. They ain't go no money and they're stripping it. It didn't have to be this drastic. It still doesn't have to be.
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