Ammon Bundy and 3 other arrested near Oregon refuge; shots fired - Polidicks

[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;49615911]and will probably assume the cops shot first.[/QUOTE] To be honest the cops probably did shoot first.

[QUOTE=RichyZ;49616012]and have their cattle graze on the land illegally[/QUOTE] Wait, these guys from Texas shipped their cattle up to Oregon to graze on this terrain?

[QUOTE=Ridge;49616138]Wait, these guys from Texas shipped their cattle up to Oregon to graze on this terrain?[/QUOTE] The Bundy's were never in Texas.

I literally don't care if one of those hicks goes and get's himself shot, they're doing illegal shit and dancing around like dumb idiots, telling themselves they're being brave "patriots" of a new America.

[QUOTE=Pvt. Martin;49616235]I literally don't care if one of those hicks goes and get's himself shot, they're doing illegal shit and dancing around like dumb idiots, telling themselves they're being brave "patriots" of a new America.[/QUOTE] This post sums it up exactly: [QUOTE=Timebomb575;49615591]Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.[/QUOTE] Ohh well. Now we get to have Joe and the others tell us about how the gubment is going to pay for violating the militias Americaness.

[QUOTE=RichyZ;49615184]tried to muscle it? wasn't this what you suggested in the last thread, to pull them over on traffic violations? what if bundy and co shot first? would it be wrong for the fbi to shoot back?[/QUOTE] I stated wait till their mostly dispersed in order to prevent any of them digging in. It's easier to take something when its not filled to the brim with around 200 hundred pissed off and armed folks. If that the latter was the case, then fair game. Otherwise it has made the situation far more worse then it needs to be.

Just roll in one M1A1 tank. That's all you would need to end this shit. You would not even need to shoot the thing

As of this morning, FBI rolled up to the refuge with roadblocks. [url]http://www.oregonlive.com/oregon-standoff/2016/01/fbi_tells_oregon_refuge_occupi.html#incart_maj-story-1[/url]

[QUOTE=Sableye;49615714]no but they've hardly been peaceful or sitting on their ass[/QUOTE] Paving a road = not peaceful :what:

Really hope we can bring back as many as possible alive to try for treason.

[QUOTE=Propane Addict;49617837]Really hope we can bring back as many as possible alive to try for treason.[/QUOTE] I don't think they fit under the definition of treason: [quote]Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.[/quote] They're not adhering to any enemy and it's a [I]real[/I] stretch to say they're 'levying war' against the US.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49617943]I don't think they fit under the definition of treason: They're not adhering to any enemy and it's a [I]real[/I] stretch to say they're 'levying war' against the US.[/QUOTE] They've captured a government building through force and are continuing to occupy it. I'd consider it an act of war.

[QUOTE=Propane Addict;49617947]They've captured a government building through force and are continuing to occupy it. I'd consider it an act of war.[/QUOTE] It's a wildlife refuge ffs

[QUOTE=Propane Addict;49617947]They've captured a government building through force and are continuing to occupy it. I'd consider it an act of war.[/QUOTE] i'm stuck in a timeloop i swear last time this thread appeared i got into a 2 page argument about treason this isn't fucking treason - it makes no sense to apply treason to these people. the strongest thing you could brand them as, is domestic terrorists

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49617953]It's a wildlife refuge ffs[/QUOTE] Who GIVES a fuck? They could have stormed a fucking FBI branch or a fucking cafeteria. They siezed federal property, with weaponry, and have refused to leave and have threatened violence against those who would try to remove them. They directly oppose the federal government, and have threatened to kill government employees. They absolutely fit the bill. Fuck them in to a prison cell or a grave.

[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;49617994]Who GIVES a fuck? They could have stormed a fucking FBI branch or a fucking cafeteria. They siezed federal property, with weaponry, and have refused to leave and have threatened violence against those who would try to remove them. They directly oppose the federal government, and have threatened to kill government employees. They absolutely fit the bill. Fuck them in to a prison cell or a grave.[/QUOTE] That's the "what we did on paper" story: "Domestic terrorists seize a government building with intent of overthrowing some laws of the land by force." - Sounds pretty damn heinous, doesn't it? Crime of the century, stuff. The "what actually happened" story is, a bunch of lunatic gun enthusiasts "seized" (drove up and broke into) an [I]empty[/I] government building that is nothing more than a wildlife preserve, something that has [I]zero[/I] impact on governing, utilities, public works, etc. They are incapable of threatening the government in any shape form or way, let alone get what they want from it so people here need to stop getting their panties in a knot about the 'threat' they pose. [editline]27th January 2016[/editline] Propping them up as something more than what they are - stupid trespassing vandals - only encourages them and gives them more credit to what they believe is right.

these threads are hilarious because it's like the calling bell for the resident conservatives to come and say stuff along the lines of "the militia totally peaceful and also the concept of property doesn't apply to the government" or "the feds will probably definitely will shoot first and whatever bad happens is going to be their fault (i read it on facebook!)" [editline]27th January 2016[/editline] if it was ELF or some shit they'd probably tell em to storm the place and arrest/kill em all

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;49618017]That's the "what we did on paper" story: "Domestic terrorists seize a government building with intent of overthrowing some laws of the land by force." - Sounds pretty damn heinous, doesn't it? Crime of the century, stuff. The "what actually happened" story is, a bunch of lunatic gun enthusiasts "seized" (drove up and broke into) an [I]empty[/I] government building that is nothing more than a wildlife preserve, something that has [I]zero[/I] impact on governing, utilities, public works, etc. They are incapable of threatening the government in any shape form or way, let alone get what they want from it so people here need to stop getting their panties in a knot about the 'threat' they pose.[/QUOTE]Keep moving those goal posts, it won't help your argument. They've threatened federal agents, seized federal property, and directly oppose and have threatened the federal government itself. That's the end of it. That's the only shit that matters, not "Well, no one was really there at the time." or "Well, they haven't actually killed anyone YET." Its irrelevant misdirection, no intelligent person gives a fuck because it does not matter.

[QUOTE=raz r23;49617630]Just roll in one M1A1 tank. That's all you would need to end this shit. You would not even need to shoot the thing[/QUOTE] Yeah that was done once, and it totally worked! [t]http://40.media.tumblr.com/4e777efa44685769f15991e378edffcc/tumblr_n4ahf7KdLk1slma6so3_1280.jpg[/t][t]http://nationalvanguard.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/068-01329.jpg[/t] Oh wait, it ended in a 51 day standoff which ended with roughly 90 people dead. Which later encouraged further sporadic battles between the government and militia groups which thought the government wouldn't resolve things peacefully anymore. Of which was entirely avoidable by-the-by, considering FBI negotiators had been working with the Branch Davidons for quiet some time and slowly had managed to convince them to end the fights. All of which went out the fucking window when you roll a goddamn IFV and Tank up to the compound and start destroying someone's home, vehicles, and otherwise in a strongarm stance. But hey, it totally worked!

The nice thing is that when they get convicted with felony charges they can no longer own guns which is kind of ironic

[QUOTE=Propane Addict;49617837]Really hope we can bring back as many as possible alive to try for treason.[/QUOTE] Do you even know what the fuck your saying lol? I swear most people talking about this thing in this thread really have no clue.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;49618589]I fail to see where he has no clue, armed occupation of land, even worse state owned land, against the state, by the states citizens, Id also name treason. I believe armed insurgency classifies under treason.[/QUOTE] Keep toying with semantics, it's still not 'treason' and they're never going to be tried for treason.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;49618589]I fail to see where he has no clue, armed occupation of land, even worse state owned land, against the state, by the states citizens, Id also name treason. I believe armed insurgency classifies under treason.[/QUOTE] I think to be charged with treason would require them to be aiding or receiving aid from an outside source.

Seems like the FBI saw an opportunity and took it. If you're going to 'protest' (or possibly revolt) with guns, then expect to be shot at.

The guy who was killed, speaking earlier this month: [quote]"I'm just not going to prison," Finicum said. "Look at the stars. There's no way I'm going to sit in a concrete cell where I can't see the stars and roll out my bedroll on the ground. That's just not going to happen. I want to be able to get up in the morning and throw my saddle on my horse and go check on my cows. It's OK. I've lived a good life. God's been gracious to me."[/quote] [url]http://edition.cnn.com/2016/01/27/us/oregon-lavoy-finicum-profile/index.html[/url]

They did not commit treason, most of you guys do not even know what you are talking about. They took over an abandoned federal building on a wildlife refuge in attempts to have the feds give it back to the county, as they support two guys who started a fire, and claim the feds have no right to own land like that. Simple as that. Domestic Terrorist is even a stretch. Sure they are armed, but they aren't gonna blow up a bridge if their demands aren't met, they are just gonna bitch more. Now, they still are not good guys, and the law should apply to them, but stop overblowing this. Jeez, every day it seems like some of you keyboard commandos wanna reenact Waco or ruby ridge.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;49618416]Yeah that was done once, and it totally worked! [t]http://40.media.tumblr.com/4e777efa44685769f15991e378edffcc/tumblr_n4ahf7KdLk1slma6so3_1280.jpg[/t][t]http://nationalvanguard.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/068-01329.jpg[/t] Oh wait, it ended in a 51 day standoff which ended with roughly 90 people dead. Which later encouraged further sporadic battles between the government and militia groups which thought the government wouldn't resolve things peacefully anymore. Of which was entirely avoidable by-the-by, considering FBI negotiators had been working with the Branch Davidons for quiet some time and slowly had managed to convince them to end the fights. All of which went out the fucking window when you roll a goddamn IFV and Tank up to the compound and start destroying someone's home, vehicles, and otherwise in a strongarm stance. But hey, it totally worked![/QUOTE] Shit, is that an Abrams? Why did they feel that was necessary?

[QUOTE=ewitwins;49618788]Shit, is that an Abrams? Why did they feel that was necessary?[/QUOTE] Well to be fair the people inside had a lot of rifles and man power, but like Joe was saying, the IFV and tank really, really weren't needed for that.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;49618941]Perhaps, english isnt my main language, I might be wrong. But how different is Treason from Domestic Terrorism with malicious intent against the government in American legal system?[/QUOTE] Because they're not terrorizing? To cause terror isn't their goal?

If the rest of them are anything like these guys then there's probably going to be a shootout. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72MJLxSTiGM[/media]