Pentecostal Preachers are Pressuring People, Successfully, to Stop Taking HIV Meds
125 replies, posted
i should say though, i dont take any issue with you believing what you believe i think it's fine and dandy, but to say that science hasnt said it's balls is just wrong
[QUOTE=slayer64;41881943]How in the fuck are my religious beliefs "proven to be factually false by common knowledge"?[/QUOTE]
planet earth is a sphere, snakes don't eat dirt, you can't fit every animal on a boat, evolution exists, earth isn't 5000 years old, you can't see all of earth from any point of height, the sun doesn't move around planet earth.
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882174]planet earth is a sphere, snakes don't eat dirt, you can't fit every animal on a boat, evolution exists, earth isn't 5000 years old, you can't see all of earth from any point of height, the sun doesn't move around planet earth.[/QUOTE]
and how do you know he believes any of that? chill out. jesus
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41882193]and how do you know he believes any of that? chill out. jesus[/QUOTE]
uuh, what? what do his beliefs have to do with scientific facts? he asked me a question and I answered it, you're the one getting all excited.
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882238]uuh, what? what do his beliefs have to do with scientific facts? he asked me a question and I answered it, you're the one getting all excited.[/QUOTE]
how do you know that he believes any of this:
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882174]planet earth is a sphere, snakes don't eat dirt, you can't fit every animal on a boat, evolution exists, earth isn't 5000 years old, you can't see all of earth from any point of height, the sun doesn't move around planet earth.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41882263]how do you know that he believes any of this:[/QUOTE]
I don't know how to respond to you... do I need to know whether or not he believes that planet earth is a fucking sphere? he either believes facts but chooses to ignore them, or doesn't believe facts because they contradict his religion. not much of a distinction there.
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882311]I don't know how to respond to you... do I need to know whether or not he believes that planet earth is a fucking sphere? he either believes facts but chooses to ignore them, or doesn't believe facts because they contradict his religion. not much of a distinction there.[/QUOTE]
he has not categorically stated that he believes any of the stuff you posted. they are not inherent to his religion there are plenty of christians who accept the true age of the earth and are aware that the earth revolves around the sun
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41882395]he has not categorically stated that he believes any of the stuff you posted. they are not inherent to his religion there are plenty of christians who accept the true age of the earth and are aware that the earth revolves around the sun[/QUOTE]
I think you're a little confused about the nature of my response. he asked me this: ''How in the fuck are my religious beliefs "proven to be factually false by common knowledge"?'' so I listed some well known information proven to be fact that directly contradicts the religion he believes in. he can choose to not believe in certain aspects of the religion, but once you begin cherry picking pieces of a religion you want to keep, that's when you've accepted that the religion is based on things that are not true. so again, he can either choose not to believe facts, or he can believe them but simply ignore the fact that they're proof of the invalidity of his religion. either way, the distinction is so paper thin it might as well not even be there.
just because he believes in the christian god and the divinity of jesus doesnt mean he's subscribed to all the other dogma that is associated with the mainstream church. his religious beliefs are personal to him
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882454]I think you're a little confused about the nature of my response. he asked me this: ''How in the fuck are my religious beliefs "proven to be factually false by common knowledge"?'' so I listed some well known information proven to be fact that directly contradicts the religion he believes in. he can choose to not believe in certain aspects of the religion, but once you begin cherry picking pieces of a religion you want to keep, that's when you've accepted that the religion is based on things that are not true. so again, he can either choose not to believe facts, or he can believe them but simply ignore the fact that they're proof of the invalidity of his religion. either way, the distinction is so paper thin it might as well not even be there.[/QUOTE]
god you're obnoxious
oops. i accidentally said "god", hope you don't get mad at me
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41882490]just because he believes in the christian god and the divinity of jesus doesnt mean he's subscribed to all the other dogma that is associated with the mainstream church. his religious beliefs are personal to him[/QUOTE]
he described himself as a protestant, not a ''person who believes in the divinity of jesus''. if he's not a protestant, he shouldn't call himself a protestant. but I think it's safe to assume that he is a protestant, and you're just making an argument where none exist.
[editline]18th August 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=AJisAwesome15;41882524]god you're obnoxious
oops. i accidentally said "god", hope you don't get mad at me[/QUOTE]
I don't remember where I encountered you before, but I just remember looking at your name and thinking ''of course''.
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882572]he described himself as a protestant, not a ''person who believes in the divinity of jesus''. if he's not a protestant, he shouldn't call himself a protestant. but I think it's safe to assume that he is a protestant, and you're just making an argument where none exist.[/QUOTE]
protestant describes someone who denies the infallibility of the pope or more broadly anyone outside of the catholic and orthodoxes churches but is still christian
[editline]18th August 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882572]I don't remember where I encountered you before, but I just remember looking at your name and thinking ''of course''.[/QUOTE]
funny i thought the same thing
I watched my father waste away from HIV and passed this January. This pisses me off, no one should stop taking their meds for this.
This is sickening.
[editline]18th August 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Whiterfire;41879865]I am going to go on a limb and say all radicalism is fucking stupid. Middle path is the way to go.[/QUOTE]
if your not a moderate you're a problem
thats my motto
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41882612]protestant describes someone who denies the infallibility of the pope or more broadly anyone outside of the catholic and orthodoxes churches but is still christian[/QUOTE]
they still believe in the bible. what you described is someone who exclusively believes in the divinity of jesus christ, and does not accept the bible in any way. it's highly unlikely that he falls under that category, and if he does he should stop misrepresenting himself.
[QUOTE=slayer64;41880557]Again with the douchebaggery. Could you kindly shut the fuck up and learn that what you consider to be "stupid beliefs" are actually worldviews that the majority of humanity take seriously? If you don't want to be criticized for being a dick, stop being a dick.[/QUOTE]
if 50% of the planet actively believed in Unicorns, I wouldn't think that makes unicorns a serious theory until you show me some evidence of it.
[editline]18th August 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41882395]he has not categorically stated that he believes any of the stuff you posted. they are not inherent to his religion there are plenty of christians who accept the true age of the earth and are aware that the earth revolves around the sun[/QUOTE]
they're not really doing a great job following their religion then and might as well start looking at other flaws in their belief system rather than staying stagnant and okay with beliefs that have very little to no rational justification and even lack consistency with each other
[QUOTE=Bruhmis;41882950]they still believe in the bible. what you described is someone who exclusively believes in the divinity of jesus christ, and does not accept the bible in any way. it's highly unlikely that he falls under that category, and if he does he should stop misrepresenting himself.[/QUOTE]
in the primacy of the bible over other scripture, not the infallibility of the bible
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883015]in the primacy of the bible over other scripture, not the infallibility of the bible[/QUOTE]
this doesn't seem any more logical
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;41883050]this doesn't seem any more logical[/QUOTE]
im not arguing that its logical, im only arguing that the guy on the previous page is in fact a protestant and does not necessarily believe all of the dogma.
as far as i and scientific consensus are concerned he's totally wrong, but whether he's right or wrong has nothing to do with how inherently bad his beliefs are
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883107]im not arguing that its logical, im only arguing that the guy on the previous page is in fact a protestant and does not necessarily believe all of the dogma.
as far as i and scientific consensus are concerned he's totally wrong, but whether he's right or wrong has nothing to do with how inherently bad his beliefs are[/QUOTE]
beliefs that are contrary to reality, contain facts or ideas that reality directly contradicts, are what I'd consider "bad".
Whether he believes the dogma or not is irrelevant. You call yourself a christian, there's a certain set of beliefs and structure that goes with this. Once you stop doing a lot of those things, and you still call yourself that, aren't you personally being a bit intellectually dishonest with yourself? Why not examine the rest of it and see what point it has without that structure.
Believe whatever you want, I don't want to change beliefs for them, but I don't see how those said beliefs are beyond any level of criticism. I'd rather people changed them for themselves though.
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883015]in the primacy of the bible over other scripture, not the infallibility of the bible[/QUOTE]
and i should say that not even that is necessarily true as protestantism usually refers to christians who are not part of the catholic or orthodox churches. all he's required to believe to qualify as a protestant is that jesus is divine and human and is the saviour of mankind
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883185]and i should say that not even that is necessarily true as protestantism usually refers to christians who are not part of the catholic or orthodox churches. all he's required to believe to qualify as a protestant is that jesus is divine and human and is the saviour of mankind[/QUOTE]
Protestanism has a lot more to it than that. Do you even understand the history that caused the protestant split? When you say something like that it sincerely makes me feel you don't.
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883107]im not arguing that its logical, im only arguing that the guy on the previous page is in fact a protestant and does not necessarily believe all of the dogma.
as far as i and scientific consensus are concerned he's totally wrong, but whether he's right or wrong has nothing to do with how inherently bad his beliefs are[/QUOTE]
it wasn't really about whether or not they were bad. that being said, if I someone asked me to join any group of any kind, and handed me a book and said ''this book is what our group and it's morals are built upon'', and in it I found misogyny, homophobia, slavery, child abuse and a violent patriarchal way of life, I would very easily come to the decision that this book and the people who treasure it are immoral and I do not want to be associated with them in any capacity.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;41883203]Protestanism has a lot more to it than that. Do you even understand the history that caused the protestant split? When you say something like that it sincerely makes me feel you don't.[/QUOTE]
i do understand the reformation yes, but we're not living in the spanish netherlands, nowadays it pretty much refers to non-orthodox non-cathoklics
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;41879332]Rings? The rings of hell aren't part of actual belief as far as I know, it was from the poem Dante's Inferno, which I'm fairly sure is just considered as fiction.[/QUOTE]
I regard it as part of Hell cause I really couldn't see Hell as just a big cave full of fire.
What I mean is I feel there are different punishments for different sins, each one befitting to the greatest sin you have committed.
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883235]i do understand the reformation yes, but we're not living in the spanish netherlands, nowadays it pretty much refers to non-orthodox non-cathoklics[/QUOTE]
But Protestantism doesn't just mean "accepts jesus" and what not. There's various different levels that Protestantism can be claimed at. Sure, you can say "accepts jesus" but then there's many protestant churches in North America that don't feel that is enough. Etc.
The US has a diverse and complicated religious structure.
[QUOTE=Moustacheman;41883241]I regard it as part of Hell cause I really couldn't see Hell as just a big cave full of fire.[/QUOTE]
Fate in Hell, if it even exists, is the same for everyone as far as I know. From Satan himself, to unbelievers.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;41883278]But Protestantism doesn't just mean "accepts jesus" and what not. There's various different levels that Protestantism can be claimed at. Sure, you can say "accepts jesus" but then there's many protestant churches in North America that don't feel that is enough. Etc.
The US has a diverse and complicated religious structure.[/QUOTE]
ok? there's many that take a much more moderate stance and generally dont preach anything harmful at all
[QUOTE=elevate;41883360]Fate in Hell, if it even exists, is the same for everyone as far as I know. From Satan himself, to unbelievers.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I understand that. It's my own theory, really. I've met some people who agree, and people who spat in my face and called me a heathen.
[QUOTE=Hellduck;41883388]ok? there's many that take a much more moderate stance and generally dont preach anything harmful at all[/QUOTE]
If you're going to disregard the whole religion anyways and just keep the little bit and piece here and there, what's the point
that's just a bit of critical thinking away from disbelief.
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