• Four Chicago teens in custody after livestreaming kidnap and torture of disabled person
    447 replies, posted
[QUOTE=ShukaidoX;51624138]Looks like electing a racist, bigoted, xenophobic demagogue didn't sit too well with minorities. Who would have thought? Not that these clowns are justified in any way, shape, or form. This guy probably didn't even vote for Trump.[/QUOTE] When the alternative are the people that are the ones telling minorities that they should hate white people and that white people are the cause of everything bad in the world, then why would I ever vote for them? The fault of this is at the media who were desperately painting trump as some minority-gassing second coming of hitler in their attempt to sway the election to fit their ideology, which causes people to feel justified in doing ridiculous shit like this, because "Fuck white people", as they say. No seriously if anything it's been the democrats that have been causing these racial divides by green lighting such toxic ideologies and trying to turn every single issue into a race issue. "Will breaking up the big banks fix racism?" How am I supposed to respond to that?
[QUOTE=bitches;51624099]they did this because they're violent people that take pleasure in harming others, like many others throughout the world that use religion and politics as their excuse if not for the election it would have been something else they branded it with[/QUOTE] Can you seriously sit there and say that their motivation wasn't what they said? Do you have any evidence to support that claim? You're literally ignoring the reason why they kidnapped this man and dismissing it as "Well, they would have done it anyway!" You literally cannot know that. I can absolutely guarantee that if these people were torturing someone they believed to be a Hillary voter (and for explicitly that reason as it would be similarly stated) there would be absolutely no doubt at all to their motivations.
[QUOTE=soulharvester;51624171]When the alternative are the people that are the ones telling minorities that the should hate white people and that white people are the cause of everything bad in the world, then why would I ever vote for them?[/QUOTE] is that what hillary said? first i've heard of it [editline]4th January 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Boaraes;51624173]Can you seriously sit there and say that their motivation wasn't what they said? Do you have any evidence to support that claim? You're literally ignoring the reason why they kidnapped this man and dismissing it as "Well, they would have done it anyway!" You literally cannot know that.[/QUOTE] it's more reasonable than believing they thought every white person was a confirmed trump voter
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;51624163]this is a disgusting way to look at the video, even if you follow it up by saying that it's not justified. if you're watching this video, and this is the take away you get from it, for shame.[/QUOTE] If you're so caught up in your self perpetuated lie of a world view that allows you to justify having someone elected like Donald Trump as being without consequence then unfortunately you need a reality check. Actions have consequences.
[QUOTE=ShukaidoX;51624138]Looks like electing a racist, bigoted, xenophobic demagogue didn't sit too well with minorities. Who would have thought? Not that these clowns are justified in any way, shape, or form. This guy probably didn't even vote for Trump.[/QUOTE] Well gee, what a perfect way to completely validate all those racist bigoted xenophobic voters he had.
The real motive is they're just violent thug life hood rats, Him being white/Trump supporter is just their current excuse for it.
[QUOTE=ShukaidoX;51624138][B]Looks like electing a racist, bigoted, xenophobic demagogue didn't sit too well with minorities. Who would have thought?[/B] Not that these clowns are justified in any way, shape, or form. This guy probably didn't even vote for Trump.[/QUOTE] Are you fucking serious dude?
I gotta say, this past week has astonished me how far people will justify news that shed bad light on the left side. [quote]can you propose any means by which these criminals determined that the disabled man was a trump supporter? if not, then there is no reason to believe that they honestly believed their excuse and as such it is not the real motive[/quote] This is honestly shameful and a clear example of double standards when it comes to attacks on trump-supporting individuals by clear political motives that the perpetrators couldn't have made clearer.
[QUOTE=bitches;51624170]can you propose any means by which these criminals determined that the disabled man was a trump supporter? if not, then there is no reason to believe that they honestly believed their excuse and as such it is not the real motive [editline]a[/editline] trying to change the subject to one of supposed hypocrisy is evading the argument[/QUOTE] is there any information of before this video started? do we know what they spoke about? do we know the conditions in which he was abducted? do we have any idea how long these two parties could have been talking? there were plenty of chances of these people to find out that he was a trump supporter but guess what it shouldn't matter even if they had no idea and were just assuming, they're still using this general hatred of trump and his supporters to fuel their actions. they probably felt justified in what they were doing because everyone legitimately seems to believe trump is hitler. if it wasn't politically motivated for these people specifically, the political landscape of the moment definitely allowed it. also i'm not sure i tried to change the subject but ok guess im just an argument evader
[QUOTE=Tudd;51624186]I gotta say, this past week has astonished me how far people will justify news that shed bad light on the left side. This is honestly shameful and a clear example of double standards when it comes to attacks on individuals by clear political motives that the perpetrators couldn't have made clearer.[/QUOTE] thanks for showing that you don't have a counterargument
[QUOTE=TheTalon;51624182]The real motive is they're just violent thug life hood rats, Him being white/Trump supporter is just their current excuse for it.[/QUOTE] Picture a group of 4 white guys torturing a black man while screaming "FUCK BLACKS" argue about politics if you want but if this isn't at least racially motivated, nothing is
[QUOTE=bitches;51624193]thanks for showing that you don't have a counterargument[/QUOTE] I don't have to argue when you haven't brought any legitimate proof of what your concluding.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;51624189]even if they had no idea and were just assuming, they're still using this general hatred of trump and his supporters to fuel their actions. they probably felt justified in what they were doing because everyone legitimately seems to believe trump is hitler. if it wasn't politically motivated for these people specifically, the political landscape of the moment definitely allowed it.[/QUOTE] sure, if they honestly believe that any white person is a nazi, then this is politically motivated my stance is that this is not likely, even among violent crazies
[QUOTE=bitches;51624174]is that what hillary said? first i've heard of it [editline]4th January 2017[/editline] it's more reasonable than believing they thought every white person was a confirmed trump voter[/QUOTE] Claiming it as "more reasonable" isn't sufficient evidence. There's a reason police are considering it as a racially and politically motivated act.
[QUOTE=Tudd;51624186]I gotta say, this past week has astonished me how far people will justify news that shed bad light on the left side. [/QUOTE] Even if I agreed that this was a politically motivated, how is this an indictment against "the left side"? Is the takeaway that the left is inherently more violent than the right? [QUOTE=Tudd;51624186]This is honestly shameful and a clear example of double standards when it comes to attacks on trump-supporting individuals by clear political motives that the perpetrators couldn't have made clearer. [/QUOTE] What do you want?
[QUOTE=Boaraes;51624206]Claiming it as "more reasonable" isn't sufficient evidence. There's a reason police are considering it as a racially and politically motivated act.[/QUOTE] by all means the police ought to treat it as a political and disability and racial hate crime, as this is the way they've portrayed themselves on the surface my point is only that they would have found another victim under different circumstances, and that this isn't the beginning of some dramatic anti-trump uprising that Tudd is victimizing himself to be a part of
[QUOTE=Raidyr;51624212]Even if I agreed that this was a politically motivated, how is this an indictment against "the left side"? Is the takeaway that the left is inherently more violent than the right? [/quote] The takeaway is that people are increasingly following into a denial state on certain debates. [quote] What do you want?[/QUOTE] An honest intellectual debate when the physical evidence is overwhelmingly indicating this was politically and racially motivated. Not some bullshit, "Well it was only a excuse that could be filled in with another motive."
[QUOTE=bitches;51624193]thanks for showing that you don't have a counterargument[/QUOTE] I don't know if you realize this, but the reality you're suggesting is even worse. The implication of your argument is that they probably had no idea whether or not he was a Trump Supporter, but just grabbed some "Fucking White Male" off the street, tortured him, and bragged about it on social media, all just to look like they're fighting back against white people for electing trump, even if the person they're torturing might have voted for Hillary, because that's what they believe is valid activism. You're suggesting that they're skinning random people of a certain race, with a presumption that he used his right to democracy incorrectly with no evidence to suggest that, and bragging about it to their friends, because they're just that far gone. How is that not far worse?
[QUOTE=Tudd;51624186]I gotta say, this past week has astonished me how far people will justify news that shed bad light on the left side. This is honestly shameful and a clear example of double standards when it comes to attacks on trump-supporting individuals by clear political motives that the perpetrators couldn't have made clearer.[/QUOTE] it's actually kind of scary how many threads have people running mental gymnastics in order to justify a side they feel like they identify with. i've seen two threads with clear-cut examples of politically motivated hate attacks against trump supporters, and half of the posters were all desperately trying to paint the attackers as mentally unstable, apolitical monsters who in no way represent those who vote for hillary. this is such a dangerously toxic mindset, something that will only build up more "us vs them" mentality between the american people. when you see monsters assault, or even kidnap someone, do yourself a favor and just react as a human being would, not as an argumentative hillary supporter with an agenda would. that's the only way you're going to get rid of this "left side vs right side" narrative running in [I]all[/I] of SH at the moment.
[QUOTE=soulharvester;51624231]I don't know if you realize this, but the reality you're suggesting is even worse. The implication of your argument is that they probably had no idea whether or not he was a Trump Supporter, but just grabbed some "Fucking White Male" off the street, tortured him, and bragged about it on social media, all just to look like they're fighting back against white people for electing trump, even if the person they're torturing might have voted for Hillary, because that's what they believe is valid activism. You're suggesting that they're skinning random people of a certain race, with a presumption that he used his right to democracy incorrectly with no evidence to suggest that, and bragging about it to their friends, because they're just that far gone. How is that not far worse?[/QUOTE] it's absolutely worse; sorry to be such a pessimist
[QUOTE=bitches;51624218]by all means the police ought to treat it as a political and disability and racial hate crime, as this is the way they've portrayed themselves on the surface my point is only that they would have found another victim under different circumstances, and that this isn't the beginning of some dramatic anti-trump uprising that Tudd is victimizing himself to be a part of[/QUOTE] I don't care about what Tudd thinks. You're claiming things such as this: [QUOTE]they would have found another victim under different circumstances[/QUOTE] You do not have evidence to support this.
[QUOTE=Boaraes;51624238]I don't care about what Tudd thinks. You're claiming things such as this: You do not have evidence to support this.[/QUOTE] so you're claiming that the fervent enjoyment of torturing another human being was caused by a feisty election cycle?
[QUOTE=Tudd;51624229]The takeaway is that people are increasingly following into a denial state on certain debates.[/QUOTE] Don't deflect. I want to know what "sheds bad light on the left side" means in this context. [QUOTE=Tudd;51624229]An honest intellectual debate when the physical evidence is overwhelmingly indicating this was politically and racially motivated. Not some bullshit, "Well it was only a excuse that could be filled in with another motive."[/QUOTE] There is no overwelming evidence. This attack was taken entirely out of context. Nothing in either of the videos linked in OP seems to indicate that the attack was politically motivated. I think racially motivated is a pretty reasonable assumption to make. I don't think you are being any more or less intellectually honest than most of the other posters thus far.
[QUOTE=bitches;51624241]so you're claiming that the fervent enjoyment of torturing another human being was caused by a feisty election cycle?[/QUOTE] they wouldn't have done this without a feisty election cycle. maybe one day their mental illnesses would have manifested in other ways, but yes, i honestly believe that this specific event came about due to the election, nothing else.
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;51624232]it's actually kind of scary how many threads have people running mental gymnastics in order to justify a side they feel like they identify with. i've seen two threads with clear-cut examples of politically motivated hate attacks against trump supporters, [B]and half of the posters were all desperately trying to paint the attackers as mentally unstable, apolitical monsters who in no way represent those who vote for hillary.[/B] this is such a dangerously toxic mindset, [B]something that will only build up more "us vs them" mentality between the american people. [/B]when you see monsters assault, or even kidnap someone, do yourself a favor and just react as a human being would, not as an argumentative hillary supporter with an agenda would. that's the only way you're going to get rid of this "left side vs right side" narrative running in [I]all[/I] of SH at the moment.[/QUOTE] What the fuck?
[QUOTE=WillerinV1.02;51624249]they wouldn't have done this without a feisty election cycle. maybe one day their mental illnesses would have manifested in other ways, but yes, i honestly believe that this specific event came about due to the election, nothing else.[/QUOTE] can you elaborate on how an election cycle drives humans to enjoy the act of torture?
[QUOTE=bitches;51624241]so you're claiming that the fervent enjoyment of torturing another human being was caused by a feisty election cycle?[/QUOTE] My point is you are making assumptions that are not supported by anything tangible. Their motivations were explicitly stated and the police aren't doubting it.
While you're all arguing the semantics of a straw-man argument, the truth of the matter is that this election has exacerbated race relations in America to the extent that things like this are becoming the norm. If you don't want to acknowledge the toupee wearing elephant in the room, that's fine. But at the end of the day, when you have a bigot in charge of your country, the newly-validated bigots will come out in droves. On both sides. As we see here. America has more-or-less chosen to walk this path. It shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that this is the outcome.
[QUOTE=Boaraes;51624262]My point is you are making assumptions that are not supported by anything tangible. Their motivations were explicitly stated and the police aren't doubting it.[/QUOTE] sure but if you adhere to that conclusion, then you support the claim that recent politics caused them to enjoy torturing other humans
I hope these people are sent to prison for hate crime and get what they deserve, nothing more to be said of this disgusting incident.
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