Trump revealed highly classified information to Russian foreign minister and ambassador - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;52235522]has nesto imploded from embarrassment yet having argued till he was blue in the face that trump didn't give intel, now that trump has tweeted admitting he has given intel[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Big Dumb American;52235588]No, that's not how he operates. He did the exact same thing when Comey was fired, arguing vehemently that the allegations of Comey being fired for his directorship of the Russian investigation were all false, and stating that if they were proven true he would change his tune and find that disturbing. The next day, Trump admitted that Comey was fired for just that, and Nesto immediately jumped to a different angle of defense instead.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=-nesto-;52236012]So he didn't disclose anything inappropriate in an effort to extend the olive branch to Russia, who suffered an airline bombing at the hands of ISIS killing 227 innocent people. Wow, what a dickhead. Lock him up :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] Surprise of the century. Don't even bother replying to him.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236012]So he didn't disclose anything inappropriate in an effort to extend the olive branch to Russia, who suffered an airline bombing at the hands of ISIS killing 227 innocent people. Wow, what a dickhead. Lock him up :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] This seems like a bit of a stretch to be honest. From what it sounds like this is unheard of for a President to give such secure information away, unwarranted even. Don't even pretend that Russia is our ally in the slightest.

Nesto, your defence of the president of the US has been debunked [B]by the president of the US himself, the guy you support[/B] at least twice in a week maybe think about that for a second, if you're capable of doing so

[QUOTE=Big Dumb American;52236019]Surprise of the century.[/QUOTE] Mans gotta sleep

[QUOTE=Mr. Sarcastic;52235994]Look at all the people in this thread, I've never seen the forum lit up like that. I doubt this will trigger an impeachment hearing though. The Republicans haven't abandoned him yet.[/QUOTE] Don't worry, elections are coming up soon, and if they ride this Trump train till then the House will fall out of their control. Then the ball will roll down the hill. It might even completely annihilate what we currently understand as the Republican party. They have been protecting the first president applicable for treason charges, vehemently even. They will go down as traitors, the lot of 'em, if the midterms are as bad for them as I think they'll be.

I couldn't imagine what a Trump administration would be like when he was elected. I kinda thought he'd get browbeaten by security experts into doing what he was told for the most part, and we'd see a low energy Trump who was shocked and disappointed by the actual job. Someone would take the reigns of his Twitter account, and he'd struggle to cope with the job but would do what people told him and then kind of act like he was still the best because that's all his ego allows. I think it's safe to say that I was wrong, and had way too much faith in the white house. He's a walking disaster but now more of a petulant tyrant than anything else. He tries to intimidate or fire those who disobey him and the disconnect between what should be the official word from the president (the white house press briefings) and his actual word on Twitter is not only incredible, but now we've seen how it's leading to his downfall. If it was my job to be his PR guy, I would legit just give up now. Trump doesn't even seem to watch or be aware of the somewhat nuanced (in comparison) deflections and official denials that his press people give before he completely blows their efforts all to shit.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236027]Mans gotta sleep[/QUOTE] Sure and we can't blame you for closing your eyes, and sticking your fingers in your ear whenever Trump news comes up because not once has it come up, and been beneficial to your point or agenda. You are so dishonest it's fucking disturbing, no wonder the president is a liar on an unprecedented scale, because people like you are so dishonest you can't hold another dishonest person to task

I wonder at what point members of the administration/other republicans will decide to jump ship, because it seems like a lot of them are tying their reputations to Trump right now and that won't end well.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236012]So he didn't disclose anything inappropriate in an effort to extend the olive branch to Russia, who suffered an airline bombing at the hands of ISIS killing 227 innocent people. Wow, what a dickhead. Lock him up :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] holy shit the goalposts have broken the sound barrier they've moved so fast so about reuters being unreliable?

[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;52236029]Don't worry, elections are coming up soon, and if they ride this Trump train till then the House will fall out of their control. Then the ball will roll down the hill. It might even completely annihilate what we currently understand as the Republican party. They have been protecting the first president applicable for treason charges, vehemently even. They will go down as traitors, the lot of 'em, if the midterms are as bad for them as I think they'll be.[/QUOTE] I don't think this line of thinking is the right way of going about it. Honestly I think it'll just cause a reform of the party, sort of how the Democratic party was going under a reform (if I remember my news correctly).

president michael pence

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236012]So he didn't disclose anything inappropriate in an effort to extend the olive branch to Russia, who suffered an airline bombing at the hands of ISIS killing 227 innocent people. Wow, what a dickhead. Lock him up :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] okay, let's consider the fact (from Trump's appointed mouthpiece i'll add) that Trump let slip sensitive information. regardless of whether or not it was of importance, it clearly shows that Trump cannot be trusted to keep national secrets a secret and/or he is not receiving or attending security briefings to know what can and cannot be shared. does this sway your opinion? even one bit?

Nesto: Trump [B]could never fire Comey for the Russia investigation you people are stupid![/B] Trump two days later: I DID IT BECAUSE OF THE RUSSIA INVESTIGATION Nesto: "Trump would never share classified information" Trump two days later "I DID IT!" Every. Fucking. Time. You disturb the [B]fucking shit out of me.[/B]

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236012]So he didn't disclose anything inappropriate in an effort to extend the olive branch to Russia, who suffered an airline bombing at the hands of ISIS killing 227 innocent people. Wow, what a dickhead. Lock him up :rolleyes:[/QUOTE] It feels like you're running up the deck of the titanic trying to pretend it isn't sinking. The "liberal bias" deckchairs are now floating away and the "Trump Didn't Reveal Anything" restaurant manager lobbed the overpriced steak you bought into the sea himself before tying his staff to the building. Just get in a life boat already.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52236035]Sure and we can't blame you for closing your eyes, and sticking your fingers in your ear whenever Trump news comes up because not once has it come up, and been beneficial to your point or agenda. You are so dishonest it's fucking disturbing, no wonder the president is a liar on an unprecedented scale, because people like you are so dishonest you can't hold another dishonest person to task[/QUOTE] I think trying to politicize the protection of innocents is pretty disturbing. Doesn't matter if its Russia or Canada, no one should be left in the dark when it comes to protecting their citizens from terror threats. And if what he did was entirely appropriate then whats the outrage.

[QUOTE=Nookyava;52236041]I don't think this line of thinking is the right way of going about it. Honestly I think it'll just cause a reform of the party, sort of how the Democratic party was going under a reform (if I remember my news correctly).[/QUOTE] You mean currently or back during FDR when the parties flipped? Currently the Dem party is resisting change like a no-stick pan. They're opening the path for another party, notably Justice Dems, to enter the scene and usurp them. Justice Dems intend on siphoning Dem votes and it's probably going to well if the party doesn't start appealing to the farther left. The current Democratic party is a hard-middle corporate friendly entity, started by the Clintons as the 'New Democrats.'

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236058]I think trying to politicize the protection of innocents is pretty disturbing. Doesn't matter if its Russia or Canada, no one should be left in the dark when it comes to protecting their citizens from terror threats. And if what he did was entirely appropriate then whats the outrage.[/QUOTE] We're talking about the release of information that even our closest allies supposedly aren't aware of. I'm all in agreement for helping out and working with allies when necessary but again, Russia is the farthest on our list of friends.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236058]I think trying to politicize the protection of innocents is pretty disturbing. Doesn't matter if its Russia or Canada, no one should be left in the dark when it comes to protecting their citizens from terror threats. And if what he did was entirely appropriate then whats the outrage.[/QUOTE] That isn't what's happening though. "Politicize the protection of innocents"? Did you take a long drag from the Trump flesh pipe of "Unconvincing lies"? This is classified information that [B]YOUR ALLIES[/B] don't want you to share with Russia. Please, apologize more.

[QUOTE=ForgottenKane;52236060]You mean currently or back during FDR when the parties flipped? Currently the Dem party is resisting change like a no-stick pan. They're opening the path for another party, notably Justice Dems, to enter the scene and usurp them. Justice Dems intend on siphoning Dem votes and it's probably going to well if the party doesn't start appealing to the farther left. The current Democratic party is a hard-middle corporate friendly entity, started by the Clintons as the 'New Democrats.'[/QUOTE] Aah, so this is what it is then. I could see something like this, although on a more radical scale happening with the Republican Party if things keep up like they have been. Honestly change just needs to happen anyway.

[QUOTE=Menien Goneld;52236030]I couldn't imagine what a Trump administration would be like when he was elected. I kinda thought he'd get browbeaten by security experts into doing what he was told for the most part, and we'd see a low energy Trump who was shocked and disappointed by the actual job. Someone would take the reigns of his Twitter account, and he'd struggle to cope with the job but would do what people told him and then kind of act like he was still the best because that's all his ego allows. I think it's safe to say that I was wrong, and had way too much faith in the white house. He's a walking disaster but now more of a petulant tyrant than anything else. He tries to intimidate or fire those who disobey him and the disconnect between what should be the official word from the president (the white house press briefings) and his actual word on Twitter is not only incredible, but now we've seen how it's leading to his downfall. If it was my job to be his PR guy, I would legit just give up now. Trump doesn't even seem to watch or be aware of the somewhat nuanced (in comparison) deflections and official denials that his press people give before he completely blows their efforts all to shit.[/QUOTE] Trump's administration, thus far, has been [I]exactly[/I] as I thought it would be during the elections. He has not failed to meet my worried expectations in a single department.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236058]I think trying to politicize the protection of innocents is pretty disturbing. Doesn't matter if its Russia or Canada, no one should be left in the dark when it comes to protecting their citizens from terror threats. And if what he did was entirely appropriate then whats the outrage.[/QUOTE] I hope that if I ever commit some crime, you are my judge... Nesto: "Well, did you do it?" Me: "Nope" Nesto: "Ok, case closed, you heard the man..." You can't just assume the word coming from the accused party is true. All the same, you can't assume everything coming from another mouth is false...

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52236047]Nesto: Trump [B]could never fire Comey for the Russia investigation you people are stupid![/B] Trump two days later: I DID IT BECAUSE OF THE RUSSIA INVESTIGATION Nesto: "Trump would never share classified information" Trump two days later "I DID IT!" Every. Fucking. Time. You disturb the [B]fucking shit out of me.[/B][/QUOTE] He isn't trying to argue in support of the administration. He's only trying to justify his support of it. He'll use whatever excuse is most convenient at the time. He doesn't actually care what it is, only that it sounds somewhat plausible. He might not even realize he's doing it.

[QUOTE=Revenge282;52236074]I hope that if I ever commit some crime, you are my judge... Nesto: "Well, did you do it?" Me: "Nope" Nesto: "Ok, case closed, you heard the man..."[/QUOTE] Me: "Well, actually, yes. I did do it." Nesto: "Well, I'm sure you had a great reason! Next case."

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236058]I think trying to politicize the protection of innocents is pretty disturbing. Doesn't matter if its Russia or Canada, no one should be left in the dark when it comes to protecting their citizens from terror threats. And if what he did was entirely appropriate then whats the outrage.[/QUOTE] The leak was that what he told the Russians was enough to give away an intelligence source who's work wasn't shared with allies. The result of this has been and will likely continue to be allies no longer trusting that intelligence shared with the Americans will be kept confidential, which will reduce their effectiveness in defending against terrorism. This wasn't "tell the Russians or let civilians die" it was "maintain the ability to source and receive shared intelligence. Also, let's not pretend he did it to save civilian lives, this is Trump. He did it to brag about how much he knew.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52236066]That isn't what's happening though. "Politicize the protection of innocents"? Did you take a long drag from the Trump flesh pipe of "Unconvincing lies"? This is classified information that [B]YOUR ALLIES[/B] don't want you to share with Russia. Please, apologize more.[/QUOTE] And he didn't reveal the 3rd party info according to people there. So again, whats the issue.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236058]I think trying to politicize the protection of innocents is pretty disturbing. Doesn't matter if its Russia or Canada, no one should be left in the dark when it comes to protecting their citizens from terror threats. And if what he did was entirely appropriate then whats the outrage.[/QUOTE] here we can see the first set of goalposts launched into orbit

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52236088]And he didn't reveal the 3rd party info according to people there. So again, whats the issue.[/QUOTE] That the white house has routinely lied to cover things up only for Trump to confirm it the next day. They have no credibility. Leaks have consistently turned out to be true and the white house has consistently turned out to be wrong. It was independently verified by multiple news organisations so other people who know what was said* have said it did. Either way, someone is lying and when one party does so regularly and the other doesn't, it's pretty obvious who to trust.

[QUOTE=NeonpieDFTBA;52236086]The leak was that what he told the Russians was enough to give away an intelligence source who's work wasn't shared with allies. The result of this has been and will likely continue to be allies no longer trusting that intelligence shared with the Americans will be kept confidential, which will reduce their effectiveness in defending against terrorism. This wasn't "tell the Russians or let civilians die" it was "maintain the ability to source and receive shared intelligence. Also, let's not pretend he did it to save civilian lives, this is Trump. He did it to brag about how much he knew.[/QUOTE] not to mention that by McMaster's account Trump didn't even fucking know what he was revealing when he revealed it. Even if you think it was good that he did what he did, I don't know how you could possibly defend him doing it without actually understanding the consequences.

If I had to guess I would say the information has to do with a possible US informant in ISIS. One thing to keep in mind is that it wasn't just Russia that wasn't allowed to know, it was [I]anyone[/I] outside of US intelligence. If any other country knew about it, it would increase the chance of the information being leaked into the public domain even further, then someone's life could be at risk due to ISIS hearing about it and going after the spy. Because it's been indicated the information can be traced back to the source, it must be either about a localized area of ISIS or sensitive enough that only a few people would know about, meaning the US informant could be among the upper ranks of the ISIS command structure and was either with us the whole time, or has seen the writing on the wall and defected to us. This fits the criteria that the information would A) pertain to the Islamic State, B) be highly sensitive, warranting utmost secrecy on the source's identity, and C) be boastworthy in the eyes of Donald Trump. I can imagine the conversation went something like this: "We've put guys on the inside and we've got information, great information, on ISIS. Why just the other day one of them told me [I]bla bla bla.[/I]"

Nesto is a narrativist. You won't convince him because he perceives reality fundamentally different. The filter his brain employs is different from your or mines. In his mind, Trump is the god force, and there's not a thing in the world that will shake Nesto's reverence for trump. Doing so would require painful introspection on his part, and nesto just doesn't have it in him to do it.