Most Scots consider themselves 'Scottish only', census figures show - Polidicks

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;42321422]This is for holding the referendum, it doesn't actually say anything about the aftermath of one: They can hold it, but the Government isn't going to say "Oh so you voted for independence? We must give you it ASAP".[/QUOTE] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-determination[/url] The government can't say no.

[QUOTE=Fuxed;42321689]You're not even a Scot, Anglo-American! Independence or bust! In all seriousness, it's a silly thing, we don't have any major oil reserves (we sold most of the good stuff), any hopes Salmond has of kickstarting 'the knowledge based economy' are dashed by budget (You really think we're going to enter the Nordic banking zone?) and really, the attitude of most Scots are "who cares?". We're a county these days, not a country and most people couldn't give a shit. Give us a few more 'devolved rights' and 90% of the country will be happy.[/QUOTE] And that's why I'm not going to participate in the vote, despite being a citizen by birthright. I'll let you lot decide how your ships going to sink, and take no blame! It's a frankly ridiculous time to be putting this on the front burner, aren't there bigger issues for this nation to deal with like getting the torries out of government and an economy to recover?

[QUOTE=Bung Piece;42323394]And that's why I'm not going to participate in the vote, despite being a citizen by birthright. I'll let you lot decide how your ships going to sink, and take no blame! It's a frankly ridiculous time to be putting this on the front burner, aren't there bigger issues for this nation to deal with like getting the torries out of government and an economy to recover?[/QUOTE] A vote for independence is a vote to remove the tories.

I basically have to consider myself British, I'm half Welsh, nearly half English and a tiny bit Scottish, I just need Irish to complete the set.

[QUOTE=Sobotnik;42321422]This is for holding the referendum, it doesn't actually say anything about the aftermath of one: They can hold it, but the Government isn't going to say "Oh so you voted for independence? We must give you it ASAP". [editline]27th September 2013[/editline] And Pan-African identities exist as well. What's your point?[/QUOTE] You seriously think that if we voted for independence, the UK Government would just go "No you can't have it." That would be like, political suicide. More on topic, I feel that as a collective of England, Wales and Scotland, we are British, but individually we are Scottish. Maybe I'm just too firmly wedged on the fence.

Urgh all this Scotland wanting out of the UK is really starting to do my head in. I bet if we had a referendum to vote them out, they would all throw a hissy fit.

The difference between Scottish culture and English culture is that Scottish culture is to hate the English and English culture.

I just imagine Scotland to be exactly like the film Trainspotting.

[QUOTE=Lollipoopdeck;42323789]The difference between Scottish culture and English culture is that Scottish culture is to hate the English and English culture.[/QUOTE] what a load of shit

[QUOTE=Bad)-(and;42324220]what a load of shit[/QUOTE] I know right, he forgot the deep fried mars bars

So is Scotland like the UK's Texas or something?

[QUOTE=dingusnin;42323787]Urgh all this Scotland wanting out of the UK is really starting to do my head in. I bet if we had a referendum to vote them out, they would all throw a hissy fit.[/QUOTE] I'm Scottish and most English people I speak to don't really give a shit either way. That being said, I would like to see us gain more power over ourselves rather than full on Independance.

Well, their independence is imminient sooner or later, every country must fall apart sooner or later.

[QUOTE=Hellborg 45;42323656]You seriously think that if we voted for independence, the UK Government would just go "No you can't have it." That would be like, political suicide.[/QUOTE] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_devolution_referendum,_1979[/url] Just because people want something doesn't mean that a politician necessarily has to follow through with it. For starters, they are politicians.

[QUOTE=BrainDeath;42320159]there's no difference between 0 and 0[/QUOTE] Well actually there's an infinite distance between a number and itself.

What annoys me is that the Scottish independence campaign is almost solely based on hated of the English. Scotland has done far worse things to England than England has done to Scotland. Almost all the of the wars we fought with them they were the attacker because of the Auld Alliance, hell they almost even overthrew the Monarchy in the Jacobite rebellion, we thought so much of them as to adopt their crown after Elizabeth I died, we bailed them out after one of their disastrous colonial adventures went tits up. We even gave them their own parliament. Yet they still hate us, if you ask me the rest of us Britons have been really patient with Scotland.

[QUOTE=MelonGuy;42324207]I just imagine Scotland to be exactly like the film Trainspotting.[/QUOTE] It's a bit dated now but yeah pretty much.

[QUOTE=The mouse;42324598]What annoys me is that the Scottish independence campaign is almost solely based on hated of the English. Scotland has done far worse things to England than England has done to Scotland. Almost all the of the wars we fought with them they were the attacker because of the Auld Alliance, hell they almost even overthrew the Monarchy in the Jacobite rebellion, we thought so much of them as to adopt their crown after Elizabeth I died, we bailed them out after one of their disastrous colonial adventures went tits up. We even gave them their own parliament. Yet they still hate us, if you ask me the rest of us Britons have been really patient with Scotland.[/QUOTE] The Union with England pretty much allowed the both of them to industrialize and become (for about a century) the richest and most powerful country in the world with a vast Empire built upon blackmailing Indian and Chinese rulers.

[QUOTE=hypno-toad;42319649] Even the word "Scots" is probably derived from the Latin name "Scoti" so essentially whatever names the Romans gave are the ones that still remain.[/QUOTE] The Picts weren't called Scoti, the Romans called the Irish raiders Scoti that attacked Britain.

If Scotland gains independence, I think terms of identification would go from "Great Britain" to "Mediocre Britain"

As a Scottish person I do not see myself as Scottish and nothing else. I am proud to be a Scot but I'm also massively proud to be British.

[QUOTE=hypno-toad;42319649]British is a geographic designation, not necessarily a nationality or ethnicity. The islands were called Britannia/Brettaniai by the romans, the name stuck and people who live on the islands are part of the geographical region of Britain, and can loosely be referred to as British regardless of where they are from. Even the word "Scots" is probably derived from the Latin name "Scoti" so essentially whatever names the Romans gave are the ones that still remain.[/QUOTE] Scoti means Irish you twonk.

[QUOTE=Superkilll307;42327141]Scoti means Irish you twonk.[/QUOTE] It's still a pretty easy mistake to make.

British in social culture is always associated with England. Whenever someone is talking about Scotland, they will never refer to them as British. It's just one of those things you have to look past. of course, in real terms, Scotland is part of Britain. It's just never seen as part of it anywhere else. Now I should probably get out of this thread before someone calls Scottish people "English men with a dress".

Just a question to those who oppose Scottish independence, what reasons do you oppose it for?

[QUOTE=Superkilll307;42327559]Just a question to those who oppose Scottish independence, what reasons do you oppose it for?[/QUOTE] Scottish National identity is far too shallow to justify a different nation, the similarities between the majority of Scotland and the Majority of England are far greater than their differences. Both Countries Mutually benefit from Unity, arguably Scotland more-so. Scotland has been part of the United Kingdom for 300 Years, there's no reason why they should leave now.

[QUOTE=Superkilll307;42327559]Just a question to those who oppose Scottish independence, what reasons do you oppose it for?[/QUOTE] It'd just fuck with a lot of systems, and if you require independence to "save your identity", it probably isn't very strong to start with. Just saying though.

[QUOTE=The mouse;42327160]It's still a pretty easy mistake to make.[/QUOTE] The Irish celts created Scots and early Scottish culture. In fact Ireland went from a barbarian raiding society to a Christian one that saved Britain with technology, education, literature and religion - largely to the thanks of a Roman Briton aka St Patrick.

[QUOTE=The mouse;42327609]Scottish National identity is far too shallow to justify a different nation, the similarities between the majority of Scotland and the Majority of England are far greater than their differences. Both Countries Mutually benefit from Unity, arguably Scotland more-so. Scotland has been part of the United Kingdom for 300 Years, there's no reason why they should leave now.[/QUOTE] Arguably wouldn't a Country run by the Scots be more able to rekindle a national culture? Like how it would be more likely to fund cultural events and have a more invested interest in it than a centralised London Government?

I still think there needs to be more things cleared up with this whole debate, we haven't got the full picture from either side. It's like the Yes campaigners and the Better Together campaigners probably feel like they have the kind of fact that would make people instantly go on their side, but they are just too scared to play that card in case the other campaign is able to trump it. It'd just be nice if they gave us the full picture so we can actually make the decision for ourselves, rather than only being fed the information that benefits certain sides. I mean, I'm neither for or against it, and I'm probably still going to be this way on the referendum day because its the easy way of going about things, but it'd be nice to see something actually sway me over to one side.