China forces abortions for those pregnant with a second child, then sterilize
85 replies, posted
[QUOTE=AceOfDivine;35814436]While it might not be moral, I'm not surprised. China already has so many people, if they all started fucking without limits there wouldn't be enough place.[/QUOTE]
This is not the right way to deal with over population though.
Maybe if they improved their people's lives in general instead of treating them like shit, they wouldn't have an overpopulation issue.
It's been shown that families in first world countries(families that have a good life) have less children than in third world countries.
Letting their people emigrate would probably help too.
Over 1 billion people live in China, and people are surprised this is happening?
If only us Estonians started shagging like bunnies real soon... then just maybe we wouldn't become an extinct people.
China does have incredibly strict emigration control, the neighboring countries are even afraid that if emigration in China was eased, that they would get flooded with people.
Of course the country is going to over populate if hardly anyone is allowed to get out.
I really hate to be insensitive about this, but the ugly reality is that China would have a massive overpopulation problem incoming if they didn't set this policy.
I think that this is definitely, however, a painful way to go about it. I would rather see significant strides in providing birth control and have second children be prohibitively expensive to raise.
Eh not as bad as India
Mother of mercy
This shit is getting way out of hand
I think I would rather have abortions in place, I would feel less sorry about that then a huge overpopulation resulting in starvation.
This is some pretty hardcore shit but the unspoken fact is that the earth cannot sustain humanity if our numbers just continuously grow, even if we really tried to rely entirely on green energy.
Edit: Birth control may be a necessity one day if we want to survive.
[QUOTE=booster;35814445]Surely there must be some alternative way to do this?
Forcing abortion and sterilization sounds more like a last resort, get your shit together China.[/QUOTE]
its called education. Keep people busy with educated stuff and its proven that they wont reproduce like bunnies.
[editline]4th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Falchion;35820407]This is some pretty hardcore shit but the unspoken fact is that the earth cannot sustain humanity if our numbers just continuously grow, even if we really tried to rely entirely on green energy.
Edit: Birth control may be a necessity one day if we want to survive.[/QUOTE]
You just need an educated populace of you want a stable population, the problem is that these countries have very little interest in educating the masses and resort to stuff we see as barbaric. If it was actually necessary i might be inclined to submit that they are only doing whats needed, but thats simply not the case.
Odd, last I heard there were fines and social stigma, but nit enforced abortions. Seems questionable Esther it's official policy or some going too far beyond the policy.
Though I do believe this can be happening.
[QUOTE=wraithcat;35820584]Odd, last I heard there were fines and social stigma, but nit enforced abortions. Seems questionable Esther it's official policy or some going too far beyond the policy.
Though I do believe this can be happening.[/QUOTE]
I think it may be that the government has set some quotas over certain towns. If you go over that, then the town may be punished since it's the town's leadership that is supposed to inform and keep the number of birth's low. Because yes in majority of the cases it's extra fees and not freaking forced abort.
Yet another reminder that the state (in any country) should not exert control over the reproductive functions of women.
[QUOTE=Mattk50;35820445]its called education. Keep people busy with educated stuff and its proven that they wont reproduce like bunnies.
[editline]4th May 2012[/editline]
You just need an educated populace of you want a stable population, the problem is that these countries have very little interest in educating the masses and resort to stuff we see as barbaric. If it was actually necessary i might be inclined to submit that they are only doing whats needed, but thats simply not the case.[/QUOTE]
Proof? As far as I know there isn't any real consensus that education is responsible for lower average fertility rates. I think there are a lot of factors including culture and wealth.
[editline]4th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=JustExtreme;35820628]Yet another reminder that the state (in any country) should not exert control over the reproductive functions of women.[/QUOTE]
Is it alright to potentially kill millions and cause massive suffering by giving reproductive control to the people of China? I personally don't know how I feel, I lean back and forth between the two ends. However, this is a lot more than just civil rights or human rights, this is the wellbeing of an entire society that is at stake in China.
I feel that an authoritarian approach is uncalled for and that they should let women make up their own choices with the knowledge of the consequences like losing free schooling and university for their first child.
This is a extremely statist country though so I guess this approach is to be expected.
[QUOTE=JustExtreme;35820762]I feel that an authoritarian approach is uncalled for and that they should let women make up their own choices with the knowledge of the consequences like losing free schooling and university for their first child.
[/QUOTE]Losing these privileges will not help anyone as a poor and uneducated person is even bigger burden. You think that's going to stop anyone from having children? Funny.
I didn't say I thought it would stop them. Just that they should be able to decide for themselves.
[QUOTE=JustExtreme;35820762]I feel that an authoritarian approach is uncalled for and that they should let women make up their own choices with the knowledge of the consequences like losing free schooling and university for their first child.
This is a extremely statist country though so I guess this approach is to be expected.[/QUOTE]
The problem is the consequences aren't proportional to the amount of harm that having more than one child can cause.
[editline]4th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=JustExtreme;35820786]I didn't say I thought it would stop them. Just that they should be able to decide for themselves.[/QUOTE]
But the selfish decisions of a few could cause real suffering throughout the country. I don't know if individual liberty really applies when the consequences of the liberty is starvation for millions.
[QUOTE=Mattk50;35820445]its called education. Keep people busy with educated stuff and its proven that they wont reproduce like bunnies.
[editline]4th May 2012[/editline]
You just need an educated populace of you want a stable population, the problem is that these countries have very little interest in educating the masses and resort to stuff we see as barbaric. If it was actually necessary i might be inclined to submit that they are only doing whats needed, but thats simply not the case.[/QUOTE]
Then again, keeping 1,4 billion people educated and "stable" isn't easy. And it wont come cheap.
I remember hearing about this stuff years ago... China's not changed one bit in that regard. :\
[quote]Last month, a woman in the same region was forced to undergo an abortion while nine months pregnant, the organization reported. The baby was born alive, but then was drowned in a bucket, according to the organization. A photo of the infant's body floating in the bucket was circulated on Weibo, the Chinese version of Twitter, sparking widespread outrage.[/quote]
What the fuck? That is straight up murder.
[QUOTE=cardfan212;35814876]I'm 100% pro choice, but I would never ever find it acceptable to force abortions. That's why I'm pro [I]choice[/I].[/QUOTE]
Exactly, being pro-choice means believing in the right to choose. Forced abortions are horrific.
nobody realizes it's already overpopulated as fuck.
either they do this, if they don't they'll have to do worse shit to survive.
[QUOTE=lotusking;35821407]nobody realizes it's already overpopulated as fuck.
either they do this, if they don't they'll have to do worse shit to survive.[/QUOTE]
Like eat their dying relatives?
Is it me or does China not seem as packed as they consider it. I mean, it does have a high area of population density in the big cities, but so does every other big city in any other country.
[IMG]http://www.panasianbiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/china_population_density_map.jpg[/IMG]
It seems to me that they just need to focus on expansion out across evenly then build up similar to in Japan.
[QUOTE=Bredirish123;35822234]Is it me or does China not seem as packed as they consider it. I mean, it does have a high area of population density in the big cities, but so does every other big city in any other country.
[IMG]http://www.panasianbiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/china_population_density_map.jpg[/IMG]
It seems to me that they just need to focus on expansion out across evenly then build up similar to in Japan.[/QUOTE]
It's probably not that simple. I don't think it's just a matter of housing, but also of resources. As for why nobody is living in those parts of the map, perhaps there's environmental reasons.
[QUOTE=Bredirish123;35822234]Is it me or does China not seem as packed as they consider it. I mean, it does have a high area of population density in the big cities, but so does every other big city in any other country.
[IMG]http://www.panasianbiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/china_population_density_map.jpg[/IMG]
It seems to me that they just need to focus on expansion out across evenly then build up similar to in Japan.[/QUOTE]
Well I'm sure you've heard of the ghost cities. That's their attempts at expansion.
Well i agree that China should enforce certain limitations but forced abortion and sterilization is over the line.
[QUOTE=AceOfDivine;35814436]While it might not be moral, I'm not surprised. China already has so many people, if they all started fucking without limits there wouldn't be enough place.[/QUOTE]
What are you talking about? Everywhere except the east coast of China is extremely unpopulated. Their entire population is cammed into one area of the country. The only reason why they have to enact draconian policies like national birth control is because it wouldn't be profitable to expand of the coast.
Overpopulation is a myth, and I'm not sure why every body keeps buying into it. It's as if people WANT the world to be overpopulated. All of the supposed population problems. An be solved by more efficient use of space and resources. In nations with large populations, there is more than enough space to spread out and build new centers. Or, cities could be more compacted and built efficiently instead of constantly spilling out into the suburbs.
[editline]4th May 2012[/editline]
[QUOTE=Falchion;35820407]This is some pretty hardcore shit but the unspoken fact is that the earth cannot sustain humanity if our numbers just continuously grow, even if we really tried to rely entirely on green energy.
Edit: Birth control may be a necessity one day if we want to survive.[/QUOTE]
Proof? Can someone please actually give proof of this "overpopulation" and stop just claiming shit?
I know this breaches human rights and all, but what would the alternative be? Considerable over-population? Not saying it should still carry on, but the alternative isn't all that good either.
[QUOTE=LuckyLuke;35822949]I know this breaches human rights and all, but what would the alternative be? Considerable over-population? Not saying it should still carry on, but the alternative isn't all that good either.[/QUOTE]
Ignoring the fact that overpopulation is a myth:
Send the child out of the nation.
Send the family out of the nation.
Remove government benefits such as free education from the child.
Fine the family.
Confiscate the family's property.
Doing any of these things, while they are all pretty brutal and barbaric, are better than [b]forcing the woman to have an abortion and then sterilizing her[/b]. You think that that is the only solution? You are out of your mind.
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