• China forces abortions for those pregnant with a second child, then sterilize
    85 replies, posted
This is really bad and I don't agree with any of what the government are doing, but I can't help wonder why they had a second child if they knew the law and the consequences of it?
[QUOTE=King Tiger;35823050]Ignoring the fact that overpopulation is a myth: Send the child out of the nation. Send the family out of the nation. Remove government benefits such as free education from the child. Fine the family. Confiscate the family's property. Doing any of these things, while they are all pretty brutal and barbaric, are better than [b]forcing the woman to have an abortion and then sterilizing her[/b]. You think that that is the only solution? You are out of your mind.[/QUOTE] A poor uneducated child is worse than no child. From government's point of view
[QUOTE=Bredirish123;35822234]Is it me or does China not seem as packed as they consider it. I mean, it does have a high area of population density in the big cities, but so does every other big city in any other country. [IMG]http://www.panasianbiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/china_population_density_map.jpg[/IMG] It seems to me that they just need to focus on expansion out across evenly then build up similar to in Japan.[/QUOTE] You do realize that the low density is because that is one huge fucking desert?
[QUOTE=AceOfDivine;35823140]A poor uneducated child is worse than no child. From government's point of view[/QUOTE] That may be true and it may be beneficial to China, but the fact is that the government has no right to tell you how to have children or how many you can have. [editline]4th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=martijnp3000;35823149]You do realize that the low density is because that is one huge fucking desert?[/QUOTE] Not true. Only the sections labeled "uninhabited" are actually desert.
[QUOTE=King Tiger;35823188]That may be true and it may be beneficial to China, but the fact is that the government has no right to tell you how to have children or how many you can have. [/QUOTE] Maybe YOUR government can't, but chinese can.
[QUOTE=AceOfDivine;35823387]Maybe YOUR government can't, but chinese can.[/QUOTE] The Chinese government is breaching their rights then.
[QUOTE=King Tiger;35823932]The Chinese government is breaching their rights then.[/QUOTE] But in China there is no such thing as human rights, so technically they're not breaching anything.
Also, emigration is illegal in China without a government permit. If they were to solve the overpopulation problems without violating human rights, then they would probably have to legalize emigration, but there is no guarantee that emigration will keep the population in check alone.
[QUOTE=UnknownDude;35825760]Also, emigration is illegal in China without a government permit. If they were to solve the overpopulation problems without violating human rights, then they would probably have to legalize emigration, but there is no guarantee that emigration will keep the population in check alone.[/QUOTE] Given the dictatorial powers of the government, why won't they simply move the population themselves around?
[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;35825812]Given the dictatorial powers of the government, why won't they simply move the population themselves around?[/QUOTE] That requires a lot of administrative energy. Even for a country with as much central power as China, the sheer multitude of people that need to be moved is quite staggering. [editline]4th May 2012[/editline] Also: China is trying to populate the western half of the country more. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Western_Development[/url]
[QUOTE=yawmwen;35825845]That requires a lot of administrative energy. Even for a country with as much central power as China, the sheer multitude of people that need to be moved is quite staggering. [editline]4th May 2012[/editline] Also: China is trying to populate the western half of the country more. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Western_Development[/url][/QUOTE] Well I wouldn't think they would do it all at once or do it for the entire nation at once. Probably certain extreme regions over a period of time. Their population is growing fast, but not fast enough to need to move everyone right this moment. A few years at a time could probably help. Actually, your link gave a small note on why they probably don't let people emigrate that much - "and retention of talent flowing to richer provinces". Essentially, I'm guessing they want to keep educated people where they're at so they increase the development of where they are, instead of looking for opportunity elsewhere.
[QUOTE=Bredirish123;35822234]Is it me or does China not seem as packed as they consider it. I mean, it does have a high area of population density in the big cities, but so does every other big city in any other country. [IMG]http://www.panasianbiz.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/china_population_density_map.jpg[/IMG] It seems to me that they just need to focus on expansion out across evenly then build up similar to in Japan.[/QUOTE]Not quite that simple. For one, a lot of the area marked as uninhabited is the Taklamakan Desert.
sometimes the [i]right[/i] choice is not the [i]good[/i] choice
[QUOTE=Ryuken;35826099]sometimes the [i]right[/i] choice is not the [i]good[/i] choice[/QUOTE] If the only choice is the bad one then make no decision at all.
I know it's against human right and seems cruel, but it's also necessary. A country with such a huge population needs to do such actions or things would go out of control.
[QUOTE=Garik;35826203]If the only choice is the bad one then make no decision at all.[/QUOTE] what happens when you do nothing instead of turning to a side at a crossroad while driving? you crash
[QUOTE=xXDictatorXx;35821260]What the fuck? That is straight up murder. Exactly, being pro-choice means believing in the right to choose. Forced abortions are horrific.[/QUOTE] That actually seems like it was done by the community more than authorities. Might have been a girl. If you look at rural India, the place is absolutely full of that. To a level where the government is actually trying to stop it.
[QUOTE=Electrocuter;35815996] Maybe if they improved their people's lives in general instead of treating them like shit, they wouldn't have an overpopulation issue. It's been shown that families in first world countries(families that have a good life) have less children than in third world countries. Letting their people emigrate would probably help too.[/QUOTE] Why take on the time and money burden of a child when your living conditions are so shit? What's the logic? People are too busy with their own interests to care for the big picture, especially in such a culture as China's. Forcing seems the best bet for the vague idea of a greater good.
[QUOTE=Ryuken;35826826]what happens when you do nothing instead of turning to a side at a crossroad while driving? you crash[/QUOTE] That analogy doesn't apply because h said that when there are only bad options you do nothing while turning at a crossroad is not a bad option.
China is setting itself up for a biblical population crash between this and the 'drowning newborn girls because they're undesirable' thing.
[QUOTE=Badunkadunk;35828522]Why take on the time and money burden of a child when your living conditions are so shit? What's the logic? People are too busy with their own interests to care for the big picture, especially in such a culture as China's. Forcing seems the best bet for the vague idea of a greater good.[/QUOTE] Personally, I'd rather want to have a family for myself before I care about the fate of the state.
[IMG]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3452/3394609774_771a776789_z.jpg?zz=1[/IMG] If Dr. Breen ever taught us anything; suppression fields is the most effective way to stop procreation.
[QUOTE=AceOfDivine;35814436]While it might not be moral, I'm not surprised. China already has so many people, if they all started fucking without limits there wouldn't be enough place.[/QUOTE] Thats bullshit, the world is far from overpopulated and China's population growth is plateauing as the economy grows. Soon the population will go down anyway. [editline]5th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=Falchion;35820407]This is some pretty hardcore shit but the unspoken fact is that the earth cannot sustain humanity if our numbers just continuously grow, even if we really tried to rely entirely on green energy. Edit: Birth control may be a necessity one day if we want to survive.[/QUOTE] The earth can sustain humanity, its called women's rights and economic development. Why is it that there are no concerns about population growth in developed nations? Its because there is no need for large amounts of people. As China and India develop, we get rid of all population problems. Of course we should probably help them by giving up the hypocritical ideals of free trade. [editline]5th May 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=deathstarboot;35815704]I'm glad we have China to look at so we can avoid being China.[/QUOTE] Yeah instead of fucking our own people over we just fuck the Middle-East over, woo! The US is better with human rights, but the fact the healthcare, abortion, gay rights, and foreign policy are so heavily contested is laughable. Decades of fucking over the arabs, the latin americans, and the africans is far from an impeccable human rights record. Of course China is bad too with this stuff, but don't act like the West is so hot either.
[QUOTE=Earthen;35832198]Thats bullshit, the world is far from overpopulated and China's population growth is plateauing as the economy grows. Soon the population will go down anyway. [/QUOTE] But china is not the size of a world
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