Porn and video game addiction are leading to 'masculinity crisis', says Stanford prison experiment p

[masterbateman]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703263]I don't understand how that's related to masculinity though.[/QUOTE]

because their attitude assumes that it's wrong or degrading for a man to raise a child rather than work

[editline]11th May 2015[/editline]

and conversely that it's wrong and degrading for a woman to work rather than raise a child

[MuffinZerg]

[QUOTE=bdd458;47703199]Seriously, fuck this guy. That's not why there's a "Crisis of Masculinity".

There's a crisis of masculinity due to our society's flawed view of men and how men are supposed to act; suppressing emotions, 'manning up', that sort of thing. Our view of masculinity is harmful to boys growing up, adult men, and yes even women. A good example of this is the John Oliver bit on Paid Family Leave that was posted in the Videos section. In it, two sports casters berated a Baseball Player for daring to take his [I]measly 3 days [/I]of family leave to be with his new born son instead of playing Baseball, saying that baseball is more important than being a father. Shit like that is the real crisis of masculinity.[/QUOTE]

Sorry to tell you that, but you are playing the radical feminist [b]"society is wrong, not I need to work on my life"[/b] card.
Our view of masculinity is not harmful. It has been proven by history. Society expects you to make decisions, contorl your life and emotions, looking for your place in life and socialising. Society expects you to stand up to difficulties. Society expects you to work hard. Do you see anything wrong with these expectations?
Personally I don't. Feminists have a point because women are not expected to have the same traits, society's expectations of them are actually harmful. But men? Hell, you have nothing to complain about.
Nobody wants you to suppress emotions. Hell, all the male stars are emotional. Society expects you to not act dumb based only on your emotions - yeah. But that's useful for becoming anything worthwhile.
If you don't like what society is telling you - just be yourself. Ironically society respects men that defy laws of society.

I mean read a biography of any succesful male of the past. These "harmful expectations" you listed are exactly what brought these people success, power, happiness.

Take Bengamin Franklin for example. He never was a "super macho" guy that intimidates everyone arround. Instead he promoted humblness, acceptance, give before you take, listen before you speak, being friendly and avoid angering others. And expectations played a much bigger role back then in 1730.

[DELL]

[QUOTE=froztshock;47703306][i][b]NOW THAT'S EDGY[/b][/i]!
[/QUOTE]
How is that edgy? You have no idea who I am and I'm assuming think I'm kidding.
I will never understand the human creatures.

[highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitposting / creep" - Big Dumb American))[/highlight]

[Lium]

I don't understand where the lack of masculinity supposedly comes in. Playing video games is not manly or something now?

[MuffinZerg]

[QUOTE=Lium;47703366]I don't understand where the lack of masculinity supposedly comes in. Playing video games is not manly or something now?[/QUOTE]

I guess it's this part:
[quote]He said: "Our focus is on young men who play video games to excess, and do it in [b]social isolation[/b] - they are alone in their room."[/quote]

[Awesomecaek]

[QUOTE=bdd458;47703199]Seriously, fuck this guy. That's not why there's a "Crisis of Masculinity".

There's a crisis of masculinity due to our society's flawed view of men and how men are supposed to act; suppressing emotions, 'manning up', that sort of thing. Our view of masculinity is harmful to boys growing up, adult men, and yes even women. A good example of this is the John Oliver bit on Paid Family Leave that was posted in the Videos section. In it, two sports casters berated a Baseball Player for daring to take his [I]measly 3 days [/I]of family leave to be with his new born son instead of playing Baseball, saying that baseball is more important than being a father. Shit like that is the real crisis of masculinity.[/QUOTE]

You are absolutely right but the problem is that videogames and porn are making this worse as well.

[I]Most[/I] games still paint men as dudebro toughguy beefcakes, just like most porn, which also greatly paints women as some kind of alien organism that requires very special cunning handling for successful interaction. Excessive porn overuse damages people's idea of self worth, of what their bodies should be like and most damage is done to their idea of what sex should be like. So, if even despite of their damaged social understanding they still manage to have sex, it's often very confusing and unsatisfactory to both them and the other party.

I am in no way advocating banning of games or porn with any specific themes in either, but people who spend overwhelming portion of their time doing nothing but playing games and looking at porn, without opportunity to stay connected to reality and to discover it, are really facing heavy damage to their person.

[itisjuly]

[QUOTE=Lium;47703366]I don't understand where the lack of masculinity supposedly comes in. Playing video games is not manly or something now?[/QUOTE]
Excessive video gaming while alone is a way to escape supposedly harsh realities. It hinders your social development.

[MuffinZerg]

Also do you guys believe this is actually normal?
[quote]He cited the example of a mother he met while conducting the study whose son does not see the problem in playing video games for up to 15 hours a day[/quote]

I would say anyone that plays games 15 hours a day has a crisis. Maybe not of masculinity, but of life for sure. If someone has absolutely nothing better or more important to do than he has serious problems.

[masterbateman]

[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;47703358]Sorry to tell you that, but you are playing the radical feminist [b]"society is wrong, not I need to work on my life"[/b] card.
Our view of masculinity is not harmful. It has been proven by history. Society expects you to make decisions, contorl your life and emotions, looking for your place in life and socialising. Society expects you to stand up to difficulties. Society expects you to work hard. Do you see anything wrong with these expectations?
[/QUOTE]

so why should social expectations vary depending on gender? don't women overcome difficulties too? don't they have to work hard for the same things as men? how can we justify special treatment when men and women are mentally and emotionally capable of the same things?

[MarkG06]

[QUOTE=mentalmoustache;47703243]Of course the study only looks at casual players[/QUOTE]

Well of course, only a casual would step away from the computer.

[MuffinZerg]

[QUOTE=masterbateman;47703393]so why should social expectations vary depending on gender? don't women overcome difficulties too? don't they have to work hard for the same things as men? how can we justify special treatment when men and women are mentally and emotionally capable of the same things?[/QUOTE]

Thats a different debate. But on current topic - gender equality doesn't mean you can say "society is wrong" and barricade yourself in your basement and never get out and be sure that you are living the right way.

[MR-X]

If you read and watch the whole thing he does make some really good points and does have some valid arguments. It does not need to be disregarded because "Well i play games an im normal."

Guys are often punished for being guys - In school if you're to hyper or active you're going to be medicated. So you're not allowed to just be yourself - in a way your forced to conform to institutional norms. If you fight you're expelled, regardless of why or who it started.

Schools per say don't do anything innovative to teach therefor you're in a static environment and you get bored. Boredom leads inattentiveness, thus leads to lower grades.

Social interaction is important because you learn body/facial queues that you can easily determine appropriate responses. People (specially younger boys/men) who play video games are isolated and don't get that same interaction. Ie can lead to awkwardness because you don't know socialize or you're afraid that you will fuck up. I think everyone has social anxiety, nobody likes be rejected.

[itisjuly]

[QUOTE=masterbateman;47703393]so why should social expectations vary depending on gender? don't women overcome difficulties too? don't they have to work hard for the same things as men? how can we justify special treatment when men and women are mentally and emotionally capable of the same things?[/QUOTE]I would argue many healthy women are not as capable of controlling their emotions due to hormones. I'm not saying they're completely unable or anything ridiculous but it's much harder for them to control emotions compared to men.

[MuffinZerg]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703411]I would argue many healthy women are not as capable of controlling their emotions due to hormones. I'm not saying they're completely unable or anything ridiculous but it's much harder for them to control emotions compared to men.[/QUOTE]

Not to mention that the ways male and female bodies and brains function [i]generally[/i] differ a lot.

[.𓃉𓁿𓂎𓁿𓃉.]

ubiquitous porn and video games are both such revolutionary concepts that its going to take a few generations for all the psychological and social kinks to get worked out

[Thlis]

I was hoping this would be on the feeling of inadequacy when males are constantly bombarded with depictions of ultra competent or ultra attractive males or the issue of suppressed emotion.

But nope, just a guy saying video games are bad and giving a straw man argument.

[itisjuly]

[QUOTE=MR-X;47703406]I think everyone has social anxiety, nobody likes be rejected.[/QUOTE]
The best way to overcome it is by socializing. If you're alone all day every day, your life will be horrible.

[.𓃉𓁿𓂎𓁿𓃉.]

eventually, both will be fully encapsulated into societal expectations and social norms, but for now its kind of "ahh what do we do with this??"

[27X]

[QUOTE=DChapsfield;47703245]the Stanford prison experiment was some highly wack shit. i don't feel it adds any credibility to his thesis. it was a test that ran completely off-rails and nearly killed a couple people. crazy but informative research[/QUOTE]

This. He has a pretty long history of forming a biased thesis before he even gets to the research stage.

[quote] points [/quote]

His issue stem more from the effects and he's skating over the rather obvious causal basis for this behavior manifesting in the first place, the study also immediately vectored that people with manifested symptoms didn't have those symptoms present before engaging in the behavior; that's simply biased and not remotely objective.

[HumanAbyss]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703411]I would argue many healthy women are not as capable of controlling their emotions due to hormones. I'm not saying they're completely unable or anything ridiculous but it's much harder for them to control emotions compared to men.[/QUOTE]

So there we have another judgement against men that is discriminatory.

Men HAVE to be in control of their emotions and can't let them get out of control, lest people make the connection as you're so close to doing here, that men who can't control their emotions are closer to being women then men.

[ironman17]

[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;47703392]Also do you guys believe this is actually normal?

I would say anyone that plays games 15 hours a day has a crisis. Maybe not of masculinity, but of life for sure. If someone has absolutely nothing better or more important to do than he has serious problems.[/QUOTE]
Well, not everyone. If it's 15 hours on average it's likely a "crisis", but if it's on the weekend then it's probably someone going ham on the weekends, maybe playing the hell out of Xenoblade Chronicles/Dragon Age: Origins or pulling an all-nighter with Civ 5 (c'mon, we've all been there). Or hell, maybe it's a golden gamer/silver surfer kind of deal, where someone has retired and is enjoying life by sinking their retirement time into all those games they didn't have the time to play while they worked 9 to 5 at their desk job?

[itisjuly]

[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;47703434]eventually, both will be fully encapsulated into societal expectations and social norms, but for now its kind of "ahh what do we do with this??"[/QUOTE]
Watching excessive porn and excessive gaming will be a social expectation? That's a sad future.

[HumanAbyss]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703444]Watching excessive porn and excessive gaming will be a social expectation? That's a sad future.[/QUOTE]

Why? Why would it be "excessive" by default?

I play games. I watch porn. I also have a girlfriend of 5 years. I'm socially competent but I like my personal time. Is that sad? I don't see how that's sad.

[Take_Opal]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703263]I don't understand how that's related to masculinity though.[/QUOTE]

Extremely. No one questions a mother taking leave, if a man want's to not perform his duty in order to indulge in something perhaps a bit more maternal than hit-stick he's questioned, criticized as a pansy. This happens in so many facets of life to men, and it creates this terribly toxic psychic-space to develop human beings in.

[itisjuly]

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47703440]So there we have another judgement against men that is discriminatory.

Men HAVE to be in control of their emotions and can't let them get out of control, lest people make the connection as you're so close to doing here, that men who can't control their emotions are closer to being women then men.[/QUOTE]Is that wrong though? Men do not have periods, so if they can't control their emotions there is something wrong. Otherwise it makes no sense as to why they're like that. Being in control of their emotions is a great ability but women get a pass because of their bodies, men don't because they do not have the chemistry. Why should men be given a leeway then?

[Take_Opal]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703430]The best way to overcome it is by socializing. If you're alone all day every day, your life will be horrible.[/QUOTE]

There will always be fear of rejection dude, it's human. Sure, you can possibly avoid becoming emotionally stunted and crippled for it, but rejection hurts anyone who wants enough.

[MuffinZerg]

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47703440]So there we have another judgement against men that is discriminatory.

Men HAVE to be in control of their emotions and can't let them get out of control, lest people make the connection as you're so close to doing here, that men who can't control their emotions are closer to being women then men.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, it's people HAVE to be in control if their emotions.

You are getting it backwards. On average more women can't control their emotions due to biology. So after a few centuries society is hardwired to associate lack of emotional control with women.

But the standard is not unique to men, it's not to punish men or anything. The standard applies to both men and women. Everyone is expected to control their emotions because lack of control is dangerous for everyone around.
You wouldn't trust a woman that has no control over her emotions even though women are more expected to have that trait.

[itisjuly]

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47703451]Why? Why would it be "excessive" by default?

I play games. I watch porn. I also have a girlfriend of 5 years. I'm socially competent but I like my personal time. Is that sad? I don't see how that's sad.[/QUOTE]
15 hours a day is excessive.

[Hotline]

[QUOTE=itisjuly;47703430]The best way to overcome it is by socializing. If you're alone all day every day, your life will be horrible.[/QUOTE]

i was a shut in for most of my childhood and had trouble even making small talk with a person, but getting a job and making more of an effort to talk to people has helped me to greatly overcome that in just a couple years. i think the problem is that for some people even getting to that point is a struggle because they spend too much time always away from others, and don't pursue any outside ventures.

[MuffinZerg]

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;47703451]Why? Why would it be "excessive" by default?

I play games. I watch porn. I also have a girlfriend of 5 years. I'm socially competent but I like my personal time. Is that sad? I don't see how that's sad.[/QUOTE]

Nobody says you shouldnt like games or should never watch porn. It's just that too much of it is dangerous. Just like if you watched TV for 10 hours you would be fucked.