China reportedly issues new warning over North Korean nuclear production
71 replies, posted
Actually, the US developed 155mm and 203mm nuclear artillery shells in the late 50s that could be fired from standard artillery guns. It did however required considerable physics package testing which clearly the Norks haven't done.
Why does everyone forget we have nuclear missile defenses. They could never get enough missiles to overcome those.
So even if they did manage to get them off, we'd take them down and level the country.
[QUOTE=Rastadogg;47595077]Why does everyone forget we have nuclear missile defenses. They could never get enough missiles to overcome those.
So even if they did manage to get them off, we'd take them down and level the country.[/QUOTE]
Actually, the US doesn't have 360 degree or even defence from North Korean missiles.
This is a pretty common misconception.
The US only has midpoint and terminal missile defence. The midpoint in Alaska and won't stop missiles coming from Korea and the terminal missile defence only exists on naval ships and Army Patriot batteries. The Army Patriot batteries however don't count because they can only destroy short range ballistic missiles.
[QUOTE=download;47595103]Actually, the US doesn't have 360 degree or even defence from North Korean missiles.
This is a pretty common misconception.
The US only has midpoint and terminal missile defence. The midpoint in Alaska and won't stop missiles coming from Korea and the terminal missile defence only exists on naval ships and Army Patriot batteries. The Army Patriot batteries however don't count because they can only destroy short range ballistic missiles.[/QUOTE]
they don't have the missile capability though, they have mid to small range balistic missiles which are copies of the scud and topol, but not ICMB range weapons, and certainly not ones that can carry a nuclear warhead. any strike from NK would be at its neighbors, South Korea, Japan, or even China because they can't actually reach the US (yet)
[QUOTE=download;47581778]No it wouldn't.
Sure, depending on target selection, millions would die, but it's not a good chunk of the rest of the world.[/QUOTE]
That's not accounting for the raw ecological damage caused by the detonation of multiple nuclear warheads (both those launched/dropped/detonated by North Korea, and those fired in response if at all).
Radioactive rain is massively destructive (more commonly referred to as "rainout") and has the potential to cost billions on ecological damage and cleanup, and who knows where all of the radiation would go. It's all down to the way the wind blows.
[editline]25th April 2015[/editline]
Hell, all Chernobyl did was blow the dome on the reactor, and that spread radiation across the entirety of Europe. I don't even want to think about how far the radiation from multiple warhead detonations would spread.
[QUOTE=ewitwins;47595745]That's not accounting for the raw ecological damage caused by the detonation of multiple nuclear warheads (both those launched/dropped/detonated by North Korea, and those fired in response if at all).
Radioactive rain is massively destructive (more commonly referred to as "rainout") and has the potential to cost billions on ecological damage and cleanup, and who knows where all of the radiation would go. It's all down to the way the wind blows.
[editline]25th April 2015[/editline]
Hell, all Chernobyl did was blow the dome on the reactor, and that spread radiation across the entirety of Europe. I don't even want to think about how far the radiation from multiple warhead detonations would spread.[/QUOTE]
I expect Chernobyl was far worse than many nuclear detonations just because of the sheer mass of the material involved and because it wasn't fully "burnt" (in the nuclear sense that is).
Hell, the Soviets and the US both detonated hundreds of warheads above ground over a span of 15 years or so and while noticeable it didn't have major regional effects.
[QUOTE=download;47594792]Except, all of their arty does sit at the DMZ and it's nearly all >200mm stuff as well. Mix that in with chemical weapons which we know the Norks have tonnes of and it would be very unpleasent.
Sheer numbers do matter when the Norks a very large number of aircraft even if they are outdated behind them. Drones also mean squat against any military that can field electronic warfare aircraft.
If the Norks invaded and the US didn't use tactical nuclear weapons they would probably take half of South Korea before the US got its ass in gear and brought over troops from the US.[/QUOTE]
It sits on the DMZ where our we have half the SK military sitting at all times. They would not have any chance to 'level' Seoul before their own arty is bombed into oblivion.
North Korean airforce is a joke. Yes, they have some sturdy and reliable planes. No, they don't have anything that can stand up to American and South Korean jet fighters. Their AWA is useless when they have no chance at all of attaining air superiority. They're facing a very modernized and well supplied air force (SK) and the strongest one on the planet.
You're pretending like South Korea doesn't have a very capable military of its own, or a highly defended border, or as if they aren't prepared to defend the border, of as if the US doesn't have men stationed there, or as if the US doesn't have a carrier fleet on standby in the area at all times, or as if other US allies like Japan would not be participating, or as if the US will take days to organize any real response.
[QUOTE=CrossTownNews;47594850]They have tunnels and other things to conceal such stuff.
Also chemical weapons.
As for those concerned?
This is a nation with a long history (Korea in general) that's been invaded by one nation or another though the ages. This makes a paranoid strain with in their psyche. Add that the N Koreans don't have a proper medical infrastructure and have report s of using meth for almost all ailments and you got a very paranoid popopulace
Also sure an outdated airforce (correct me if I am wrong) but wooden biplanes don't show up on radar.[/QUOTE]
Congrats they have tunnels. How does that effect their artillery capability? The south has tunnels too, and spies, and get tons of defectors every year. Why does everyone always just talk about the North's strengths as if the South has nothing? Also, we invented this thing called chemical gear.
The populace is rapidly westernizing from their access to a black market and have already begun to lose touch with their regime. The people of North Korea aren't nearly as brainwashed as they were 10, 20 years ago.
Remember when there was a huge threat that they would launch a year or two ago?
What ended up happening was that there were several AMS airdropped in or set up in japan and SK.
There's probably a radar and a lot of AMS left surrounding the korean borders right now, it's all fine.
[QUOTE=LTJGPliskin;47581948]China is their ally. If someone went and nuked Canada, we'd go to war with them, yeah? The same mindset goes for China and the DPRK.[/QUOTE]
China themselves have said that if North Korea is the first one to strike then China isn't helping them.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;47605399]It sits on the DMZ where our we have half the SK military sitting at all times. They would not have any chance to 'level' Seoul before their own arty is bombed into oblivion.[/quote]
No military can push a button and have the enemy's artillery disappear; it takes time. The time in question is expected to be at around 2-3% of NKs artillery per hour. In those days it takes to destroy NKs artillery capability their tens of thousands of artillery guns would be able to fire hundreds of thousands or millions of shells before being destroyed as a fighting force. Many of those shell could be filled with Sarin or GB.
[quote]
North Korean airforce is a joke. Yes, they have some sturdy and reliable planes. No, they don't have anything that can stand up to American and South Korean jet fighters. Their AWA is useless when they have no chance at all of attaining air superiority. They're facing a very modernized and well supplied air force (SK) and the strongest one on the planet.
[/quote]
It all depends on South Korea's reactions times. I wouldn't put it past the South to have gotten lax following the end of the Cold War like most other Western militaries. Those aircraft mean nothing if they're destroyed on the ground either through a ground attack or a very fast air attack.
[quote]
You're pretending like South Korea doesn't have a very capable military of its own, or a highly defended border, or as if they aren't prepared to defend the border, of as if the US doesn't have men stationed there, or as if the US doesn't have a carrier fleet on standby in the area at all times, or as if other US allies like Japan would not be participating, or as if the US will take days to organize any real response.
[/QUOTE]
A US carrier fleet by itself can't stop a few million people. The US at the very least would have to deploy 4 or 5 fleets to provide the necessary support for ground operations in Korea.
There is also a massive numbers gap involved and that is before they pull out reserves. 1.2m people plus 6m reserves vs 600k and 2.9m reserves. Presumably if they attacked they would call up reserves, something that South Korea would struggle to do in an attack as it takes time (do they even have enough weapons for all their reserves?).
Even the US/SK joint operation plan [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OPLAN_5027]OPLAN 5027[/url] thinks that losing Soeul is possible. Though of course the exact details of the plan are classified.
[editline]27th April 2015[/editline]
[url]http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/oplan-5027-1.htm[/url]
Here they discuss OPLAN 5027 in detail.
[QUOTE=ThePinkPanzer;47605399]
The populace is rapidly westernizing from their access to a black market and have already begun to lose touch with their regime. The people of North Korea aren't nearly as brainwashed as they were 10, 20 years ago.[/QUOTE]
i remember reading something that there's like a dozen factories in southern china turning out these hybrid DVD player thingies by the millions, and basically they're a portable DVD player that reads USB,flash, and recieves AM/FM and TV signals. the thing is, NK imports a few thousand of these each year for official distribution, but the factories are churning out millions of them, and because they're both dvd player and can read from a stick, people put in an official kim documentary in the drive, but then put the interview in the USB port, so if they are inspected, they only see the disk in the drive and the stick is tucked away somewhere else
what if they made metal gears
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