E3 Audience Offended By "Rape Joke" At Microsoft Xbox One Event
325 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Bradyns;40995868]Given the current climate of sexism in gaming, how can you fuck up this monumentally?![/QUOTE]
Microsoft doesn't seem to pay attention to gaming trends or movements. The whole DRM thing and such proves it.
[QUOTE=JohnnyOnFlame;41002124]Oh boy its like the dongle jokes all over again.[/QUOTE]
You do realize that firing was more of a "straw that broke the camels back" kind of thing? He'd been disciplined for being a knucklehead before, many times. He did it again, and the boss said "That's it. You're out."
Well, guess you hear what you want to hear.
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;41002594]but what a lot of this argument has been about is how people should self censor themselves to not offend people, full well with the knowledge that what offends people is unique to each person. But for some reason no one realizes or seems to care that this hasn't been about context and has really only been about the words which are meaningless.
Equality in this situation is what? He says a gender neutral phrase as trash talk? And someone would still find a fault with it because at some level everything can be called offensive.[/QUOTE]
This is a different case, though, because there was pretty much a general backlash to the player's comments. Again, this wasn't a fringe group complaining - besides the radfems, liberal fems, and survivors, it was also developers, the media, allies, and gamers. When the language becomes arbitrary, that's different. When there's a general consensus that the context seemed creepy, there should be more of a room for concern.
Tackling rape culture within gaming has been a long process anyway, it isn't like this is the first exposure to it. Teabagging and Down But Not Out are two of the biggest examples on Xbox alone. I don't think people would be as upset about the comment if there wasn't already this pre-existing tendency towards using rape/rape-related comments during trash talk.
I think overall, though, most people know that rape culture is imbedded within gaming and has got to go in order to create a better environment for gamers. I'd rather censor myself and assure my friends feel comfortable around me than use trash talk that causes them to feel triggered for the whole entire evening while they were trying to relax. Then again, we wouldn't be friends if I wanted to use that kind of trash talk in the first place :v:.
At some level anything can be offensive, but there's a difference between fringe people offended and groups offended. Another example is the Wii U Fit girl in the new Smash Brothers. Someone on tumblr complained her inclusion was fat shaming and racist because she's white. Now, that's pretty ridiculous and makes no sense - they were still offended though. Of course, there's been no backlash from the body-positive community, POC community, or anyone else. That's the difference between a case like that, and a situation where you even have allies coming out of the woodwork and panning Microsoft.
I think the equality in this case, though, is the ability to host a trash talk session without any references that could be perceived as something part of rape culture. Which means the phrase he said has go to go. There's a million other things he could've said which don't sound triggering or aren't stereotypical of rape culture, anyway. "You're getting owned," "You're going down," "Oh geez wow that's some bad third-degree burns," "You know I'm going to record this beatdown right?" etc. I mean, if commentators on Kotaku can respond to Hernandez's new article and say "Yes, that phrase is commonly uttered within rape," certainly it should've dawned on the guy's head that he had to pick choice words to say :v:.
Whenever anyone ever talks about anything that can even remotely be associated with infidelity I shut right the fuck down so I understand all of the damage this rapey stuff does.
Not damaging someone is more important than a lot of other things, and even otherwise inconsequental jokes like that guy made can hurt someone.
You shouldn't have to grow thicker skin, the world should be softer to the touch.
[QUOTE=U.S.S.R;41006753]
Not damaging someone is more important than a lot of other things, and even otherwise inconsequental jokes like that guy made can hurt someone.
You shouldn't have to grow thicker skin, the world should be softer to the touch.[/QUOTE]
Exactly. These sort of comments can make people relive their whole entire rape experience all over again. And trauma triggers are already a huge part of their life; the least society can do is learn to respect rape victims. Hell, so many people don't even know what a "trauma trigger" is, let alone what sort of things constitute as triggers (it can literally be anything, from dates to statements to places to times of the day).
We're literally willing to let people suffer just to impose the status quo.
[editline]12th June 2013[/editline]
Also sidenote, since Deep's rates keep reminding me - I actually had a roommate whose name was "Deep." I didn't even know it was an actual first name until I met him. He was a cool guy, but kinda felt the same way about these issues as the rest of Facepunch.
How exactly is this a rape joke???
[QUOTE=Looter;41007490]How exactly is this a rape joke???[/QUOTE]
Some people are so fragile they should be locked in rooms made of bubblewrap and pillows listening to soothing ocean music.
Anything less is triggering and causes them to become angry and offended with everything they see, hear, touch or smell.
Such is life in this crappy, messed up world. How weak as a species we've become :(
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41002655]I don't think it was a rape joke but other people do and understanding that is called empathy. Not to cause cross-thread drama but considering I see you in every Sarkeesian thread arguing against her Kickstarter and the people who support it, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you maybe don't have the largest capacity for empathy towards people of the female persuasion who sees a certain phrase offensive.[/QUOTE]
you don't know me. don't pretend like you do. you telling me that i don't empathize with people who are triggered by rape comments and rape jokes, like some of my best friends? that's pretty fucking insulting. some of the closest people to me that i respect more than anyone i know have either been raped or sexually harassed. nobody should have to sit here and waste their god damn time telling you how stupid you are to say something like that to anyone you don't know, and to someone who you only know through a few opinionated posts on the internet.
i gave my first impression of the show on the conference stage as i saw it live, i didn't say i don't empathize with people who may have been offended by it. and it has absolutely nothing to do with anita sarkeesian.
go fuck yourself. take your head out of your ass and get off your high horse. stop being a shit-stirring son of a bitch.
[highlight](User was banned for this post ("flaming" - postal))[/highlight]
[QUOTE=TheJoey;41008646]
go fuck yourself. take your head out of your ass and get off your high horse. stop being a shit-stirring son of a bitch.[/QUOTE]
I said "maybe" because you have a history of posting in feminist-related threads talking about how the content of those threads doesn't really matter and generally showing a lack of empathy towards people who see things you necessarily don't
If I was wrong I'm sorry for the assumption but you should really take a deep breath and relax.
-snip-
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41008792]I said "maybe" because you have a history of posting in feminist-related threads talking about how the content of those threads doesn't really matter and generally showing a lack of empathy towards people who see things you necessarily don't
If I was wrong I'm sorry for the assumption but you should really take a deep breath and relax.[/QUOTE]
how is "you should calm down" a helpful thing to say to anyone you have just personally offended?
just because you say the words "maybe" and the phrase "not to cause drama", doesn't give you the ability to shit-post and generally be an asshole towards people in an effort to cause drama and derail the thread from [i]the discussion[/i] to "well i dunno about the e3 thing the op is talking about but this facepunch member right here obviously doesn't empathize with people based on posts he made in other threads." what the fuck does that have to do with anything? how do people get away with shit like this and not get banned?
TheJoey isn't saying "this isn't a rape joke," he's just saying how he perceived the joke. He still empathizes with anyone who was triggered; it's not like he's telling triggered survivors to "calm down."
[QUOTE=TheJoey;41008952]how is "you should calm down" a helpful thing to say to anyone you have just personally offended?
just because you say the words "maybe" and the phrase "not to cause drama", doesn't give you the ability to shit-post and generally be an asshole towards people in an effort to cause drama and derail the thread from [i]the discussion[/i] to "well i dunno about the e3 thing the op is talking about but this facepunch member right here obviously doesn't empathize with people based on posts he made in other threads." what the fuck does that have to do with anything? how do people get away with shit like this and not get banned?[/QUOTE]
I didn't do it to shitpost, I did it because you have been on record on a public forum before displaying a lack of empathy when it comes to a very specific issue. This was never an implication that you psychologically lack the ability to empathize with people, just stating that maybe the reason you don't find issue with this specific topic might correlate with your previous posts about feminist issues that are generally un-empathetic. If the mods consider that derailing or shitposting and want to ban me for it I guess that's their perogative but as long as we are on the subject I'm pretty sure
[QUOTE=TheJoey;41008646]
go fuck yourself. take your head out of your ass and get off your high horse. stop being a shit-stirring son of a bitch.[/QUOTE]
counts as flaming.
Take my advice and take a break from the internet. I'm sorry I made rash assumptions about your character over a forum.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41008792]
If I was wrong I'm sorry for the assumption but [B]you should really take a deep breath and relax.[/B][/QUOTE]
dat passive aggression
lovin' this Facepunch quality debate
[QUOTE=Diet Kane;41009095]dat passive aggression
lovin' this Facepunch quality debate[/QUOTE]
My only regret is that I will never live up to the quality of [URL="http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1277601&p=40996631&highlight=#post40996631"]your posts.[/URL]
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41009126]My only regret is that I will never live up to the quality of [URL="http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1277601&p=40996631&highlight=#post40996631"]your posts.[/URL][/QUOTE]
I'm sorry I make fun of Patricia Hernandez for being a poor writer, a sensationalist, and a contributor to a yellow journalism blog website that is detrimental to gaming journalism (yeah yeah gaming journalism is already a joke whatever).
Got any more passive aggression in your bag of self-righteousness or can we actually discuss and inform opposing sides instead of belittling each other.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41009092]Take my advice and take a break from the internet.[/QUOTE]
Oh my god the amount of condescending arrogance in this post
You spend a thread getting mad at everyone for not seeing things the way you do, someone comes on and gets mad at a personal insult you make at them, and all of a sudden they need to take a break???
I think it's pretty much unanimous that what the Microsoft guys said might've been a poor choice of words but it's not really offensive and was definitely not a rape joke in any way, shape, or form. I think everyone agrees that it's a shame that people are triggered, but that we can't prevent every trigger by censoring off our own language, especially when it comes to censoring smack talk between gamers.
[QUOTE=Diet Kane;41009180]I'm sorry I make fun of Patricia Hernandez for being a poor writer, a sensationalist, and a contributor to a yellow journalism blog website that is detrimental to gaming journalism (yeah yeah gaming journalism is already a joke whatever).
Got any more passive aggression in your bag of self-righteousness or can we actually discuss and inform opposing sides instead of belittling each other.[/QUOTE]
I'm just going to quote your post again and you decide if it's worth taking seriously.
[QUOTE=Diet Kane;40996631]patricia the gorilla in a stable habitat[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=NoShogun;41009190]Oh my god the amount of condescending arrogance in this post
You spend a thread getting mad at everyone for not seeing things the way you do, someone comes on and gets mad at a personal insult you make at them, and all of a sudden they need to take a break???[/QUOTE]
I'm not being condescending or arrogant, you misunderstand me. I think he should stop posting because, while I admire his passion, he seems to be getting really upset to the point of flaming and I'd rather not see him banned for it. My point about lacking empathy wasn't an insult. There are things some people just can't empathize with because they haven't experienced certain things. It's not an attack on his character, it's me using his previous posts on this board which seem to paint a picture of his personality. Obviously I was wrong and for a third time I'll apologize for painting him the wrong way. I don't really know what else to say. He is right, I am wrong. I don't think he should take a break because LOL HE MAD xD, I just sincerely don't want to see him banned. Give me your boxes and he can send me PM's calling me a shit-stirring son of a bitch.
I had a paragraph for the second half of your post but I think I'll just bow out now since I obviously crossed a boundary here and I know when I fucked up. Sorry again Joey. I mean it.
I didn't find it funny until I saw it being reposted with people pointing out how it was going to make a lot of people mad.
Then I found it hilarious.
I think it's pretty sad that the gaming community badmouths anyone who starts discussing gender roles/misogyny in gaming.
Anita Sarkeesian is considered a highly esteemed vlogger, but the moment she tackles gaming, she has to disable her comments because people are sexually harassing her and sending her death threats.
Patricia Hernandez talks about the role of rape and gender in trash talking, and everyone badmouths her because they think she's "looking to start a problem." Even though her actions were perpetuating rape culture and triggering survivors around her.
I think it's mind boggling that the gaming community can't handle these commentators. When I brought up these issues in a tech seminar a few weeks ago, I found out that writers like Sarkeesian are taken dead seriously by graduate students and professors in media literacy departments. Meanwhile, everyone shits all over her online.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41009377]I'm just going to quote your post again and you decide if it's worth taking seriously.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Raidyr;41009377]I'm not being condescending or arrogant[/quote]
Lovely.
This has been a problem with Facepunch "debates" and discussions lately, and it effects both sides. Passive aggression and condescending. Both sides do it. I'm guilty of doing it a few times, we all are. It's a problem that affects the entire internet, really. When you're given an alternate identity to veil over yourself, it gives you a false sense of empowerment, and therefore you act "superior" to others by not giving someone the chance for discussion, or belittling someone.
Most of the FP arguments where this happens, usually in threads about sexism and whatnot, you'd find that people actually share a lot of common ground. I don't think sexism in video games is okay and that it should be something for men. God that's awful. In fact, my sole reason for being wary of Mirror's Edge 2 is that it looks like they're going the opposite direction by prettying Faith up.
This is gonna be my last post here regarding this, but I just wish we could go once without some sort of passive aggression or belittlement. There's probably already been some genuinely good discussion somewhere in this thread, but at this point it's just been muted out by the pointless conflict that yes I am participating in.
[QUOTE=Reimu;41009426]I found out that writers like Sarkeesian are taken dead seriously by graduate students and professors in [b]media literacy departments.[/b][/QUOTE]
I don't understand why no one else takes her seriously either, it is a mystery.
Realistically media literacy deals with the sort of narratives that English courses will be analyzing in 40 years. It's no coincidence that, in an English course I'm going to be TA'ing for, we're playing Fallout 3 :v:.
Likewise, media literacy deals directly with young students' interpretation of media. If they see misogynistic representations within media they grow up with, it's going to impact their worldview.
[editline]12th June 2013[/editline]
Not to mention, English departments and media literacy departments often walk hand-in-hand with gender studies. Before my college implemented a gender studies curriculum, English had dozens of course on feminist literary theory and gender studies within historical literature.
All these hype and bandwagonship lowers Microsoft's stock share, and this shit won't benefit any of us long-term. Stop pushing this into top news guise, rly.
[QUOTE=entertainer89;41008197]Some people are so fragile they should be locked in rooms made of bubblewrap and pillows listening to soothing ocean music.
Anything less is triggering and causes them to become angry and offended with everything they see, hear, touch or smell.
Such is life in this crappy, messed up world. How weak as a species we've become :([/QUOTE]
People are just mad over nothing, and it's so easy to hate for the Xbox when everyone else is doing it. Let them stay mad.
when people are shouting that something unforgivable and terrible is happening (misogyny) they will find it and take offense to it even if it is a joke.
given, rape jokes and any joke that may provoke feminists in to a frenzy is terrible in the current climate where even saying "you play like a girl" gets people assflustered to hell and back, is a terrible thing to do, but i am 100% certain rape jokes dont exist to make fun of victims of abuse.
they are jokes. plus this doesn't even seem like a complete rape joke. i can't count the number of times i've said "shhhh, it'll all be over soon." and not meant it as a reference to rape
[QUOTE=DeeCeeTeeBee;41009692]i can't count the number of times i've said "shhhh, it'll all be over soon." [/QUOTE]
Rapist detected.
Raidyr give me a fuckin break, you wouldn't have brought up his post history if you weren't trying to undermine him. You're not really interested in the discourse, you're interested in being perceived as being right.
if you're going to pull shit like that, at least have the balls to just admit you're doing it rather than pulling this "who me?? : ( " shit
[QUOTE=entertainer89;41008197]Some people are so fragile they should be locked in rooms made of bubblewrap and pillows listening to soothing ocean music.
Anything less is triggering and causes them to become angry and offended with everything they see, hear, touch or smell.
Such is life in this crappy, messed up world. How weak as a species we've become :([/QUOTE]
right its not the wars or the famines that make you feel bad, its public discourse about language
if the species is that weak feel free to leave it, sorry that we talk about things instead of hitting each other over the head with clubs
to summarize in words you can understand: why dont you go fucking ooga-booga somewhere else m8
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