E3 Audience Offended By "Rape Joke" At Microsoft Xbox One Event
325 replies, posted
This was simply just a poor choice of words nothing more in my opinion (especially since the "social justice in gaming" thing happening), if you see it as some sort of subtle rape joke then in my opinion your looking way too much into it. Almost as if your looking to be offended. It wasn't until some people pointed it out that I noticed the supposed "rape joke".
I can't think of any worst groups to piss off than feminists and people who hate microsoft, bravo
the first part was ok but the second part was just weird
A joke is never meant to be taken seriously. It certainly wasn't the most tasteful joke to be coming from an entity that should be trying to maintain some level of professionalism, but it surprises me that people take any kind of joke so seriously that it causes them emotional distress. It's silly. That said, get your shit together Microsoft.
[QUOTE=Skarr;40997950]A joke is never meant to be taken seriously. It certainly wasn't the most tasteful joke to be coming from an entity that should be trying to maintain some level of professionalism, but it surprises me that people take any kind of joke so seriously that it causes them emotional distress. It's silly. That said, get your shit together Microsoft.[/QUOTE]
Well, being distressed by the joke/comment is not really a matter of choice. I think most of the people distressed or even the few that were triggered would love to not care about it.
Sometimes, a cigar is just a cigar.
[QUOTE=person11;40997990]Well, being distressed by the joke/comment is not really a matter of choice. I think most of the people distressed or even the few that were triggered would love to not care about it.[/QUOTE]
I'd like to think that most people have a bit more self-control.
I don't think, "it'll all be over soon" is high on the list of things men would want to say when initiating sex, consensual or otherwise.
People, even if you do infer a slight against the female gender from this (which is a laughable claim - there is maybe a tiny hint of sexual innuendo) why do you in any way think it's intentional?
It wasn't odd, it wasn't strange, it wasn't unacceptable and it's not interesting.
Go to SH, there's a thread about some people who tried to blow up some other people. That's unacceptable. Go and complain about that.
[QUOTE=person11;40997990]Well, being distressed by the joke/comment is not really a matter of choice. I think most of the people distressed or even the few that were triggered would love to not care about it.[/QUOTE]
so does this mean that certain phrases that can be different on context should be always wrong to use because of a few peoples offenses?
I don't really see that as fair or reasonable or acheivable
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;40997666]so you're saying that I support rape because I don't instantly think "rape" when I hear a comment about overpowering another person?
Rape is about power no? So holding power over another person in any condition is bad? Or is saying something about it bad? or is it wrong to play a video game and take it not seriously and say unserious things?
I'm really confused by your point of view. I see real justifications of rape everywhere and they sicken me. You're upset over this.
That's ridiculous.
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
oh so language is subject to interpretation and claiming a phrase regardless of context is a rape related phrase is wrong?
who would have guessed[/QUOTE]
1. Sort of. I know you do not support rape, and I do not know very many people who explicitly do. But accepting all the little things said about rape is certainly not helping the fight against rape and rape culture.
2. Saying unserious things is very different from saying offensive or even potentially distressing things. And depending on who you are, yes, holding power over another is bad (we can save that part for the anarchism debate thread).
3. Being upset over this does not mean I am not upset over the infinite other things I see every day. This is a relatively small thing, but it is still worth getting upset over, just like everything else I get upset over every day. I think it is ridiculous that I am only allowed to get upset over the big things and not the little things. When you look at any social phenomena, such as the use of rape as oppression on a grand scale, for example, you can't just look at the Macro level. The Micro level is just as important, since it is a collection of Micro-aggressions that make larger aggressions more likely. Macro is just a collection of smaller things, and this one unintentional rape reference is one of those small things.
4. The important part is that a significant number of people thought it offensive, even if we disagree about what the phrase means exactly or where it derives from. I try not to use this argument because a douchebag always comes out of the woodwork to say something like "Everyone thought Galileo was wrong".
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;40998057]so does this mean that certain phrases that can be different on context should be always wrong to use because of a few peoples offenses?
I don't really see that as fair or reasonable or acheivable[/QUOTE]
It is not ever completely achievable. Accidents happen. But it i fair and reasonable to talk about the accidents when they happen. Obviously there are limits to what we can do to help people who are sensitive to certain things, like I said in my longer post. We do not ban flashing images to protect people who are liable to seizures, for example. I just think that avoiding language that might go back to rape is the easiest thing one can do.
[QUOTE=Matriax;40998052]People, even if you do infer a slight against the female gender from this (which is a laughable claim - there is maybe a tiny hint of sexual innuendo) why do you in any way think it's intentional?
It wasn't odd, it wasn't strange, it wasn't unacceptable and it's not interesting.
Go to SH, there's a thread about some people who tried to blow up some other people. That's unacceptable. Go and complain about that.[/QUOTE]
You sound like a Ron Paul fan saying that economic policy is so important that he would elect a man who is against abortion.
"Who cares about abortion and gay marriage when Obama is spending billions of dollars a day wake up sheeple!"
We can complain about multiple things if we want to. Blowing up other people is definitely worse than making a dumb and offensive joke, but we can still complain about both.
[QUOTE=person11;40998089]
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
It is not ever completely achievable. Accidents happen. But it i fair and reasonable to talk about the accidents when they happen. Obviously there are limits to what we can do to help people who are sensitive to certain things, like I said in my longer post. We do not ban flashing images to protect people who are liable to seizures, for example. I just think that avoiding language that might go back to rape is the easiest thing one can do.[/QUOTE]
I don't find it necessary for one to cater their language or lifestyle for anyone else unless they are voluntarily doing so, or when not doing so is legitimately dangerous to the well-being of other individuals.
[QUOTE=person11;40998138]We can complain about multiple things if we want to. Blowing up other people is definitely worse than making a dumb and offensive joke, but we can still complain about both.[/QUOTE]
Except people seem to take rape jokes more seriously than actual rape or serious harm done to women who are not white.
[QUOTE=Skarr;40998019]I'd like to think that most people have a bit more self-control.[/QUOTE]
Sometimes, self control is a luxury that people would love to have.
A war veteran with PTSD would love to have enough self control to avoid thinking about his dead friends every time he sees things that remind him of war. My friend would love to have enough control to not immediately have the worst thing to ever happen to her thrust in her face in the form of a joke or comment.
So it is true that most people have the self control to not be distressed about the potential reference to rape in what was said, or to simply not care. The controversy is not about those people, it is about the people who are mentally unable to not give a shit.
[QUOTE=person11;40998089]1. Sort of. I know you do not support rape, and I do not know very many people who explicitly do. But accepting all the little things said about rape is certainly not helping the fight against rape and rape culture.
2. Saying unserious things is very different from saying offensive or even potentially distressing things. And depending on who you are, yes, holding power over another is bad (we can save that part for the anarchism debate thread).
3. Being upset over this does not mean I am not upset over the infinite other things I see every day. This is a relatively small thing, but it is still worth getting upset over, just like everything else I get upset over every day. I think it is ridiculous that I am only allowed to get upset over the big things and not the little things. When you look at any social phenomena, such as the use of rape as oppression on a grand scale, for example, you can't just look at the Macro level. The Micro level is just as important, since it is a collection of Micro-aggressions that make larger aggressions more likely. Macro is just a collection of smaller things, and this one unintentional rape reference is one of those small things.
4. The important part is that a significant number of people thought it offensive, even if we disagree about what the phrase means exactly or where it derives from. I try not to use this argument because a douchebag always comes out of the woodwork to say something like "Everyone thought Galileo was wrong".[/QUOTE]
1. But just because I do not find this phrase offensive and meaning of rape really doesn't have anything to do with whether I'm in support of rape culture at all, it doesn't do anything to detract from any support I give to anti rape causes.
2. But that's so arbitrary it's meaningless. Some phrases can be interpreted by people because language is maleable and meant for that. it doesn't mean a phrase is that way to all people or was even meant that way. To really want to apply such an effect to speech where only phrases devoid of any sort of potential offensiveness is ridiculous. And that is what you're asking for. Potentially distressing even refers to the fact that it is only a potential and not even a sure thing. To bar people from being a specific way due to this seems horribly wrong to me. And surely not a way to stop rape culture. As for holding power over another, in a video game, being a better player is holding power over another. This is what his joke was about. To infer that he is trying to say he wants to rape her, or that his comment is somehow aimed in that direction is just that, it's you inferring.
3. Be upset about it then. But that doesn't make it right or reasonable in all cases. It doesn't mean every thing you think is part of it, is part of it. It's arbitrary. It really is.
4. So people were offended. And not offended. And partially offended. And understanding of the offense. And all different view points. Why does the most offended of the view points become right just for being the most offended?
You're telling me you're right and that you're right because you're right and that these things are wrong because they support rape culture, but you are, to me, entirely ignoring that there is a large chance to misconstrue what people mean easily when you start looking for it everywhere.
I have one of the dirtiest minds out of the people I know, and I had to actually think about it to realise how someone saw it as dirty.
Less a rape joke and more bad wording that pisses off some extremist feminist.
[QUOTE=Patriarch;40998186]Except people seem to take rape jokes more seriously than actual rape or serious harm done to women who are not white.[/QUOTE]
I've not seen that, but I would agree that one should always do more to speak out against rape than rape jokes. The latter still needs to be talked about.
[QUOTE=person11;40998203]Sometimes, self control is a luxury that people would love to have.
A war veteran with PTSD would love to have enough self control to avoid thinking about his dead friends every time he sees things that remind him of war. My friend would love to have enough control to not immediately have the worst thing to ever happen to her thrust in her face in the form of a joke or comment.
So it is true that most people have the self control to not be distressed about the potential reference to rape in what was said, or to simply not care. The controversy is not about those people, it is about the people who are mentally unable to not give a shit.[/QUOTE]
so anyone who says a thing that's potentially offensive is "mentally unstable"?
these conversations always get so ironic
I fucking love fighting game trash talk, which often is worse than this, except it's between two people that both fire them back at eachother, both knowing they're not serious. This doesn't seem like such a case.
[QUOTE=person11;40998216]I've not seen that, but I would agree that one should always do more to speak out against rape than rape jokes. The latter still needs to be talked about.[/QUOTE]
i agree we should talk about what rape jokes imply and what they mean
i don't agree that every rape joke ever told is supporting and encouraging rape.
I don't see how making a rape joke an untold offense is supporting talk about rape.
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
[QUOTE=person11;40998089]
It is not ever completely achievable. Accidents happen. But it i fair and reasonable to talk about the accidents when they happen. Obviously there are limits to what we can do to help people who are sensitive to certain things, like I said in my longer post. We do not ban flashing images to protect people who are liable to seizures, for example. I just think that avoiding language that might go back to rape is the easiest thing one can do.[/QUOTE]
But do you not see how wide and far you can interpret things to be rapey if you wish to do so?
[QUOTE=person11;40998203]Sometimes, self control is a luxury that people would love to have.
A war veteran with PTSD would love to have enough self control to avoid thinking about his dead friends every time he sees things that remind him of war. My friend would love to have enough control to not immediately have the worst thing to ever happen to her thrust in her face in the form of a joke or comment.
So it is true that most people have the self control to not be distressed about the potential reference to rape in what was said, or to simply not care. The controversy is not about those people, it is about the people who are mentally unable to not give a shit.[/QUOTE]
But that can be true for a wide variety of things people say and do. I don't expect people to hold back about the things that bother me (and, yes, they exist) because I recognize that ultimately it is not my place to ask them to. To me, the controversy is silly. Perhaps the wisest choices weren't made, but what we say can not and should not be tailored to the feelings of everyone who could possibly be offended.
Edit: I hope I'm coming across as civil, at least. Don't mean to sound like an ass if I am.
was a really poor choice of words but i honestly think he just meant "you suck at this game don't even bother i'm about to win anyway"
[QUOTE=Patriarch;40998186]Except people seem to take rape jokes more seriously than actual rape or serious harm done to women who are not white.[/QUOTE]
no they don't you're just making shit up stop talking
[QUOTE=Kopimi;40998266]no they don't you're just making shit up stop talking[/QUOTE]
Not really; most of the feminist sites I've visited seem dedicated to posts about how biopsychology is apparently bull, why MRAs are dumb, or something awful some dumb person/celebrity has said.
I very rarely see content about women in places where they are treated as second-class citizens, or even objects. Really, it should be at least 50/50, but it's more 90/10.
Anything that mentions the word rape or feminism is immediately turned into a gigantic Facepunch argument. Good job, internets
Granted it wasn't a wise move at all by the conference(everyone has different opinions on the word when it relates to humor), there's no point in meaningless argument when it leads to no solution but aggressively saying "my opinion is right". Cool it kids.
[QUOTE=person11;40998216]I've not seen that, but I would agree that one should always do more to speak out against rape than rape jokes. The latter still needs to be talked about.[/QUOTE]
right so the solution about people sensitive to hearing about rape is to talk more about rape?
ok
[editline].[/editline]
just saying if I'd been raped i'd probably rather hear a rape joke than someone moan on and on about how rape jokes aren't ok. At least the first one might be funny.
[QUOTE=Patriarch;40998294]Not really; most of the feminist sites I've visited seem dedicated to posts about how biopsychology is apparently bull, why MRAs are dumb, or something awful some dumb person/celebrity has said.
I very rarely see content about women in places where they are treated as second-class citizens, or even objects. Really, it should be at least 50/50, but it's more 90/10.[/QUOTE]
Then you haven't been reading very hard at all.
[QUOTE=Water-Marine;40998312]Anything that mentions the word rape or feminism is immediately turned into a gigantic Facepunch argument. Good job, internets
Granted it wasn't a wise move at all by the conference(everyone has different opinions on the word when it relates to humor), there's no point in meaningless argument when it leads to no solution but aggressively saying "my opinion is right". Cool it kids.[/QUOTE]
I don't think anyone is upset right now. I'm enjoying the discussion.
[QUOTE=Patriarch;40998294]Not really; most of the feminist sites I've visited seem dedicated to posts about how biopsychology is apparently bull, why MRAs are dumb, or something awful some dumb person/celebrity has said.
I very rarely see content about women in places where they are treated as second-class citizens, or even objects. Really, it should be at least 50/50, but it's more 90/10.[/QUOTE]
show me a thread about a minority being raped where people didn't give a shit about the woman that got raped or stop talking
all you ever do is post stupid bullshit about how feminists this and feminists that and wahh feminazis they aren't talking about what [I]I[/I] want them to talk about!!
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
people criticize saudi arabia and shit all the time honestly what hte fuck are you on about
[QUOTE=Kopimi;40998369]all you ever do is post stupid bullshit about how feminists this and feminists that and wahh feminazis they aren't talking about what [I]I[/I] want them to talk about!!
[editline]11th June 2013[/editline]
people criticize saudi arabia and shit all the time honestly what hte fuck are you on about[/QUOTE]
1. I don't particularly remember doing this in recent memory. True I used to be an idiot in regards to feminism and gender politics, and you can probably still find some of those posts, but I would call myself a feminist now; there is nothing wrong with feminism in and of itself. However, all movements should be open to criticism.
2. Of course people do, but a lot of feminist sites and communities seem to overstep this in favor of talking about stuff like the friendzone.
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