Controversy over decision to bar couple from fostering because of UKIP membership - Polidicks

[QUOTE=carcarcargo;38578326]I'm fairly sure UKIP overtook the lib dems, at least thats what my friend who follows most of this has told me any way. At least in regards to recent elections and opinion polls.[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2012/nov/19/ukip-benefiting-disillusionment-politics-poll[/url] Currently they are fourth, but are gaining popularity.

[QUOTE=FlashMarsh;38578388]So many dumbasses in this thread. UKIP is not a 'racist' party, and if you think so, then you should probably stop confusing the BNP with UKIP.[/QUOTE] They're both racist, just the BNP is more racist.

[QUOTE=carcarcargo;38578422]They're both racist, just the BNP is more racist.[/QUOTE] Please, do actually provide something to support the claim that UKIP is racist.

[QUOTE=David29;38578439]Please, do actually provide something to support the claim that UKIP is racist.[/QUOTE] I'd say their hatred of immigration and being part of the EU is a testament to that.

[QUOTE=David29;38578439]Please, do actually provide something to support the claim that UKIP is racist.[/QUOTE] Don't bother, he constantly says retarded shit. He suggested that the Conservatives shouldn't legalise Gay Marriage, and Labour should instead because... ... ...

[QUOTE=FlashMarsh;38578497]Don't bother, he constantly says retarded shit. He suggested that the Conservatives shouldn't legalise Gay Marriage, and Labour should instead because... ... ...[/QUOTE] Because he's whoring for votes, he's voted in favour of anti gay legislation previously so he's just a massive populist.

I don't think political view should stop them from adopting. I would put irresponsibility as a higher concern. In regards to uniculturalism: I'm not a huge fan of multi-culti (funny saying this as an immigrant), but I'm having a hard time believing that fucking Farage and the UKIP are sincere towards this

[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38575530]There is no genetic basis for race. The genetic differences between individuals are far wider than the normalized genetic differences between different "races". Race exists purely as a social construct.[/QUOTE] How shit how can people be disagreeing with this? Everyone should know that 'race' is a purely 18th century construct.

[QUOTE=NoDachi;38579794]How shit how can people be disagreeing with this? Everyone should know that 'race' is a purely 18th century construct.[/QUOTE] [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_(biology)[/url] Not really.

UKIP beat the Liberal Democrats in the recent Police Elections, smashed them in the Corby By-election and came very close or beat them in the other by-elections. In popularity they are the third party but by representation we will have to wait until 2014 and 2015. They are currently 2nd in the European Parliament, maybe will make 1st in 2014 and I think in 2015 we could see the first UKIP MP. UKIP are the third party in my eyes, even if you don't agree and think it should be based on representation we will wait until 2015 when hopefully UKIP can gain a foothold in Westminster. Also Sobotnik is bang on.

[QUOTE=NoDachi;38579794]How shit how can people be disagreeing with this? Everyone should know that 'race' is a purely 18th century construct.[/QUOTE] How can you say that? Can you cite a source? Anyone can see that there are similarities in body structure and facial features among people descended from different regions, and that this is down to genetics. Are you going to tell me genetics are a myth, too? [editline]24th November 2012[/editline] (because they aren't)

UKIP are kind of like one of those "I'm not racist but" people, you believe them and sort of agree but can't help there's some heavier connotation somewhere :v: they do attract some pretty racist people, i'll admit

[QUOTE=Scrappa;38575090]Multiculturalism is nothing to do with races, it's to do with different cultures. UKIP believe that Multiculturalism is dividing communities, the more different cultures you try to push into one society the more and more divided it becomes. Rather they believe we should promote Uniculturalism, where different cultures merge together to form a new culture where everyone can be united together. So instead of all seperating out and forming cultural groups which divides communities and is what actually breeds racism and prejudice we should all come together and merge our cultures to form a united community rather than a divided one.[/QUOTE] there are words here but they don't amount to anything substantive i fail to see the difference between these two supposedly differing viewpoints. multiple cultures will become a single culture simply by time as it always has, i don't really see how this is a policy at all. [editline]24th November 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=DainBramageStudios;38577965]You are simply incorrect. [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrKrGkgeww4[/media] The way we tend to pidgeonhole people as "black" or "caucasian" or "asian" doesn't carve reality at the joints, but that is [I]not[/I] the same thing as saying there are not genetic differences between populations of people. As for saying that genetic differences between individuals are wider than those between races, yes, that is true, but it is also a red herring.[/QUOTE] i think you're being a bit too broad and unfair he didn't say there were no genetic differences between populations of people. he pretty much agrees with you just worded differently. obviously there are genetic differences between populations of people but the conceptions of race and what races mean and so forth existed far before any proper understanding of genetics. to say race is a social construct is true.

Concepts of space and extraterrestrial objects existed long before any proper understanding of astrophysics... people had a general idea of the effects of genetics, even though they had no idea how it worked, proven by selective breeding programs dating back to the Egyptians and probably before.

I've never really liked the term "race", it's always made seemed like people are separated like they're a different species.

[QUOTE=carcarcargo;38581065]I've never really liked the term "race", it's always made seemed like people are separated like they're a different species.[/QUOTE] Only because the term racism comes with it. If the intent of the word was to separate people like different species the word subspecies would be used instead. Race is the best word to describe groups of individuals hailing from different ancestries, since that's its purpose. Instead of pulling a new word out of thin air to solve the short term problem of not liking the word, contribute to efforts to solve the long term problem of racism.

[QUOTE=teh pirate;38581050]Concepts of space and extraterrestrial objects existed long before any proper understanding of astrophysics...[/QUOTE] yeah and most of it ended up wrong didn't it [QUOTE=teh pirate;38581050]people had a general idea of the effects of genetics, even though they had no idea how it worked, proven by selective breeding programs dating back to the Egyptians and probably before.[/QUOTE] no they had an incredibly poor understanding of genetics; and an incredibly long time for trial and error. i don't really understand what the point you're trying to make is, if it's "no races aren't a social construct" then you'd have to give us some evidence that contradicts current evidence suggesting there is not really a big genetic link between races called "Caucasians". [editline]24th November 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=teh pirate;38581092]Race is the best word to describe groups of individuals hailing from different ancestries, since that's its purpose. [/QUOTE] no, ethnicity is race is utterly useless

[QUOTE=SigmaLambda;38574884]This is intrinsically a racist belief because it is based on the assumption that there is something harmful about different races living together.[/QUOTE] End the [B]'Active promotion'[/B]. Key part of that line. Multiculturalism is bullshit and most European leaders have agreed it's failed because it's being forced. UKIP are basically saying just get on with life, and if you happen to come across a person that's a different race from you...meh. No big deal.

[QUOTE=thisispain;38581116]yeah and most of it ended up wrong didn't it no they had an incredibly poor understanding of genetics; and an incredibly long time for trial and error. i don't really understand what the point you're trying to make is, if it's "no races aren't a social construct" then you'd have to give us some evidence that contradicts current evidence suggesting there is not really a big genetic link between races called "Caucasians".[/QUOTE] I never said it was accurate, but you seem to be implying that the concept of race was designed with purely villainous intent, when really it's a way to put words to another means by which we recognize features of a person, just like gender or age. You can discriminate based on any of those concepts but that doesn't mean they're specific causes of evil. Race is a thing. It's inaccurately classified, but it's a thing. Ethnicity is no more accurate a concept. They mean the same thing.

If they had a child naturally you wouldn't stop them from raising that. So why stop them from fostering?

[QUOTE=teh pirate;38581169]I never said it was accurate, but you seem to be implying that the concept of race was designed with purely villainous intent[/QUOTE] if i was merely implying it then yes i haven't been my job properly of course it has purely villainous intent!!! the entire idea of race was born out of incredible colonialist and racist ideology furthered by an extremely poor understanding of science. Race during this time period meant charts which placed the desirable traits of the "White" race at the top and compared them to the undesirable traits of the races Europeans met in their travels. before you try to say i'm just being "politically correct" or "over left-wing" (i've been accused of both before), please actually read the texts which created these understandings of race. they date back to this dreadful colonialist racist time period in science. [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_(human_classification)#Historical_origins_of_racial_classification[/url] this baggage behind the concept of race didn't just appear one day [editline]24th November 2012[/editline] [QUOTE=teh pirate;38581169] Ethnicity is no more accurate a concept. They mean the same thing.[/QUOTE] absolutely not, please read up and understand the difference between the two terms [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnicity[/url]

[QUOTE=JesterUK;38581181]If they had a child naturally you wouldn't stop them from raising that. So why stop them from fostering?[/QUOTE] Because it's not their child, they're just looking after it on behalf of the government.

I'm absolutely certain that the concept was not born out of a desire to oppress poor, non-white people. It most likely came out of the same drive we have to classify anything we aren't sure about.

[QUOTE=teh pirate;38581300]I'm absolutely certain that the concept was not born out of a desire to oppress poor, non-white people.[/QUOTE] well this is basically just a scoff expressed through words how are you so certain exactly? have you read something we haven't read? do share please

[QUOTE=teh pirate;38581300]I'm absolutely certain that the concept was not born out of a desire to oppress poor, non-white people.[/QUOTE] No I imagine it was, gives them a reason to treat them as subhuman.

forget imagining it its written in that wikipedia article omg

You're telling me that classifcation of things that are different from yourself comes from some innate desire to oppress those things?

[QUOTE=teh pirate;38581368]You're telling me that classifcation of things that are different from yourself comes from some innate desire to oppress those things?[/QUOTE] In terms of race yes, because you're effectively putting them into a separate category to yourself over something a frivolous as skin colour

[QUOTE=carcarcargo;38581328]No I imagine it was, gives them a reason to treat them as subhuman.[/QUOTE] Well considering we also split honeybees up into races... [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_honey_bee_races[/url]

Obviously we only split honeybees into races because they're subhuman or maybe it's because there's notable genetic differences between them, but nevermind that