ISRAEL THREAD (Post new Israel threads = get banned)
1,592 replies, posted
In my opinion, that was shit.
Can't see why Israel pissed, nothing of value was lost.
[QUOTE=Zeus;22420203]WTF are you talking about? The GOAL of the freedom flotilla was to deliberately break the blockade to get supplies through to gaza strip. They knew they were breaking it and when trops boarded they knew exactly what was going on which is why they started attacking them immediately.
Don't get all aggressive because someone has a different opinion than you. You look childish and ridiculous in doing so.[/QUOTE]
You know what's childish and ridiculous? Refusing to investigate the topic you're talking about and then bitching when someone else points it out.
yes, they were going to violate the blockade. But they didn't, did they? You know why? Because Israel fucking shot thirty people.
[editline]06:14PM[/editline]
And if you had put even one ounce of effort into understanding the situation you'd know that every eye witness from the boat has said, Israel fired on them before boarding. Professors, politicians, reporters, all different people from all over the world are saying that Israel fired on them before boarding.
And given that Israel has both admittedly doctored evidence and refuses to show any of the footage from either before or after they boarded the ship, I'd say it's pretty clear possibility.
What a twist!
BurnEmDown for tha stage y'all.
So that's why Pixies never reply to my e-mails asking them to play at my house. Because they're terrorists.
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;22420008]What weapons? Some kitchen knives and metal bars?
Fuck, I have a metal bar right next to me right now. They're pretty common items.[/QUOTE]
There's a difference between having the items around you and having them prepared and in piles waiting to be used.
[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;22420008]And once again, all the eye witnesses are saying that Israel fucking fired on them before boarding. The reporters, the parliamentarians, the professors, all of them are saying [I]the same thing.[/I] Not only that, but what they say matches up with even the small amount of footage Israel has released. Al Jazeera had a reporter on the ship, he confirmed that around twenty people on the deck had attacked the commandos, before knowing that Israel released any such footage. He also said that Israel fired on them, both from sea and from the air before boarding. Not only that, but he also made a distinction saying they started by firing rubber bullets and tear gas and then moved on to live fire. So him misinterpreting the situation is also pretty well out of the equation.
This argument is so fucking one sided it's ridiculous.[/QUOTE]
First of that Information is from Al Jazeera, and quite frankly I don't believing a damn thing I hear from them what with their treatment of their female employees and their handling of the militants messages.
Secondly I wouldn't doubt if the IDF fired first, but the fire was not direct. It is not uncommon for ships, including those in the US navy, to fire warning volleys across the bow of the ship as a signal to stop.
Lastly, it has been said that tear gas and rubber bullets (fired from paint ball guns) had been used before they switched to live fire. They switched to live fire when those methods were exhausted and their lives were in serious danger.
Look at it this way, of all of the ships that attempted to break the blockade why was this the only one that there was an issue? Of that entire flotilla all but that one ship were boarded peacefully and without incident and sent to Israel to offload their cargo and have it sent to Gaza by land. The last ship from Ireland was boarded as well, without incident what so ever, and sent to Israel to have the goods sent legally across the boarder.
why on earth would this ship be any different? Why would the IDF handle that one particular ship differently than the rest in the flotilla?
I don't know the answers to that, but that does say something was up with that particular ship.
[QUOTE=StupidUsername67;22419630]I can't tell who's worse. North Korea or Israel.[/QUOTE]
While Israel is pretty bad no nation on Earth even comes close to North Korea.
This still doesn't prove much of anything. The only thing that it confirms is that the flotilla was not going to stop. If it helps, here is the video.
[MEDIA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dE2StbDL_Q[/MEDIA]
[QUOTE=Zeus;22420203]WTF are you talking about? The GOAL of the freedom flotilla was to deliberately break the blockade to get supplies through to gaza strip. They knew they were breaking it and when troops boarded they knew exactly what was going on which is why they started attacking them immediately.
[/QUOTE]
The activists were like the civil rights demonstrators who sat down at segregated lunch counters throughout the South and refused to leave until they were served. Their goal was not really to get breakfast. It was to end segregation.
That fact is so obvious that it is hard to believe that the "pro-Israel" lobby is using it as an indictment.
Of course the goal of the flotilla was to break the blockade. Of course Martin Luther King provoked the civil authorities of the South to break segregation. Of course the Solidarity movement used workers' rights as a pretext to break Soviet-imposed Communism.
They should have just kept going with the lie.
I mean, that's a whopper of a lie, you don't just say "we lied' like a week later.
[QUOTE=hypno-toad;22420948]They should have just kept going with the lie.
I mean, that's a whopper of a lie, you don't just say "we lied' like a week later.[/QUOTE]
A lot of people started to question the authenticity of the video and pointed out obvious errors in the radio transmission; it'd be worse if the IDF kept lying.
[QUOTE=starpluck;22420930]The activists were like the civil rights demonstrators who sat down at segregated lunch counters throughout the South and refused to leave until they were served. Their goal was not really to get breakfast. It was to end segregation.
That fact is so obvious that it is hard to believe that the "pro-Israel" lobby is using it as an indictment.
Of course the goal of the flotilla was to break the blockade. Of course Martin Luther King provoked the civil authorities of the South to break segregation. Of course the Solidarity movement used workers' rights as a pretext to break Soviet-imposed Communism.[/QUOTE]
Of course none of those people attacked their oppressors and did their goals through peaceful protest.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;22421073]Of course none of those people attacked their oppressors and did their goals through peaceful protest.[/QUOTE]
Of course when you're boarded illegally after being shot at you'll defend yourself.
[QUOTE=starpluck;22421139]Of course when you're boarded illegally after being shot at you'll defend yourself.[/QUOTE]
Gandhi didn't, Mr. Luther King Jr. didn't. What concept about peaceful protest do you not understand?
fyi israel said this
[quote=The jews]So to clarify: the audio was edited down to cut out periods of silence over the radio as well as incomprehensible comments so as to make it easier for people to listen to the exchange[/quote]
not this
[quote=Not the jews]So to clarify: the audio was edited down to cut out periods of silence over the radio as well as incomprehensible comments so as to make it easier for people to listen to the exchange. Oh and also we added shit anti-Semitic shit in[/quote]
They admitted to editing the tape, not necessarily in a malicious way. It is not known whether or not it was edited in a malicious way. Either party could be lying.
[QUOTE=Zeke129;22420038]"The Nazis "doctored" my people in DEATH CAMPS YOU INSENSITIVE BASTARDS WE CAN DO WHAT WE WANT"[/QUOTE]
hey man no holocaust jokes let's keep this clean
This ads tremendously to the credibility of official statements.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;22421228]Gandhi didn't, Mr. Luther King Jr. didn't. What concept about peaceful protest do you not understand?[/QUOTE]
So when workers attack to the commandos, they have the right to fight back. But when workers get fired on, workers should just sit there, and fall one by one ?
[QUOTE=Zarfa;22421371]So when workers attack to the commandos, they have the right to fight back. But when workers get fired on, workers should just sit there, and fall one by one ?[/QUOTE]
If you're a peaceful protester yes. If the IDF fired and killed 9 people that didn't do ANYTHING but sit there with their legs crossed it would have sent out a much stronger message than what is being sent today(not to mention it would have been political suicide for Israel). If you know anything about Gandhi tons of his followers were killed, and he himself was beaten dozens of times. Martin Luther King Jr. had been beaten, imprisoned, and finally killed, but his message was continued in a non-violent fashion.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;22421620]If you're a peaceful protester yes. If the IDF fired and killed 9 people that didn't do ANYTHING but sit there with their legs crossed it would have sent out a much stronger message than what is being sent today(not to mention it would have been political suicide for Israel). If you know anything about Gandhi tons of his followers were killed, and he himself was beaten dozens of times. Martin Luther King Jr. had been beaten, imprisoned, and finally killed, but his message was continued in a non-violent fashion.[/QUOTE]
They were fired on before commandos boarded the ship.
The workers and passengers didn't have a leader, they didn't have faith in anything like Gandhi or Luther King did. They just knew that israeli troops had opened fire on them.
For a minute there I was under the assumption that Israel was under attack from magic fairy's.
[QUOTE=Zarfa;22421762]They were fired on before commandos boarded the ship.
The workers and passengers didn't have a leader, they didn't have faith in anything like Gandhi or Luther King did. They just knew that israeli troops had opened fire on them.[/QUOTE]
They had a leader, otherwise they wouldn't have been doing this in the first place. They had faith in something otherwise they'd have no reason to do it at all.
If they said they were anything but peaceful activists I would have sided with you on this one, but they didn't. Seeing as they were the only ship out of the entire flotilla to do so as well does not help their situation.
Take a look at the ship from Ireland. They tried to break the blockade, didn't head the warnings, but when the commandos came they were all sitting there on the ground.
How about the other ships from the flotilla? The commandos came aboard, no violent confrontations, and requested to speak to the captain. They then proceeded to direct the ships to Israeli ports.
I love the Pixes :)
[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BihjWa47WuM[/media]
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;22421620]If you're a peaceful protester yes. If the IDF fired and killed 9 people that didn't do ANYTHING but sit there with their legs crossed it would have sent out a much stronger message than what is being sent today(not to mention it would have been political suicide for Israel). If you know anything about Gandhi tons of his followers were killed, and he himself was beaten dozens of times. Martin Luther King Jr. had been beaten, imprisoned, and finally killed, but his message was continued in a non-violent fashion.[/QUOTE]
Did you even read the thread?
The commandos who boarded the ship were beaten with clubs, stabbed, shot with their own weapons, thrown overboard, and had stun grenades thrown at them (Video evidence, will post in a minute).
They used tear gas and rubber bullets. Their lives were in danger, so they had to use lethal force, because the protesters were using lethal force too.
[QUOTE=Uberman77883;22421885]Did you even read the thread?
The commandos who boarded the ship were beaten with clubs, stabbed, shot with their own weapons, thrown overboard, and had stun grenades thrown at them (Video evidence, will post in a minute).
They used tear gas and rubber bullets. Their lives were in danger, so they had to use lethal force, because the protesters were using lethal force too.[/QUOTE]
You honestly have not read anything that I have posted other than that have you...
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;22421865]They had a leader, otherwise they wouldn't have been doing this in the first place. They had faith in something otherwise they'd have no reason to do it at all.
If they said they were anything but peaceful activists I would have sided with you on this one, but they didn't. Seeing as they were the only ship out of the entire flotilla to do so as well does not help their situation.
Take a look at the ship from Ireland. They tried to break the blockade, didn't head the warnings, but when the commandos came they were all sitting there on the ground.
How about the other ships from the flotilla? The commandos came aboard, no violent confrontations, and requested to speak to the captain. They then proceeded to direct the ships to Israeli ports.[/QUOTE]
Did they open fire on the ship from Ireland ? I think not.
I quoted the wrong person.
But the point still stands to whoever I tried to quote.
[QUOTE=bravehat;22420274]In my opinion, that was shit.
Can't see why Israel pissed, nothing of value was lost.[/QUOTE]
uhhh wat?
pixies have made some incredible albums, Come On Pilgrim, Bossanova, Trompe le Monde, and especially Surfer Rosa
[QUOTE=Zarfa;22421961]Did they open fire on the ship from Ireland ? I think not.[/QUOTE]
You're point being? What the hell does that have to do with being a peaceful protester? What does being shot at have to do with sticking with non-violent protest? The point of non-violent protest is to NOT BE VIOLENT, no matter how much violence is directed towards you.
Too many people are willing to kill a man in the name of a belief while not many are willing to die to spite theirs.
[QUOTE=Uberman77883;22421970]I quoted the wrong person.
But the point still stands to whoever I tried to quote.[/QUOTE]
no it doesnt. you haven't read up on the subject at all.
I'm not going to spend time explaining it for the billionth time, read the thread.
Sorry, you need to Log In to post a reply to this thread.