• ISRAEL THREAD (Post new Israel threads = get banned)
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[QUOTE=Jugulum;22518337]Uhm, you do know that the managed to get complete control of the soldiers and got them below deck and gave them medical attention while they raised the white flag and asked to get medical attention for those who were wounded? Complete control, they could have killed them at any time, but they chose not to. Tell me, have you read any of the flotilla members side of what happened, or are you just blindly using the IDFs narrative? [/QUOTE] The white flag was already up. The requests for medical assistance was from the crew of the ship/mission organizers, not the passengers and was only provoked because they had a bunch of wounded as well. Only one soldier was on the lower deck. He was there because he was thrown there from the upper deck. The helicopter landing team was 45 men strong and the passengers only managed to wound 10. They didn't have control of anything. Their trip was over the minute those soldiers showed up. [QUOTE=Warhol;22520508] so having superior firepower means you can do what ever the fuck you want?[/QUOTE] It means resisting them is usually a terrible idea. Pick your battles. Don't fight ones you are obviously going to lose and get people killed needlessly. A melee range battle is not where a group of protesters is going to win a lot of support or conflicts.
Israel fucking admitted they went in blind. If you want to talk about terrible ideas, look at he IDF. Loading commandos 5 inches from a group of pissed people with sticks and a shitty plan of action [url]http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LDE650077.htm[/url] The IDF fucked up royally.
[QUOTE=Warhol;22520508] so having superior firepower means you can do what ever the fuck you want?[/QUOTE] :fsmug:
The IDF fucked up royally by going in blind into a ship full of martyrs. Then they get accused of killing innocent people by the rest of the world. Oh how silly politics are. :v:
[QUOTE=zombojoe;22527291]The IDF fucked up royally by going in blind into a [B]ship full of martyrs[/B]. Then they get accused of killing innocent people by the rest of the world. Oh how silly politics are. :v:[/QUOTE] You are trolling right?
[QUOTE=Warhol;22525993]Israel fucking admitted they went in blind. If you want to talk about terrible ideas, look at he IDF. Loading commandos 5 inches from a group of pissed people with sticks and a shitty plan of action [url]http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LDE650077.htm[/url] The IDF fucked up royally.[/QUOTE] Haha, on that news page, it says Niger is rated worse on the HDI than the Palestinian Territories. Maybe you should spend more time sorting out the problems in Niger than arguing on a forum about stuff people only give a crap about because Israel fucked up. [editline]05:16PM[/editline] [QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22527331]You are trolling right?[/QUOTE] No, they were martyrs.
Ok, first I just wanna address everyone in this thread using the, "If armed people got on my boat, I'd defend myself." Here we go. 1.) These people were supposed to be humanitarian activists: that means non-violence, ala Gandi. They job is to deliver food and make headlines as victims, not as attackers. 2.) If the police raided your boat because they thought you were smuggling coke, would you start stabbing wildly at them? Weather you had the coke or not, this is probably the worst fucking thing you can do. HONESTLY. You guys aren't supermen. If MILITARY personel raided my HOUSE or my BOAT or whatever the fuck I'm on, I'd probably co-operate, especially if I don't have guns. You guys are really just jumping on the 'hate Israel' bandwagon. The people attacked the Commandos because they hate Israel. Just like you guys. It isn't about going on the boat or not, what matters to you is who is ON the boat.
[QUOTE=DogGunn;22527368]Haha, on that news page, it says Niger is rated worse on the HDI than the Palestinian Territories. Maybe you should spend more time sorting out the problems in Niger than arguing on a forum about stuff people only give a crap about because Israel fucked up. [editline]05:16PM[/editline] No, they were martyrs.[/QUOTE] All 600 were martyrs? That is a pretty ignorant thing to say. Edit: [QUOTE=Neolk;22527383] The people attacked the Commandos because they hate Israel. Just like you guys. [/QUOTE] Condemning war crimes =/= hating a nation. Don't generalize.
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22527389]All 600 were martyrs? That is a pretty ignorant thing to say.[/QUOTE] I didn't say they were all martyrs - obviously the intention was bring across that at least some of them were.
[QUOTE=DogGunn;22527368] No, they were martyrs.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=DogGunn;22527408][B]I didn't say they were martyrs[/B] - obviously the intention was bring across that at least some of them were.[/QUOTE] Really?
Oops, I meant to add the word in all... my bad.
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22527389]All 600 were martyrs? That is a pretty ignorant thing to say. Edit: Condemning war crimes =/= hating a nation. Don't generalize.[/QUOTE] Ladddeee da, look at Mr. Snazzy over here. They hate the nation BECAUSE of its war crimes. You don't look at Hitler and go, "I condemn his war crimes but I don't hate him." If you asked the people on the boat what they are protesting they'd say the inhumane treatment of Palestine by the nation of Israel
[QUOTE=Neolk;22527443]Ladddeee da, look at Mr. Snazzy over here. They hate the nation BECAUSE of its war crimes. You don't look at Hitler and go, "I condemn his war crimes but I don't hate him." If you asked the people on the boat what they are protesting they'd say the inhumane treatment of Palestine by the nation of Israel[/QUOTE] That analogy doesn't work very well. Hitler was a person doing bad shit on a nations account, but I don't hate germany for what hitler did, do you? Just because I condemn the actions of a nations government doesn't mean I hate the nation, stop making stupid ass assumptions please.
[QUOTE=Neolk;22527443]Ladddeee da, look at Mr. Snazzy over here. They hate the nation BECAUSE of its war crimes. You don't look at Hitler and go, "I condemn his war crimes but I don't hate him." If you asked the people on the boat what they are protesting they'd say the inhumane treatment of Palestine by the nation of Israel[/QUOTE] How is it you say this as a decent analogy in your head?
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22527516]That analogy doesn't work very well. Hitler was a person doing bad shit on a nations account, but I don't hate germany for what hitler did, do you? Just because I condemn the actions of a nations government doesn't mean I hate the nation, stop making stupid ass assumptions please.[/QUOTE] Dude, seriously? You don't like Israel, its pretty clear, they don't either. Also, yes, you may not say you hate Germany, but you will say you hate NAZI-Germany. Therefore at the moment, you hate Israel. And please don't fuck with me on this one.[URL="http://www.google.com/cse?cx=partner-pub-4109526466655731%3Avwsnd4h698o&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=%22death+to+israel%22&sa=Search"]Also, don't be so smart with me. It is pretty clear what I meant, and its pretty fuckin' clear what a bunch of people mean. Just because you wanna be, Super-cerrect doesn't mean you don't get the point. Your pissed at Israel for its actions, don't deny it.[/URL]
[QUOTE=Neolk;22527719]Dude, seriously? You don't like Israel, its pretty clear, they don't either. Also, yes, you may not say you hate Germany, but you will say you hate NAZI-Germany. Therefore at the moment, you hate Israel. And please don't fuck with me on this one.[URL="http://www.google.com/cse?cx=partner-pub-4109526466655731%3Avwsnd4h698o&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=%22death+to+israel%22&sa=Search"]Also, don't be so smart with me. It is pretty clear what I meant, and its pretty fuckin' clear what a bunch of people mean. Just because you wanna be, Super-cerrect doesn't mean you don't get the point. Your pissed at Israel for its actions, don't deny it.[/URL][/QUOTE] Being pissed at a nation for it's actions and hating it utterly or hoping for it's destruction are absolutely different things. I have despised America's actions in the past but I have no contempt for the country itself or her inhabitants. That doesn't mean anything.
[QUOTE=Neolk;22527719]Dude, seriously? You don't like Israel, its pretty clear, they don't either. Also, yes, you may not say you hate Germany, but you will say you hate NAZI-Germany. Therefore at the moment, you hate Israel. And please don't fuck with me on this one.[U] [URL="http://www.google.com/cse?cx=partner-pub-4109526466655731%3Avwsnd4h698o&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=%22death+to+israel%22&sa=Search"]Also, don't be so smart with me. It is pretty clear what I meant, and its pretty fuckin' clear what a bunch of people mean. Just because you wanna be, Super-cerrect doesn't mean you don't get the point. Your pissed at Israel for its actions, don't deny it.[/URL] [/U][/QUOTE] You like to generalize don't you? I personally condemn the actions of the Israeli government, nothing more nothing less. I'm not sure why you automatically assume that I speak on the behalf of everyone in this thread, that's a pretty silly assumption. You don't happen to be from Israel do you? Because it reeks of persecution card here, you explode in rage because 3 posts out of 1425 said "Death to israel" and you slap the anti-israel label on everyone that doesn't agree with you.
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22527768]You like to generalize don't you? I personally condemn the actions of the Israeli government, nothing more nothing less. I'm not sure why you automatically assume that I speak on the behalf of everyone in this thread, that's a pretty silly assumption. You don't happen to be from Israel do you? Because it reeks of persecution card here, you explode in rage because 3 posts out of 1425 said "Death to israel" and you slap the anti-israel label on everyone that doesn't agree with you.[/QUOTE] Fine, lets make it personal. What are you protesting here?
[QUOTE=Neolk;22527890]Fine, lets make it personal. What are you protesting here?[/QUOTE] I'm not protesting, I'm debating the current events in Israel and Gaza. What are you doing here?
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22527937]I'm not protesting, I'm debating the current events in Israel and Gaza. What are you doing here?[/QUOTE] Protest is essentially the same as a debate on this form. What are you DEBATING then. I don't wanna know the SUBJECT, I want to know your specific stance on a specific issue.
[QUOTE=Neolk;22528039]Protest is essentially the same as a debate on this form. What are you DEBATING then. I don't wanna know the SUBJECT, I want to know your specific stance on a specific issue.[/QUOTE] Read my posts in this thread and you should be able to figure that one out.
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22528060]Read my posts in this thread and you should be able to figure that one out.[/QUOTE] Then its pretty fucking clear you are protesting the actions of Israel in Gaza. Thanks for wasting me fucking time and making me jump through all these hoops for, literally, no reason. God bless Israel.
[QUOTE=Neolk;22528087]Then its pretty fucking clear you are protesting the actions of Israel in Gaza. Thanks for wasting me fucking time and making me jump through all these hoops for 'no reason'.[/QUOTE] You're welcome.
Seems like nobody here has the ability to separate fact from fiction. :smug:
[QUOTE=starpluck;22512608]Proof? Lol. That's your answer to every question. Unfortunately for you, you're wrong. Because if that was the case, Israel would of never released their videos, since their POV videos are as exploitable as they can get, with clear grappling techniques, radio transmissions etc. [editline]07:23PM[/editline] See what happens when the IDF censors all footage from the Flotilla, only allowing their version go through the media? It makes the Flotilla look like savages. Its surprising that all this information was just from one leak, imagine if the other videos weren't censored, there'd be way more to it.[/QUOTE] Still waiting a response BurnEmDown. You posted directly under me. [editline]09:52AM[/editline] [QUOTE=BurnEmDown;22512338]I'm pretty damn sure they tried to. When you drop someone 12 feet, stab another guy in the arm, repetitively bash a person who is already down on the ground, you're not exactly doing it to capture them. If I had to guess I would say that once they beat the first few soldiers and other non-violent people came they stopped, the non-violent people took the injured soldiers to help them, and then the other Israeli commandos came and the firefight started against only the violent activists, perhaps a few non-violent activists remained on the top deck with them. Only a guess though.[/QUOTE] Nope. Activists disarmed an Israeli commando(s). If they really wanted to kill the commandos as you claimed; they would of shot the commandos.
[QUOTE=starpluck;22528257]Still waiting a response BurnEmDown. You posted directly under me. [editline]09:52AM[/editline] Nope. Activists disarmed an Israeli commando(s). If they really wanted to as you claimed; they would of shot the commandos.[/QUOTE] This. They threw the confiscated weapons in the ocean, probably not the first thing you would do if you wanted to kill someone.
[QUOTE=Neolk;22527383]Ok, first I just wanna address everyone in this thread using the, "If armed people got on my boat, I'd defend myself." Here we go. 1.) These people were supposed to be humanitarian activists: that means non-violence, ala Gandi. They job is to deliver food and make headlines as victims, not as attackers. 2.) If the police raided your boat because they thought you were smuggling coke, would you start stabbing wildly at them? Weather you had the coke or not, this is probably the worst fucking thing you can do. HONESTLY. You guys aren't supermen. If MILITARY personel raided my HOUSE or my BOAT or whatever the fuck I'm on, I'd probably co-operate, especially if I don't have guns. You guys are really just jumping on the 'hate Israel' bandwagon. The people attacked the Commandos because they hate Israel. Just like you guys. It isn't about going on the boat or not, what matters to you is who is ON the boat.[/QUOTE] Oh just shut the hell up. "All you guys are really jumping onto the hate disregard of human rights bandwagon :downs:" You seem to think when the majority disagrees with Israel; due to your refusal to accept it, you call it bandwagon. Also, don't ever make an analogy again.
The ship's captain admits that the passangers prepared ahead to attack the Israeli soldiers: [Media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JdfxKEGGtc&feature=player_embedded[/media] Thread end.
[QUOTE=smartdog;22529351]The ship's captain admits that the passangers prepared ahead to attack the Israeli soldiers: [Media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8JdfxKEGGtc&feature=player_embedded[/media] Thread end.[/QUOTE] Elaborate please. I can't really see how that ends the thread.
[QUOTE=Hoffa1337;22529388]Elaborate please. I can't really see how that ends the thread.[/QUOTE] It proves that the passangers have prepared ahead to attack the Israeli soldiers, without any provecation or voilence inflicted on them by the Israeli military. Therefore, the thread (well, the discussion on the boat incident, at least) ends.
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