MH17 plane crash: Evidence 'was tampered with' - Polidicks

Everyone's wallets and pursues had been looted too according to Vice.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45477585]First of all. I do not see how article in Op is by any means is[B] truth[/B] It simply presents idea that bbc have "some sources" saying taht there was tempering with evidence, not accounting for a fact that damn thing fell down in war zone, and how it was mentioned before, got plenty of citizen access before rebels seized area and attempted to prevent mroe people form wandering around debree, taking pics and picking up stuff. Secondly, like i said, thread's title, consists of way sensationalist figure of speech. This is no 'tampering of Evidence' This is a mere "BBC Sources - Tampering of Evidence. Also, if we'd look in article ourselfs, i'd say it's protion dedicated to mention of such "tampering takes only five lines of text out of whole article wich basically narrwoly recollects all events thus far. Seriously, here is whole except where sources or tempering is even mentioned atleast[/QUOTE] Do you seriously think we here are so stupid, that you have to point out a newspaper quoting someone doesn't mean it's true 100%. The BBC reports, that sources say evidence was tampered with. This doesn't make it true. My story above though, and the fact that the rebels sped off with the black boxes to Russia, a lot of human and plane remains were moved does however agree with the BBC story, and therefor so do I. You however have no problem spewing bullshit in the face of truth. I saw you still saying the rebels didn't have a BUK at all. Completely idiotic, which i'll simulate with a little roleplay. I now am RT: [QUOTE]2 week before crash : "Seperatists have gained control over a BUK, see these pictures. They are doing well, they have got a AA weapon that can take down planes at 25km altitude."[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]15 minutes after crash : "Seperatists don't have any AA weapons other than manpads, and they certainly don't have a BUK that can take planes down at 25km altitude."[/QUOTE] [QUOTE]You : Omfg stop saying bad things about Russia and the seperatists, they dont have BUK, RT said it 15 min ago, who cares that im ignoring messages before that.[/QUOTE]

The crash site was tainted and tampered with the second someone outside of the investigation picked up the flight data recorders. That's as simple as it gets.

[QUOTE=Pr0fane;45477658]Do you seriously think we here are so stupid, that you have to point out a newspaper quoting someone doesn't mean it's true 100%. The BBC reports, that sources say evidence was tampered with. This doesn't make it true. My story above though, and the fact that the rebels sped off with the black boxes to Russia, a lot of human and plane remains were moved does however agree with the BBC story, and therefor so do I. You however have no problem spewing bullshit in the face of truth. I saw you still saying the rebels didn't have a BUK at all. Completely idiotic, which i'll simulate with a little roleplay. I now am RT:[/QUOTE] I would like to remind you that in reality, situation regarding buks would be cleared out only after ICAO's detailed investigation wich includes analysis of debree and black boxes. Untill then, no matter how much it hurts yout guts, this is a mere accusation based on tweeted photos and few other confirmed bogus source materials, and even US can't present info beyond that while Russian Ministry of Defence actually presented a wide briefing regarding info, passed this info to EU commission and cooperates by every means possible. How about air traffic control info that Ukrainian SBU never shared? How about NATO satelites everyone knows now were able to provide coverage of incident but still for some mythical reasons not presented? Seriously, all your hatred and "knowledge" based on simple idea that "tweets are truth" wich is silly and immature, and stop with the word "shit", some people tend to overuse it.

I think they say "evidence has been tampered with" simply because the crash site is not absolutely 100% untouched. So it can mean anything from moving some non-trivial debris to piling some bodies/belongings, or even stealing items. Or someone thought he'd be helpful, that kinda thing.

[QUOTE=Kite_shugo;45476728]How many bodies were missing from the actual count from the crash and sent to the Netherlands? This investigation has become a nightmare born from another nightmare.[/QUOTE] i mean they had people falling out of the sky for miles around the plane, a town some 3 miles from the crash site had a person fall through its roof this whole area is just horrifically covered in bodies that frankly some probably have been scavanged by animals by now if they haven't been found

[QUOTE=Bat-shit;45477696]I think they say "evidence has been tampered with" simply because the crash site is not absolutely 100% untouched. So it can mean anything ranging from moving some non-trivial stuff to piling some bodies/belongings or even stealing items. Someone thought he'd be helpful, etc.[/QUOTE] There was also reports of looting. It would make sense in some ways (albeit totally immoral) to loot the plane for the more expensive electronics, mechanics. Also Aluminium is pretty expensive. People might have tried to cut bits up and drive it away then decide to leave pieces because they couldn't move it, were stopped or had a change of heart. In a free for all like that, during a war people might not think about the repercussions of taking what they think is scrap.

[QUOTE=Bat-shit;45477696]I think they say "evidence has been tampered with" simply because the crash site is not absolutely 100% untouched. So it can mean anything from moving some non-trivial debris to piling some bodies/belongings, or even stealing items. Or someone thought he'd be helpful, that kinda thing.[/QUOTE] well in article first lines say sources said that "tampering" was going as far as bringing in other plane's parts. Soo i'd say they actually try to accuse here something bigger.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45477719]well in article first lines say sources said that "tampering" was going as far as bringing in other plane's parts. Soo i'd say they actually try to accuse here something bigger.[/QUOTE] No doubt it is/will be spun in such a way which makes the rebels look like they are purposely doing it to make the investigation more difficult, there by making them more suspicious. When in reality it is more likely looting or moving bits to recover bodies.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45477719]well in article first lines say sources said that "tampering" was going as far as bringing in other plane's parts. Soo i'd say they actually try to accuse here something bigger.[/QUOTE] Yeah, I don't believe Putin or the [i]entirety[/i] of Russia is to blame..

[QUOTE=Bat-shit;45477785]Yeah, I don't believe Putin or the [i]entirety[/i] of Russia is to blame..[/QUOTE] Ugh, what?

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45477793]Ugh, what?[/QUOTE] Good question, I shall direct it to the poster below me.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45477793]Ugh, what?[/QUOTE] Maybe he's referring to this; from the original MH17 thread? [thumb]http://files.1337upload.net/karimatrix-86fca7.jpg[/thumb] But yeah; I wanted to ask you if Putin has said anything publicly about the Russian stance on the whole matter?

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45476755]Scattering parts of other aircraft??? Are you kidding me? [B]SuperSensationalist [/B]Thread Title by the way. BBC says they have "sources" even thought soo far only Malaysian experts are wokring on crashsite. Oh my god, you people actually going to believe that one, don't you.[/QUOTE] you should stop talking it makes you look like a total fool

[QUOTE=Kite_shugo;45477878]Maybe he's referring to this; from the original MH17 thread? [thumb]http://files.1337upload.net/karimatrix-86fca7.jpg[/thumb] But yeah; I wanted to ask you if has Putin said anything publicly about the Russian stance on the whole matter?[/QUOTE] Russian Goverment supported UN declaration and as far as i know and called for cease fire and independand investigation with ICAO's supervision, we also supported idea that Malaysia and Netherlands took leading role in process and we have nothing against their ways. There are plenty of articles on those.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45476824]That is incredibly relevant to topic.[/QUOTE] Russia hasn't had a good name since Catherine.

I am incredibly interested in what the black boxes contain. Too bad it will probably take a long time to analyze though.

[QUOTE=Orkel;45478068]I am incredibly interested in what the black boxes contain. Too bad it will probably take a long time to analyze though.[/QUOTE] Actually it's been reported it's going to be two days and not more.

[QUOTE=Orkel;45478068]I am incredibly interested in what the black boxes contain. Too bad it will probably take a long time to analyze though.[/QUOTE] Heard on the news earlier that the results should be released tomorrow.

Why isn't karimatrix perma'd yet?

[QUOTE=GoldenDargon;45478782]Why isn't karimatrix perma'd yet?[/QUOTE] Hes not resorting to personal insults like other posters. Hes posting valid and rational points, questioning the quality of the evidence. Just because his points differ from yours doesn't mean he should be banned.

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;45478810]Hes not resorting to personal insults like other posters. Hes posting valid and rational points, questioning the quality of the evidence. Just because his points differ from yours doesn't mean he should be banned.[/QUOTE] I wasn't aware continuously shitposting opinions and baseless claims from state-run media sources and nationalist commentators like a rabid animal working for the Kremlin constituted "posting valid and rational points and questioning the quality of evidence". Must have been a meeting or something I wasn't invited to.

[QUOTE=Govna;45479022]I wasn't aware continuously shitposting opinions and baseless claims from state-run media sources and nationalist commentators like a rabid animal working for the Kremlin constituted "posting valid and rational points and questioning the quality of evidence". Must have been a meeting or something I wasn't invited to.[/QUOTE] Thats quite the zinger! I like what you did there, accusing him of shitposting and posting invalid arguments while comparing him to a rabid animal and all the while still not actually addressing his point! He has several times quoted sources from independent surveys and the American disclosure on the matter, while disproving the various twitter and youtube sources you see floating around. Don't worry though. You got a zinger

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;45479149]Thats quite the zinger! I like what you did there, accusing him of shitposting and posting invalid arguments while comparing him to a rabid animal and all the while still not actually addressing his point! He has several times quoted sources from independent surveys and the American disclosure on the matter, while disproving the various twitter and youtube sources you see floating around. Don't worry though. You got a zinger[/QUOTE] It's quite the impasse when someone provides links proving something and that person ignores it with something else and vice-versa happens, you know. [editline]23rd July 2014[/editline] "Quite the zinger!" Did you read Noss' thread on GD or something, stop being condescending.

[QUOTE=Govna;45479022]I wasn't aware continuously shitposting opinions and baseless claims from state-run media sources and nationalist commentators like a rabid animal working for the Kremlin constituted "posting valid and rational points and questioning the quality of evidence". Must have been a meeting or something I wasn't invited to.[/QUOTE] Well perhaps he should be educated further on how to provide proper sources or how to search for more truthful news articles rather than just banning him. Ignorance is one thing, failing to address it is another

[QUOTE=Gwoodman;45479167]It's quite the impasse when someone provides links proving something and that person ignores it with something else and vice-versa happens, you know. [editline]23rd July 2014[/editline] "Quite the zinger!" Did you read Noss' thread on GD or something, stop being condescending.[/QUOTE] Apologies, I have not read that thread. I tend to avoid GD, the forum being organised by date created rather than last reply makes it inconvenient.

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;45479149]Thats quite the zinger! I like what you did there, accusing him of shitposting and posting invalid arguments while comparing him to a rabid animal and all the while still not actually addressing his point! He has several times quoted sources from independent surveys and the American disclosure on the matter, while disproving the various twitter and youtube sources you see floating around. Don't worry though. You got a zinger[/QUOTE] Awesome! Thanks for pointing all this out to me! I'm sure he appreciates you continuing to defend his factually-incorrect opinions in every thread about this issue, whether he's claiming Yanukovych wasn't corrupt and leaning heavily from his early days in favor if the Russians (hint: he was, on both accounts) or that the antiprotest law he had hastily and quietly passed back in January with the help of the KPU wasn't an enabling act (being allowed to imprison people without representation in court for 15 years for "mass demonstrations" isn't antidemocratic at all; neither is limiting their internet usage or demanding they show "respect for the courts"). Have a capital day, my good chum!

[QUOTE=sloppy_joes;45477357]Wasn't the aircraft hardcore looted? Maybe it wasn't deliberate interfering with the investigation, but instead some people stealing phones and taking plane parts for scrap and such.[/QUOTE] This is how I'm seeing it. I wouldn't expect them to seriously try to cover anything up what would that achieve anyway?

[QUOTE=joshdasmif;45479190]Well perhaps he should be educated further on how to provide proper sources or how to search for more truthful news articles rather than just banning him. Ignorance is one thing, failing to address it is another[/QUOTE] We have addressed it, and we've gotten nowhere. Seriously, if you have any ideas on how to fix him, we're all ears.

[QUOTE=karimatrix;45477585]First of all. I do not see how article in OP is by any means is[B] truth[/B] It simply presents idea that BBC have "some sources" saying that there was tempering with evidence, not accounting for a fact that damn thing fell down in war zone, and how it was mentioned before, got plenty of citizen access before rebels seized area and attempted to prevent more people from wandering around debree, taking pics and picking up stuff. Secondly, like i said, thread's title, consists of way sensationalist figure of speech. This is no 'tampering of Evidence' This is a mere "BBC Sources - Tampering of Evidence. Also, if we'd look in article ourselfs, i'd say it's portion dedicated to mention of such "tampering" takes only five lines of text out of whole article wich basically narrowly recollects all events thus far. Seriously, here is whole except where sources or tempering is even mentioned atleast Five lines of text without any solid confirmation can be considered vital credible info? Not really. Also, i would like to mention that i am the one here who for some reason asked to stop posting, while i merely asked politely to notice article rather then start debate over myself. but i guess you saw the reaction, i mean, i hope you do.[/QUOTE] My favourite thing about this post is that you say the evidence wasn't tampered with and in the same post you basically say that it was.