Russia-China ties 'guarantee world peace' and 'new world order' - Polidicks

[QUOTE=smeismastger;40020309]You could ask why anyone needs Western NATO? It's not like Russia and his friends are going to bust through the Fulda gap at any moment now for the last 20 years. Not that they could stop them anyway, they don't even have the resources to guard Iceland's airspace these days and are begging non-nato countries to do it for them.[/QUOTE] huh Iceland doesn't even maintain an airforce (The US handed over Kleflavik because there was going to be peace) and yes the Russians could be stopped by basically the entire European continent without US help.

[QUOTE=Zeneros;40026495]I'm already starting to have the old world blues[/QUOTE] Quickly, let's go to the big em- ehh, big mountain.

They could celebrate the newly established alliance by talking some reason into North Korea.

This can only lead to war [b] Fuel Of War [/b] huehuehue

illuminati confirmed

[QUOTE=cqbcat;40020553]Supposedly, China actually thinks lowly of Russia. This 'alliance' is probably more economical than political. Probably because Russian and Chinese government repress political freedom on their own citizens.[/QUOTE] Its more political than economic. They want the economic ties to catch up to the political ties. Xi Jinping made a statement earlier praising ties between the countries and he proposed military ties.

[QUOTE=Marbalo;40028126]that's debatable[/QUOTE] Let's say all countries bordering Russia except Finland and the Baltic States allow free passage. They'd have to go through the mountains of Norway (or could cut through Finland and Sweden and face their militaries), go through Poland and then Germany (!) Smash through Georgia to reach Turkey in the Caucasus. It's not feasible really.

[QUOTE=Zambies!;40028162]Let's say all countries bordering Russia except Finland and the Baltic States allow free passage. They'd have to go through the mountains of Norway (or could cut through Finland and Sweden and face their militaries), go through Poland and then Germany (!) Smash through Georgia to reach Turkey in the Caucasus. It's not feasible really.[/QUOTE] Well if it adds anything the chief of Sweden's armed forces said his country wouldn't last a week against a Russian attack.

[QUOTE=Marbalo;40028355]well, the modern finnish and[B] swedish armed forces[/B] are fairly undersized and if russia doesn't manage to beat them strategically, they will surely succeed numerically. [/QUOTE] A Swedish general stated that Sweden would only be able to defend itself for [B]1[/B] week in case of an invasion. Our Royal Swedish Academy of War Sciences wrote a report which confirmed his statements. :(

[QUOTE=Marbalo;40028355]well, the modern finnish and swedish armed forces are fairly undersized and if russia doesn't manage to beat them strategically, they will surely succeed numerically. keep in mind that the infamous defeat during the winter war does not in any way play a factor here. smashing through georgia shouldn't even be an issue, the reason the georgian war was such a clusterfuck was because officers attempted to combine soviet tactics (which were basically; flatten the shit out of everything) and at the same time ordered their troops to exercise restraint due to all the civilian casualties which further tarnished russia's reputation. it was a strategical disaster. i assume we are talking about a hypothetical case of something bordering a world war three scenario, only without the nukes. which means civilian casualties aren't much of a concern thus russia should be able to steamroll georgia and move unto turkey in no time, and with all due respect to turkey, they shouldn't pose much of a threat. the real battle here would be against poland, germany, france and the UK. which is where it actually gets even in terms of military capability. i wouldn't say europe would be able to hold off russia on its own, especially with all the recent military reforms medvedev and putin have been passing lately. one thing i do know is that a war on such a scale wouldn't end well for either side.[/QUOTE] Considering that Russian military expenditure is dwarfed by European expenditure, and that European forces would be able to match Russian manpower, and that most European (and I would imagine the same for Russia) forces still have the plans for a just such a fight, it would probably a bloody meat grinder of a stalemate. The EU is also the wealthiest organisation in the world (wealthier than the US), so it also has the funds to go the distance. Hell, there's even the chance of Canada, Australia and New Zealand chipping in due to the Commonwealth.

[QUOTE=Camundongo;40028513]Considering that Russian military expenditure is dwarfed by European expenditure, and that European forces would be able to match Russian manpower, and that most European (and I would imagine the same for Russia) forces still have the plans for a just such a fight, it would probably a bloody meat grinder of a stalemate. The EU is also the wealthiest organisation in the world (wealthier than the US), so it also has the funds to go the distance. Hell, there's even the chance of Canada, Australia and New Zealand chipping in due to the Commonwealth.[/QUOTE] Russia could cut off oil supplies to European countries, though they must have their own supplies reserved.

[QUOTE=laserguided;40028596]Russia could cut off oil supplies to European countries, though they must have their own supplies reserved.[/QUOTE] Most smart countries have a reserve for that kind of emergency. This is all hypothetical, and the variables of this are really different so it was just some stupid shit kicked off by Smeis

china and russia working togather? crap it really is a new cold war... [editline]24th March 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Swebonny;40028431]A Swedish general stated that Sweden would only be able to defend itself for [B]1[/B] week in case of an invasion. Our Royal Swedish Academy of War Sciences wrote a report which confirmed his statements. :([/QUOTE] well thats probably because in the event of any russian invasion Sweden would be cut off from europe by land almost instantly, same with your neighbor norway, assuming its a push across europe they could rapidly take control of the waters between sweden and mainland europe, so its just a problem of geography, but i do guess they have bridges that connect across the baltic so its up in the air [editline]24th March 2013[/editline] kinda sucks that restarting cold war tensions is more important than say... improving the conditions enviromentally, socially, and economicly of their own countries, i mean russia hads a bit of a head start on the social reforms, but now theyre turning communist again with premier putin in command, china's pollution problem dwarfs anything ever unleashed by the united states, and their groundwater might as well be radioactive with all the runoff from various industrial mines and factories, russia has at least tried to clean up some of their soviet era chemical dumps.

[QUOTE=Sableye;40029072]but now theyre turning communist again with premier putin in command[/QUOTE] putin is in power through rather questionable methods but russia is definitely not communist

State capitalism at the most.

[QUOTE=Swebonny;40028431]A Swedish general stated that Sweden would only be able to defend itself for [B]1[/B] week in case of an invasion. Our Royal Swedish Academy of War Sciences wrote a report which confirmed his statements. :([/QUOTE] A week is not so bad. If Argentina ever decides to invade Uruguay we will run out of bullets after seven hours of continuous fire.

[QUOTE=Eudoxia;40029338]A week is not so bad. If Argentina ever decides to invade Uruguay we will run out of bullets after seven hours of continuous fire.[/QUOTE] And then Brazil would kick Argentina's teeth in. Chile too. And the US/UK would probably get in it just for fun.

[QUOTE=Zambies!;40029530]And then Brazil would kick Argentina's teeth in. Chile too. And the US/UK would probably get in it just for fun.[/QUOTE] The US forgets there's something south of Mexico and Cuba a lot of the time. Save when Chavez makes noise. And now that's gone.

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;40029541]The US forgets there's something south of Mexico and Cuba a lot of the time. Save when Chavez makes noise. And now that's gone.[/QUOTE] Made*

[QUOTE=Emperor Scorpious II;40029541]The US forgets there's something south of Mexico and Cuba a lot of the time. Save when Chavez makes noise. And now that's gone.[/QUOTE] The UK probably would though. We'd even bring them a taste of the Falklands, namely the Royal Marines stationed on it. And they'd be pissed, mainly because they got stationed on the Falklands.

I'd post a beautiful assortment of Ron Paul images, but I think they'd fall under meme posts, and I don't want to be banned. All I can say is TIME TO PANIC A WAVE OF COMMUNIST, LEAD-ENCRUSTED, SHODDILY MADE PRODUCTS WILL CRUSH US ALL

[QUOTE=laserguided;40029688]Made*[/QUOTE] "And now that's gone" Read the whole post.

Chinas claim on the Japanese islands and Russias support of this action is a scary flashback to the colonial times. It just reflects to me how much the world has changed, we now care about the smaller countries while back in the day it seemed larger nations could just grab whatever land were uncivilized.

[QUOTE=Black;40030862]Chinas claim on the Japanese islands and Russias support of this action is a scary flashback to the colonial times. It just reflects to me how much the world has changed, we now care about the smaller countries while back in the day it seemed larger nations could just grab whatever land were uncivilized.[/QUOTE] Except China hasn't "grabbed" anything, only stated a claim.

[QUOTE=laserguided;40028299]Well if it adds anything the chief of Sweden's armed forces said his country wouldn't last a week against a Russian attack.[/QUOTE]Finland would last for some hours, a few days at best. the only advantage we'd have would be our semi-mountainous and lake-filled terrain which would make it harder for ground forces to move around, but then again they'd probably airdrop most of the stuff to get around that. i'm not sure if our AA capablities would be enough to down a million transport planes i'm pretty sure if Russia ever invades we'll probably just surrender [QUOTE=Eudoxia;40029338]we will run out of bullets after seven hours of continuous fire.[/QUOTE]we'd run out of places to defend in seven hours

[QUOTE=Marbalo;40028355]well, the modern Finnish and Swedish armed forces are fairly undersized and if Russia doesn't manage to beat them strategically, they will surely succeed numerically. keep in mind that the infamous defeat during the winter war does not in any way play a factor here. [/QUOTE] Sweden? Sure, but Finland? Undersized? No, not yet atleast. Finland has quite large reservist force considering the size of the population, the thick forests and swamps on the eastern borders grants us a natural barrier against tank-rush tactics and some cover against air forces. The Finnish Defense Force has been stockpiling on man-held anti-tank launchers for quite some time just to double the trouble any hostile armored force that tries to push their way through. I recall there being 1-2 launchers for every infantry squad at the moment, not to mention that our country has the biggest artillery in Europe. However as of current we don't have nearly enough supplies to wage war for more than couple of months. But I think by the time when political situation deteriorates to the point that war is inevitable, we'd have stockpiled enough supplies. I'd think that the biggest chance of breakthrough for their forces would be in Lapland and push their way through there into Sweden and Norway. The game "Naval Warfare: Artic Circle" did this scenario and was fairly detailed when describing the ground combat, but then the story progresses and [sp]for some reason germany sides with russia[/sp] so take it as you wish.

good points. they might get through and conquer us, but we just might be able to make it hurt. a lot. and we have so many forests and other places to disappear in that after the invasion i wouldn't rule out the possibility of a long guerrilla war [QUOTE=smeismastger;40032229]the thick forests and swamps on the eastern borders grants us a natural barrier against tank-rush tactics and some cover against air forces.[/QUOTE]i've discussed this with an estonian pal a few times. he says that at least we have lakes, swamps and relatively mountainous regions while the russian panzer battalions can just roll through his flat country

[QUOTE=Joazzz;40032298]good points. they might get through and conquer us, but we just might be able to make it hurt. a lot. and we have so many forests and other places to disappear in that after the invasion i wouldn't rule out the possibility of a long guerrilla war i've discussed this with an estonian pal a few times. he says that at least we have lakes, swamps and relatively mountainous regions while the russian panzer battalions can just roll through his flat country[/QUOTE] Estonia's is sadly screwed regardless of what they do. Unless we get this Nordic Defence Alliance finally going. Then Estonia together with Norway, Sweden and Finland will become stronk. (Iceland can join too if he wants) We actually tried to do this thing back in the 30's, but Sweden was scared (as usual) and Estonia & buddies got Soviet Union'd.