• "I think women have vaginas; I think you call a person with a vagina a woman." Penny Arcade's Gabe s
    1,221 replies, posted
because some random wiki some peeps wrote is a totally reliable source for what's being discussed in this thread
French laws are pretty good on the matter I guess woman => born with tits and vag [B]OR[/B] underwent surgery that cannot be reversed, acts like a woman and feels like a woman man => same the other way around I don't really understand the fuss about Mike's tweet, how is it wrong exactly to assume a woman has a vagina? Sure, there are exceptions, but you'd be mad to deny this. I doubt his intentions were to taunt trans.
Seriously this is sad, this is a chance to educate people on trans issues and you're bitching eachother out, yes i would say what gabe did was wrong, however i just want an apology not a wave of people spamming priviledge checks like goddamn morons. The reason alot people arn't being accepting is because they're straight up uninformed. Reach out make connections just state things in a way that isn't so judgemental and things will go smoothly. Cispeople, this goes for you too, alot of transpeople are only hostile because they have been through abuse don't forget that.
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41118848]Seriously this is sad, this is a chance to educate people on trans issues and you're bitching eachother out, yes i would say what gabe did was wrong, however i just want an apology not a wave of people spamming priviledge checks like goddamn morons. The reason alot people arn't being accepting is because they're straight up uninformed. Reach out make connections just state things in a way that isn't so judgemental and things will go smoothly. Cispeople, this goes for you too, alot of transpeople are only hostile because they have been through abuse don't forget that.[/QUOTE] I really want to understand this topic because this comes up more and more everyday. However, everytime I, or someone else tries to debate it, or ask questions, or even just slightly disagree, we get called names, one could say we get verbally abused. I have no problem with LGTB people, yet I get treated like I'm some hateful nut. Also, I feel bad if you get abused verbally or physically, but you shouldn't act like a dick towards strangers. I come from quite a background too, yet I'm not, or atleast I try my hardest not to be an unpleasant person. Anyway, I'm out of this thread. Feels like talking to a brick wall and I'd just get banned eventually. Sorry if offended anyone, didn't mean to.
[QUOTE=Skelmech;41118438]just because she is both a feminist and writes for kotaku doesn't instantly make her "fucking retarded"[/QUOTE] This shit right here is why people have a problem with you. You jump to conclusions and put words into the mouths of people you are delusionally thinking as opposing you. Nowhere in the post you replied to did Pel imply he dislikes whoever that woman is because she is feminist, nowhere did he imply that he thinks she is a retard because she writes for Kotaku (to be honest, all their writers are lacking a chromosome or something). People are allowed to criticise women, feminist, transpeople, etc. You do know this right? And when they do criticise them, they are likely going to have reasons that aren't "but she woman bawwwwww".
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41118848]Seriously this is sad, this is a chance to educate people on trans issues and you're bitching eachother out, yes i would say what gabe did was wrong, however i just want an apology not a wave of people spamming priviledge checks like goddamn morons. The reason alot people arn't being accepting is because they're straight up uninformed. Reach out make connections just state things in a way that isn't so judgemental and things will go smoothly. Cispeople, this goes for you too, alot of transpeople are only hostile because they have been through abuse don't forget that.[/QUOTE] what are cispeople?
[QUOTE=goldenbuttocks;41118972]what are cispeople?[/QUOTE] You gender matches up with you physical appearence EDIT: wait shit, was he just fucking with me?
[QUOTE=goldenbuttocks;41118972]what are cispeople?[/QUOTE] A male who identifies as a guy, a female who identifies as a girl. Opposite of transgendered people.
[QUOTE=RichyZ;41119050]gender and sex being the same i.e. you are have a penis, and think you are a man trans being you have a penis, and think you're a woman[/QUOTE] Close, i would say that you think AS a woman
idk why it's such a hard thing to comprehend transgender peoples its not that hard.
[QUOTE=hexpunK;41118964]This shit right here is why people have a problem with you. You jump to conclusions and put words into the mouths of people you are delusionally thinking as opposing you. Nowhere in the post you replied to did Pel imply he dislikes whoever that woman is because she is feminist, nowhere did he imply that he thinks she is a retard because she writes for Kotaku (to be honest, all their writers are lacking a chromosome or something). People are allowed to criticise women, feminist, transpeople, etc. You do know this right? And when they do criticise them, they are likely going to have reasons that aren't "but she woman bawwwwww".[/QUOTE] People seem to be thinking that any sort of criticism about trans/gay people's character is also an insult about their sexuality, as if a trans/gay person could do no wrong, and that anyone who is against them has got to be a horrible bigot.
[QUOTE=Lambadvanced;41119091]People seem to be thinking that any sort of criticism about trans/gay people's character is also an insult about their sexuality, as if a trans/gay person could do no wrong, and that anyone who is against them has got to be a horrible bigot.[/QUOTE] Ok, why do you think that? Seems like a pretty big generalization, I for one, don't fall in that category and I'm sure many don't either.
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41119031]You gender matches up with you physical appearence EDIT: wait shit, was he just fucking with me?[/QUOTE] no i wasn't, it was a legitimate question. thank you and the other posters for answering it
[QUOTE=PelPix123;41118611]It all comes down to your definition of "woman." If you define "woman" as "person with a vagina" then all women have vaginas. If you define "woman" as "person that identifies as a woman." then not all women have vaginas. The two groups of people will never see eye to eye because they have fundamentally different definitions of "woman" that are both technically correct. The argument hasn't even advanced to ethicality because it's still stuck in a definitional difference. Think of it this way: the former group thinks that, if you put the brains of a male and female person in a jar, they lose their gender. The latter group thinks that they don't. [I]There's a fundamental disconnect here [B]that will never be resolved.[/B][/I][/QUOTE] Awesome post. I tend to categorize things in what I believe to be a more concrete manner, in that one's gender is determined by their sexr as opposed to what they believe their gender to be. That said, I do respect an individual for whatever gender they identify as, and put forth an effort to go against my natural inclination to categorize things as I do when it is requested respectfully by an individual that I do so.
Why did this thread explode all of a sudden?
[QUOTE=PelPix123;41118611]Think of it this way: the former group thinks that, if you put the brains of a male and female person in a jar, they lose their gender. The latter group thinks that they don't. [I]There's a fundamental disconnect here [B]that will never be resolved.[/B][/I][/QUOTE] Actually, the chromosomal differences in DNA would make the brains male and female.
I'm actually glad he called out Hernandes on her stupid comment. She used the "not all women have vaginas" as an excuse to slag off on the game, when it was obviously about anatomy.
[QUOTE=dennistrane;41119167]Why did this thread explode all of a sudden?[/QUOTE] Because it's one of those things that people are strongly opinionated about.
[QUOTE=dennistrane;41119167]Why did this thread explode all of a sudden?[/QUOTE] What do you get when the general population of a popular website clashes with an ultra-minority discriminated against by just about everyone, even some of the more tolerant people there are?
[QUOTE=dennistrane;41119167]Why did this thread explode all of a sudden?[/QUOTE] probably because the topic affects alot of people
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41119136]Ok, why do you think that? Seems like a pretty big generalization, I for one, don't fall in that category and I'm sure many don't either.[/QUOTE] A lot of the posters you see in these kinds of threads (I've seen Skelmech at it a lot in the past, Dori a few times now, basically the regular social justice warriors) seem to act like any time someone critiques a gay/ transgender/ feminist person/ group, etc. they are bigoted assholes who think all gay/ transgender/ feminist people/ groups should be gassed or something. Even if the critism is totally valid they tend to handwave it as "lmao white privellaged kids talking about things they can't understand". (delete as appropriate) You actually seem like a reasonable person who is willing to try and educate the people who don't get the issues, rather than deriding them or just shitposting. You're pretty much the role model these discussions need.
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41119136]Ok, why do you think that? Seems like a pretty big generalization, I for one, don't fall in that category and I'm sure many don't either.[/QUOTE] Because that's what is going on duh
In all seriousness though I think it's a horribly misinformed topic. [editline]20th June 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=Lambadvanced;41119245]Because that's what is going on duh[/QUOTE] wow, someone else answered for you already...they were alot better at it too.
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41119266]Yo, let's be honest, ain't no black people on facepunch. In all seriousness though I think it's a horribly misinformed topic.[/QUOTE] A lot of these social issues are. I have a psychology student house mate, and while he gets gender identity issues, other social issues he didn't understand as much due to nobody ever really talking about them. Such as feminism, he only really knew it as the "feminazis killing the mens" straw feminism that the media and a scary amount of the internet paint it as. Though after a bit of explanation he gets it now :v:
[QUOTE=noneshallpass;41119266]Yo, let's be honest, ain't no black people on facepunch. In all seriousness though I think it's a horribly misinformed topic. [editline]20th June 2013[/editline] wow, someone else answered for you already...they were alot better at it too.[/QUOTE] Well I've been explaining myself a lot, sorry for not wanting to write a paragraph when I could just summarize it and make it mean the same thing.
EDIT: Moving on, any questions about trans issues at all?
[QUOTE=hexpunK;41119229]A lot of the posters you see in these kinds of threads (I've seen Skelmech at it a lot in the past, Dori a few times now, basically the regular social justice warriors) seem to act like any time someone critiques a gay/ transgender/ feminist person/ group, etc. they are bigoted assholes who think all gay/ transgender/ feminist people/ groups should be gassed or something. Even if the critism is totally valid they tend to handwave it as "lmao white privellaged kids talking about things they can't understand". (delete as appropriate) You actually seem like a reasonable person who is willing to try and educate the people who don't get the issues, rather than deriding them or just shitposting. You're pretty much the role model these discussions need.[/QUOTE] Max should also start banning the other side when they're shitposting Yes, MaxofS2D, you [I]ARE[/I] biased as all fuck, there's no way you can deny it. Otherwise you're literally encouraging shitposting and bad forum behavior. Is that what you want?
[QUOTE=PelPix123;41119539]It'd be great if it was that easy, but it isn't. Brain gender dimorphism exists due to in-utero hormone exposure. Even with chromosomes out of the question, brains still have genders. [/QUOTE] gender doesn't exist outside of our society
[QUOTE=hexpunK;41118964]This shit right here is why people have a problem with you. You jump to conclusions and put words into the mouths of people you are delusionally thinking as opposing you. Nowhere in the post you replied to did Pel imply he dislikes whoever that woman is because she is feminist, nowhere did he imply that he thinks she is a retard because she writes for Kotaku (to be honest, all their writers are lacking a chromosome or something). People are allowed to criticise women, feminist, transpeople, etc. You do know this right? And when they do criticise them, they are likely going to have reasons that aren't "but she woman bawwwwww".[/QUOTE] people have a problem with me? i rarely even post dude and i wasn't jumping to any conclusion or putting any words in anybody's mouth, i used pels terminology but that's it. i'm just commenting on what i've seen fp do whenever that specific writer is brought up please calm down, i mean no disrespect to anyone and i don't know why half the replys here have been so agressive and hostile to me.
[QUOTE=PelPix123;41119539]It'd be great if it was that easy, but it isn't. Brain gender dimorphism exists due to in-utero hormone exposure. Even with chromosomes out of the question, brains still have genders.[/QUOTE] gender dysphoria being caused by in-utero hormone exposure doesn't invalidate the idea that gender is a social construct though? it'd more just be that something in the brain prevents someone from learning their assigned gender later in life.
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